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An Important Message - An Attempt To Get You To See The Danger That Is Staring Us All In The Face

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posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 12:29 PM
reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn

I take it you did not get the GOP memo did you? it is going to die or the US will default on the Debit so it is a win win Obama care dies or the US dies, from the link , in part

House votes to fund government, gut Obamacare
By Michael O’Brien , Political Reporter, NBC News

The House approved legislation on Friday to keep the government open past Sept. 30, but also to eliminate funding for "Obamacare."
The vote marked an opening gambit by the GOP just 10 days before the deadline at which the government will run out of money, causing a myriad of federal services to cease. The provision gutting health care reform was intended to mollify conservatives who have vowed not to fund the government unless the landmark law is eradicated.
But the measure faces almost certain doom in the Senate, where Democrats have said they would vote to restore funding for the Affordable Care Act. And even if they were to fail, President Barack Obama has flatly promised to veto the bill.
Advertise | AdChoices

The posturing by the Republican-controlled House means Washington now faces a narrow window of opportunity to reach an ever-elusive consensus over how to continue government operations, and avoid a politically-costly shutdown.

Speaker of the House John Boehner, R-Ohio, talks to reporters about the deadline to fund the government and the fight among House Republicans, on Capitol Hill in Washington, Thursday, Sept. 19, 2013.

If no resolution is reached, a shutdown threatens to harm the economy and place scores of government workers out of work for an undetermined period of time. Wall Street appeared unconcerned by the developments, though, expecting lawmakers to reach an 11th-hour accord as they have in virtually every previous showdown.
it is about time they start playing hard ball, we do not need your Gov oversite nor your Obama forced care. We the People will do just fine with out you
edit on bAmerica/Chicagok201320 by bekod because: line edit

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 01:19 PM
reply to post by pikestaff

You will cling on to life when the man with the scythe starts looking for you.

Nah. Hes on my shoulder my whole life. So far so good.

Swing away Mofo...

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 01:31 PM
Anyone with a bit of sense saw this coming there`s a reason they are called baby boomers.
we all knew that those boomers were going to get old and start collecting social security and needing lots of medical care.
we all knew that the birth rate was dropping and that there would be fewer people working and paying for all those retired boomers.
we all knew that someday we would have an upside down pyramid of workers vs retired people.
we just kept kicking the can down the road and didn`t want to prepare and deal with it,we`ll cross that bridge when we get to it.well we are at that bridge now and we have no idea how we are going to cross it.
Wages are stagnant, the government is drowning in debt,health care costs are out of sight and the baby boomers are growing old,starting to retire and are going to be putting a huge strain on the health care system and the insurance companies
I hope i`m wrong but I think what`s going to happen is that insurance companies are just going to start letting people die because they`ll have no money to pay the bills.The only people who will be able to afford health care will be the rich.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 01:36 PM
reply to post by dagann

For someone who claims to be "ready" when grim reaper visits, i can only say you must prove it when the time comes. I'm from Missouri and words mean nothing whereas deeds mean everything.

Come live under a bridge with me for 7 years, I'll introduce you to death. Under there he is a constant companion.

I'm also somewhat offended with the hint of a eugenic attitude in you're response. Are elderly people now useless eaters? Should we look at them with disgust if they fail to fall on the sword and make life better for you? Actually. you "ARE" callous. Too callous.

No they are not useless. They feed the system. Most of them would be glad to move on, but the decision is out of their hands. The system will not allow them to die. If the machines beep, attendants hurry to "bring them back".

On the other hand there are a few who refuse to let go and gladly accept any treatment available to extend life. I have seen people get three chemos for the same cancer which remits and then returns. They died angry, clutching their sheets, mad that they had to go...

These treatments were extensive, expensive and ultimately only delayed the inevitable. The kids house is in hoc, savings gone, debt up to their necks for dear old dad.

Thats insane.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 01:42 PM
reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn

I have found some money for your health care system its here :-

The President's budget proposes that $1.242 trillion be appropriated to run the rest of the Federal government. About half, ($618 billion) is military spending

It seems that your Government is more interested in killing people from other nations than keeping it's own citizens alive.

