Immigration: House Bill Looks Dead

1104light

Yngvarr

I think it is political. Those people pouring in vote democrat.

You gotta back that up. I have been hearing that illegals are voting for over 5 years without seeing any proof of it actually ever happening.

1104light

Yngvarr

I think it is political. Those people pouring in vote democrat.

You gotta back that up. I have been hearing that illegals are voting for over 5 years without seeing any proof of it actually ever happening.

I agree with you here. However, it displays a lack of understanding of what is going on, and is a red herring.

What actually happens is this ...

1. Give entitlements to Hispanic illegal immigrants.
2. Collect votes from the LEGAL Hispanic community.

When a legal immigrant is living here and wants their illegal family members also to stay here, and food, shelter, and education benefits their illegal family members, the legal immigrants will send the vote to whoever gives their community the most benefits. If you take the benefits away from the illegals it hurts the hispanic community as a whole (since now they can't send free food back to across the border and need to actually purchase food).

patterico.com...

nypost.com...

You will lose this argument all day every day because the facts are not on your side.

OccamsRazor04

1104light

Yngvarr

I think it is political. Those people pouring in vote democrat.

You gotta back that up. I have been hearing that illegals are voting for over 5 years without seeing any proof of it actually ever happening.

I agree with you here. However, it displays a lack of understanding of what is going on, and is a red herring.

What actually happens is this ...

1. Give entitlements to Hispanic illegal immigrants.
2. Collect votes from the LEGAL Hispanic community.

When a legal immigrant is living here and wants their illegal family members also to stay here, and food, shelter, and education benefits their illegal family members, the legal immigrants will send the vote to whoever gives their community the most benefits. If you take the benefits away from the illegals it hurts the hispanic community as a whole (since now they can't send free food back to across the border and need to actually purchase food).

patterico.com...

nypost.com...

You will lose this argument all day every day because the facts are not on your side.

Quite true. I've worked in the construction field where 80% of the workers were illegal and the others shared a few SS numbers. They stayed 5-8 in a 3br home and pooled their income to send home so mamacita kept her nice hacienda and upper-class status. The employer was complacent and party to this- I have seen the payroll records. 8 employees under one social earning 95000 annually; more than enough to cover the home they were in and send things across the border and 95000 as a specialty construction expert isn't unheard of in California.

reply to post by abecedarian


Yes, and those 8 people aren't the ones voting, it's the legal hispanic community that does have the right to vote. And they will vote for whoever gives the illegal hispanics the most free benefits as the illegals and legals are very entwined socially and usually the illegals have family members here.

Give them freebies.
Let them keep coming across the border.
Get votes.

Not all is lost:

Instead, reformers are likely to focus on another possibility: House Republicans could roll out a series of piecemeal bills, including border security measures and citizenship for just the “Dreamers” (which House GOP leaders support). If such things were to pass, it’s possible the House and Senate (with its comprehensive bill) could get to conference negotiations, an outcome some reformers want.

So instead of one swift thrust they will ease it in.

Even if amnesty doesn't happen now I'm sure TPTB will make it happen when they feel it is the right thing to do.

Illegals ARE voting!!!!

Night Star

1104light

Yngvarr

I think it is political. Those people pouring in vote democrat.

You gotta back that up. I have been hearing that illegals are voting for over 5 years without seeing any proof of it actually ever happening.

daskakik
Not all is lost:

Instead, reformers are likely to focus on another possibility: House Republicans could roll out a series of piecemeal bills, including border security measures and citizenship for just the “Dreamers” (which House GOP leaders support). If such things were to pass, it’s possible the House and Senate (with its comprehensive bill) could get to conference negotiations, an outcome some reformers want.

So instead of one swift thrust they will ease it in.

Even if amnesty doesn't happen now I'm sure TPTB will make it happen when they feel it is the right thing to do.

They have to. If the Republicans do not cater to illegals they will never win another election. Obama proved that.

reply to post by OccamsRazor04

Well sure thay can do it, since they have done it before but, maybe they can find some way to stall and then run on that on 2016. That would be something worth watching.

daskakik
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

Well sure thay can do it, since they have done it before but, maybe they can find some way to stall and then run on that on 2016. That would be something worth watching.

You mean run on amnesty in 2016?

No amnesty for lawbreakers, period.

reply to post by Bassago

Hate to break it to you but that is your opinion and your opinion doesn't matter when it comes to votes.

The republicans had no problem handing out amnesty in 1984.

daskakik
reply to post by Bassago

 

Hate to break it to you but that is your opinion and your opinion doesn't matter when it comes to votes.