Your Choice , you live or your country spends money on killing other countries people.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 01:45 PM

reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn

I have found some money for your health care system its here :-

The President's budget proposes that $1.242 trillion be appropriated to run the rest of the Federal government. About half, ($618 billion) is military spending

It seems that your Government is more interested in killing people from other nations than keeping it's own citizens alive.

Your Choice , you live or your country spends money on killing other countries people.

Well without killing all those people the U.S. economy would crash anyway because the petrodollar wouldn't be upheld. American citizens are screwed either way the government acts thanks to this wonderful fiat currency system that is dependent on other countries trading oil in the dollar.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 02:17 PM
reply to post by intrptr

If you live under a bridge that poses a threat to you and yours then i suggest you find another domicile. Also, people have the right and means to dictate their fate. Court recognized documents are available to those who wish to make the decisive decisions prior to the fact. If you find yourself caught in a situation where your wishes are ignored by officials due as a result of conflicting circumstances then i again say MAN UP, take control, make peace with your maker and end it all. Although doing so is illegal, Prosecuting you will be extremely difficult when you are six feet under.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 02:24 PM

I like Ron Paul's solution to the problem. He says:

"...There is only one solution that will lead to true health and true freedom: making health care more affordable..."

"... Ron Paul believes that only TRUE (emphasis mine) free market competition will put pressure on the providers and force them to lower their costs to remain in business. Additionally, Ron Paul wants to change the tax code to allow individual Americans to fully deduct all health care costs from their taxes..."

To read his solution (also discusses natural cures, big pharma corruption, etc.) in its entirety, click this link:

Abolishing the insurance industry would be a better start, imo. They are the reason why the law was passed in the first place, to keep them afloat.

The jokes on them when they quickly discover how they overestimated the income being earned by the people they want to force into this scam. The industry will collapse!!!

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 03:47 PM

Sorry about the callousness... I'm not that selfish about clinging to life. What makes elder people hang on and receive every new procedure multiple times to keep them alive like that?
edit on 19-9-2013 by intrptr because: spelling

I agree with you, but this is how death panels start you know.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 04:27 PM

reply to post by Flatfish

Oops, I left out the word "mandatory"...

OK, Mandatory Universal Healthcare Insurance, still a pig in lipstick, I don't suppose it was quite what they meant by "Promoting the General Welfare"when they wrote that constitution thingie.

Never mind being forced by law to do business with something or other

Your mistake was not leaving out the word mandatory. Your mistake was describing what we have under ObamaCare with the word "Universal." There is nothing universal about it. "Universal" means that everyone is covered via a public plan that has standards in place to insure a basic level of coverage for all. The GOP wanted nothing to do with universal healthcare, much the same way they wanted nothing to do with Medicare during it's creation and that's why, to this day, they're still looking for ways to dismantle it.

Furthermore, if making sure that all Americans have access to basic healthcare doesn't fall into the category of "promoting the general welfare," then maybe you could explain what that term is supposed to mean.

For 10 yrs. prior to my retirement, I sat on the board of trustees that oversaw 4 separate multi-employer benefit trust funds with over 500 million in assets and as it would happen, one of those trust funds was called "The Welfare Fund." I'll give you 3 guesses what that fund's liabilities were made up of. Give up yet? That was the healthcare fund who's sole purpose was to provide healthcare benefits for the beneficiaries of the trust.

The word "welfare" doesn't always mean that someone is getting free handouts from the government and the word "universal" has no place in describing our current healthcare plan under ObamaCare.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 04:43 PM

reply to post by Flatfish

Don't disregard the fact that those insurance companies are corporations which have to perform for their investors, considering that, where exactly do the issues arise?, maybe those corporation thingamabobadooles were unlawful in the U.S. for some reason or other till 1819.

Banks, Corporations, Hmmm....?.And now they have personhood and freedom of expression too, paying to influence political campaigns too.

Gee Whiz, we be in trouble.

Nullification through civil disobedience might work, after it gets painful enough for a majority to stop arguing and agree on anything....

If you're saying that corporations and their obligations to their shareholders are the problem, you won't get an argument out of me.

On the other hand, there's a couple of words you might want to try to find in our Constitution. I'll bet you can't find either one of them, (corporation or shareholder) anywhere in the document.

With respect to "nullification through civil disobedience," I'm not sure what you think it is that you're getting away with. Is this civil disobedience going to prevent me from paying the healthcare cost of the uninsured when they go to their county hospital emergency rooms for the most expensive treatment available?

We're already paying the cost for medical treatment of the uninsured via our state & county taxes, only problem is we're providing the most expensive care possible in emergency rooms when we could be providing them with cheaper, better care in the doctor's office. It's not like either system is going to make us exempt from these cost, is just a question of which method delivers the biggest bang for the buck.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 08:51 PM
reply to post by darkbake

I agree with you, but this is how death panels start you know.

Guess I am misunderstood. I have neighbors all around me that have passed away. I cared for them, rushed them to the hospital, watered their plants and took care of their pets while they were invalid. It was a long sad process, one which I made no prejudgments about. Just witnessed my friends slowly dying... so sad.

It is during this time with them that I got to see the inside view of how they are treated and the decisions made by them and for them. This included a healthy dose of denial and anger on the part of family members and "money" decisions on the part of the health care system they paid into (insurance). Geez what a nightmare.

I'm lucky, I don't have nor have I ever had insurance. When something comes to take me, I'll face it. I may not like it, but I'll accept it.

About "death panels" you mentioned, those decisions are made every day in the hospitals about whether to treat or not. The reality of it is a lot more callous than I am. Just relating it here so people can understand.

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 10:33 PM
reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn

"We live in a world where nothing is solved."

"There are broader ideas at work"

S + F

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 10:46 PM

"We live in a world where nothing is solved."

"There are broader ideas at work"

S + F

The most profound simple statements in this thread so far. Star for you!!

Here are some questions regarding the solution: If the poor are getting "free" healthcare and I'm still paying premiums ... who is paying for the "free" part of it, your other tax dollars? If the "value" of health care continues to increase and your slave salary doesn't rise to meet the cost, what's going to cover quality and scope of healthcare needs?

In terms of broader ideas being at work here ... what do you think they are? If we had better insight on the goals, it would be a lot easier to figure out their plans. There's not one rich guy out there that gives a squat about some poor dude's quality of care.
edit on 2092013 by Snarl because: Funny attribution of quoted text

posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 10:52 PM
reply to post by Flatfish

That was a teeny bit of sarcasm, sorry for the vagueness and your misunderstanding it.

To Promote the General Welfare as stated in the constitution is exactly what it means, and no, corporation and shareholder don't show up in that particular document anywhere because it was written to free the new country from those exact things.


posted on Sep, 20 2013 @ 11:49 PM
reply to post by randyvs

" I'd Rather be Dead , than in a Hospital Bed... "

The Very First Guy to try out his New Obamacare Coverage

posted on Sep, 21 2013 @ 12:14 PM
reply to post by Zanti Misfit

I got to say it's obvious they don't want us in bed. They do want us dead.

posted on Sep, 21 2013 @ 02:08 PM
reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn

I feel no shame in admitting that I am afraid for the well being of my country and countrymen. The healthcare issue is just a budding head on the giant Medusa that is threatening all of us. As soon as you start to attack one head, two more grow in its place. I believe that the fear I feel is healthy, and fortunately I still have excellent control of both of my urogenital sphincters; for now anyways.

My OP is a feeble attempt to get people to at least acknowledge the giant pink elephant in the room. It is near impossible to protect yourself from a danger you don’t see. Almost everyday I have someone come to me incensed that they are being denied their rights. The truth is that the people who scream the loudest about their rights are woefully ignorant of just what those right are.