The republicans had no problem handing out amnesty in 1984.

edit on 22-9-2013 by daskakik because: (no reason given)

It was wrong then too. I know my opinion doesn't matter to the criminals in DC and if they (republicans) thought it would win them the elections they'd be all over it in a hot minute. It's still wrong and a crime to illegally enter this country.

Do you believe illegal entry into the US is not a crime? Do you support amnesty for illegals? Just asking.

Bassago
Do you believe illegal entry into the US is not a crime?

It is now illegal because the government made it illegal and this means that they have the power to grant amnesty.

Do you support amnesty for illegals? Just asking.

I don't care one way or the other.

reply to post by daskakik


Fair enough.
Thanks for your input on this.

daskakik
reply to post by Bassago

 

Hate to break it to you but that is your opinion and your opinion doesn't matter when it comes to votes.

The republicans had no problem handing out amnesty in 1984.

edit on 22-9-2013 by daskakik because: (no reason given)

The question is WHY should amnesty be given to people who are breaking the law, making it difficult for those who wish to come here legally?

I can give you the reason why this is a bad idea.

We are basically running into a situation where whoever gives the most freebies wins the election. This means any party that wants to win will have to give out more than the guys did 4 years earlier. We are already bankrupting ourselves paying for the entitlements we have already.

It's a race to the bottom and the winner gets to mortgage away our children's financial future.

Dunno why anyone has to bother illegal immigrate seeing as them seem to hand out greencards like sweeties (for americans thats candy) as i got offerd one under EB1 or 2 (i forget) by a big pharma company without asking lol Never took it up as rather claw my eyes out than live there but if i can get one it cant be that hard !

OccamsRazor04
The question is WHY should amnesty be given to people who are breaking the law, making it difficult for those who wish to come here legally?

First off, amnesty does not help or hinder those that seek legal entry. The legal quotas are met regardless of the number of illegals getting across.

We are basically running into a situation where whoever gives the most freebies wins the election.

Would that situation be any different if these freebies were given to those who don't support the illegals? Seems to me that the problem is a little deeper than just illegal immigration.

daskakik

OccamsRazor04
The question is WHY should amnesty be given to people who are breaking the law, making it difficult for those who wish to come here legally?

First off, amnesty does not help or hinder those that seek legal entry. The legal quotas are met regardless of the number of illegals getting across.

We are basically running into a situation where whoever gives the most freebies wins the election.

Would that situation be any different if these freebies were given to those who don't support the illegals? Seems to me that the problem is a little deeper than just illegal immigration.

The quota would be higher for legal entry if we did not have such a problem with illegal entry.

A hypothetical situatiuon of someone else getting freebies would also be bad. That segment of the population would have to be large enough to influence election outcomes. Regardless of what woulda coulda shoulda happen in some other situation, the situation we have now is the hispanic community being given freebies to buy votes. I would say other segments are also in this boat, that doesn't mean this problem should not be addressed. The problem is if you address it you lose the election.

crazyewok
Dunno why anyone has to bother illegal immigrate seeing as them seem to hand out greencards like sweeties (for americans thats candy) as i got offerd one under EB1 or 2 (i forget) by a big pharma company without asking lol Never took it up as rather claw my eyes out than live there but if i can get one it cant be that hard !

edit on 22-9-2013 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)

edit on 22-9-2013 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)

Because you most likely are not an unskilled worker with no education and no means to support yourself. If you were, you wouldn't have been offered a green card.

OccamsRazor04
The quota would be higher for legal entry if we did not have such a problem with illegal entry.

Actually, it seems that I was wrong and that the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 did away with quotas, which means that illegals do not affect legals at all.

A hypothetical situatiuon of someone else getting freebies would also be bad.

Of course it would, that was my point.

daskakik

OccamsRazor04
The quota would be higher for legal entry if we did not have such a problem with illegal entry.

Actually, it seems that I was wrong and that the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 did away with quotas, which means that illegals do not affect legals at all.

A hypothetical situatiuon of someone else getting freebies would also be bad.

Of course it would, that was my point.

edit on 22-9-2013 by daskakik because: (no reason given)

I am currently involved in legal immigration. I can 100% guarantee you that illegal immigration does effect legal immigration.

Well I am glad we both agree it's wrong no matter who is getting freebies in exchange for votes. The Hispanic community is in that situation. We both agree it's wrong. Amnesty is a step in the wrong direction. I would perhaps be in favor of Amnesty with the caveat that anyone receiving amnesty is ineligible to vote or receive any benefits or assistance for 10 years.