Too many people in America are seriously misinformed about what is a right and what is an entitlement. There is no legal documentation anywhere, that I am aware of, that says it is the responsibility and the duty of the United States government to feed you, clothe you, provide you housing or provide you anything more than emergency medical care. Yet the majority of the American people think that the government is supposed to rescue them from every misfortune that comes their way. Lately we have seen how powerful and devastating Mother Nature can be. We have thousands of people that have recently had their entire world turned upside down. Many have lost everything that they owned. The world grieves with those that have lost so much and most all are willing to donate what they can, be it money, time or physical labors. The government has put aside funding to assist those that need help, but there is no law that says the government “has” to help you or anyone.

The biggest mistake that many Americans make is they think the government was established to take care of their individual and personal needs. It wasn’t, it doesn’t “have” to, and in more cases than not, it won’t. I feel sorry for the people that I have to tell almost daily that it is not the hospital’s responsibility, nor the government’s responsibility, to provide housing, food and custodial care for their sick or needy loved one. I wish I had one dollar for the number of times I have heard, “My (mother/father/sister/brother, etc) worked all their and life and paid into the system and now you are telling me it was for nothing!”

The first big mistake they make is they don’t know the difference between Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security. Most people think they are one and all the same. They are not one and all the same. Second big mistake they make is that they are clueless about who is “entitled” to what or what each covers. Again most people are woefully ignorant of what is a right and what is an entitlement. I encourage everyone to educate themselves and to do what they need to do to be able to provide for their family and loved ones, in case misfortune visits.

We have big problems in our country and I honestly believe none of us will weather this storm unscathed, but you are going to be in bigger trouble and things will be much more difficult for you, if you haven’t made plans and made provisions for your own needs. There are some that will not be able to do much for themselves, but if those of us that are able, take care of ourselves, we will have enough together to help those that can’t.

I don’t know the solution to our growing problems. I know that the finger in the dyke is not going to hold much longer. I believe that when the flood water subside, there will not be much left that will be recognizable. I hope enough people will see the danger and heed the warnings, so we will have salvaged enough that we can work together to build a better system.

posted on Sep, 21 2013 @ 08:27 PM
reply to post by Pinkorchid

Throwing more money into the system may not be such a good idea. Money is what corrupted the system and contributed to the downfall in the first place.

When I was a little girl, nobody in the area I lived, had health insurance. Only the people that had real money went to the hospital because they wanted to. It was common to hear someone speak of one of the wealthier members of the community going to hospital to get some rest, like they were on vacation. I thought of a hospital as a spa like place were just rich people went whenever they wanted to. The regular people went to hospital for surgeries, broken bones and getting stitched up. Almost everything else the local doctor managed when he came to the house.

My father was in the military. We travel with him from post to post. We rarely stayed at one post more than 2 years. When my mother became pregnant with the twins, she was looking at caring for and shipping around 4 children. She decided it was easier and better for us to stay in one place. My father continued to go wherever the Army sent him but we stayed put. My mother had always taken odd jobs whenever she could get them but now she had the opportunity to take night classes and she became a nurse. She got a nursing job on the local military base and became an employee of the federal government; which gave her the opportunity to enroll in the Blue Cross Blue Shield (BCBS)family.

Before Blue Cross Blue Shield became available to the common folk, hospitals were not for profit entities. They submitted their expense reports to the state and the state and federal government reimbursed them; it seemed to work well enough. When health insurance companies like BCBS came on the scene they competed with each other by luring the doctors to join their team. They took the most loved and respected and humble members of our community and turned them into mercenaries with a God complex. The rest is history.

Money cased this problem. Money is not the primo fix for our problems.

I might be wrong now.

But I don't think so,

posted on Sep, 21 2013 @ 08:59 PM



The baby boomers are now sucking those dollars back quicker than a Dyson vacuum picking up sand, and Blue Cross the all those super wealthy insurance companies have gone from spotting, to frank bleeding to hemorrhaging.

Same with pensions, with an aging population this is going to snowball. Very simply people living longer is terrible for the economy.

Its more like what to toss off a sinking ship really. A desperation.

But just look at all the mess we as a culture bought into. The small nuclear family, mom and dad both working, got to have a college education, my career and screw all else. Mom and dad both work got to have two cars ect.

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