Navy Yard shooting suspect reached out to vet hospitals for ‘psychological issues’

OrphanApology
Also in regard to schizophrenia, don't forget the shooter was 34. It is actually very RARE for a someone over the age of 30 to begin developing symptoms of this disease. Most of it happens from 15-30 with 18-25 being most common age range. It is also as the above author stated, a very obvious disease for people who speak to someone with schizophrenia. That no one noticed any real symptoms far before the incident is extremely fishy.

Also in regard to taking away the rights of people who are deemed mentally ill by the establishment, that's fine as long as they are in an institution. Taking away constitutional rights from someone before they have even committed a crime is not allowed. If someone is so crazy that they cannot have a gun or buy one, they should be either A. In a nuthouse or B. Under direct supervision. If someone is consistently doing crazy things and have trouble functioning normally, then that's a failure of a system to allow families and friends to report and get help for people.

It's kind of how I 100% believe that anyone who is not physically in prison should have their constitutional rights returned. If someone is such a danger that they cannot handle access to guns and voting, they should be in prison. There is a whole class of people who can no longer vote or protect themselves. Probation is just a funny little creation set out to ensure that tax paying citizens who aren't currently incarcerated are second class to the point of being able to vote in elections.

There probably were signs that had been dismissed, and if he were a loner then no one would have recognized them at all.

But what do you do with a sibling that exhibits full blown Schizophrenia? I'm talking about my experience with my father and brother. Legally I can't force him into direct supervision, it's not like I wouldn't though.

To get my brother into treatment requires going to family court in the state he lives and having to go through proving he is mentally unstable and not capable of living as a normal person. I have to prove his mental incompetence, and to do that requires me to force him to be tested again.

You can't force him to go to the doctor to get the proof required to have him go to court to prove his mental incompetence. And that's where we are as a society with laws. He knows very well that if he moved to where I live then he would be placed in care. But unfortunately he lives in another state.

Maybe I should go to his state and hold him against his will to transport him to my state? Then I would be breaking the law. It puts us in a terrible position as family members.

First of all I have to watch him go through a biological process that we have no control over and second, I have to constantly reassure him that the world is not trying to catch him and that he cannot change the weather with his mind. He really believed those hurricanes were his fault, because he thought he could do it.

How do you prove to a Schizophrenic that they don't have power to cause these things? Once a Schizophrenic gets it into their minds that they have to kill people to appease the voices, then that's what they are going to do.

reply to post by WarminIndy


That's the failure of the system. It's a difficult issue to fix because mental illness is over-diagnosed in people that aren't mentally ill and under-diagnosed in people that are. The system is set up around trying to turn a profit instead of handling and treating truly sick people.

The problem with the old system of locking people away is that people abused the system. They were locking women away for having affairs and suspected gays and lesbians of having same sex attractions.

Just to put into context: George Takei might have been put in a loony bin for being gay by his family.

It's definitely scary and there's not too many options when it comes to having really insane family members. The problem though, is that even when people get arrested for nutty behavior there's no system set up for mental health. The jails have replaced mental institutions in America. To me that would be the first place to start in fixing the problem, not taking away non-offending citizens constitutional rights.

It also comes back to the whole issue of trading freedom for security. In the end, you are safer in a free society even there is a risk that some of the people who also have freedom might be a danger. History proves that when there's a state system set up that takes all the rights away from the citizens at the promise of safety, the citizens become no safer. The reason? Crazy people just wind up running the government.

reply to post by OrphanApology


I know what you mean by over-diagnosed. I see people all the time say they are Bipolar, and yet never exhibit the mania that comes with it. So I question that. They don't know that it used to be called Manic Depressive. I think if someone gets a diagnosis, they really should investigate what it is instead of just taking someone's word for it.

I have seen these same people tell me they won't take the lithium for it, but rather would be prescribed the psychoactive drugs they then sell.

Public safety should be the number one concern and the laws should be created to treat people effectively without making them feel marginalized. The families themselves fall under the same scrutiny and marginalization, how many people do you know that can openly say they have a family member that is Schizophrenic without being ridiculed? Or even Schizophrenics themselves, they are very ridiculed for something they have no control over and then their families are forced to hide the condition.

I think that without the stigma and ridicule, more Schizophrenics would be treated. You haven't marginalized or ridiculed me for having a family member that is Schizophrenics, which I appreciate, but you can find forums full of it. And the media doesn't help when overexposing an individual. But at the same time, the media helps to cover up crimes of certain individuals who do have mental illnesses. It's like people feel they have to walk on eggshells in this country when it comes to mental illness.

I would imagine that this guy probably exhibited symptoms for a long time, but he most likely wasn't near any family who might recognize it. He sought treatment himself, so that means he probably was aware of what was going on. At 34 years-old, that's not late to be in the full grasp of Schizophrenia, and he probably was in a full blown episode at this time.

These people who believe in mind control probably never spent a day with a Schizophrenic who tells you constantly that he can hear your thoughts and that the walls are full of devices that will inform him who is his enemy. And they probably never had to spend hours and hours and hours in the same room with someone who believes that you and your siblings are conspiring against him if you leave the room. This is life with a Schizophrenic father.

So yep, mind control believers of MK Ultra, I've heard it all. As far as Schizophrenics are concerned, we are the enemy who is trying to control them and we are sending the vibrations into them. The voices told them we are the enemy. I hope people understand just what Schizophrenia is.

WarminIndy
reply to post by OrphanApology

 

I know what you mean by over-diagnosed. I see people all the time say they are Bipolar, and yet never exhibit the mania that comes with it. So I question that. They don't know that it used to be called Manic Depressive. I think if someone gets a diagnosis, they really should investigate what it is instead of just taking someone's word for it.

I have seen these same people tell me they won't take the lithium for it, but rather would be prescribed the psychoactive drugs they then sell.

Public safety should be the number one concern and the laws should be created to treat people effectively without making them feel marginalized. The families themselves fall under the same scrutiny and marginalization, how many people do you know that can openly say they have a family member that is Schizophrenic without being ridiculed? Or even Schizophrenics themselves, they are very ridiculed for something they have no control over and then their families are forced to hide the condition.

I think that without the stigma and ridicule, more Schizophrenics would be treated. You haven't marginalized or ridiculed me for having a family member that is Schizophrenics, which I appreciate, but you can find forums full of it. And the media doesn't help when overexposing an individual. But at the same time, the media helps to cover up crimes of certain individuals who do have mental illnesses. It's like people feel they have to walk on eggshells in this country when it comes to mental illness.

I would imagine that this guy probably exhibited symptoms for a long time, but he most likely wasn't near any family who might recognize it. He sought treatment himself, so that means he probably was aware of what was going on. At 34 years-old, that's not late to be in the full grasp of Schizophrenia, and he probably was in a full blown episode at this time.

These people who believe in mind control probably never spent a day with a Schizophrenic who tells you constantly that he can hear your thoughts and that the walls are full of devices that will inform him who is his enemy. And they probably never had to spend hours and hours and hours in the same room with someone who believes that you and your siblings are conspiring against him if you leave the room. This is life with a Schizophrenic father.

So yep, mind control believers of MK Ultra, I've heard it all. As far as Schizophrenics are concerned, we are the enemy who is trying to control them and we are sending the vibrations into them. The voices told them we are the enemy. I hope people understand just what Schizophrenia is.

I know what you mean by over-diagnosis. I was diagnosed as "bipolar" when I was younger and going through some difficult life events. What helped me was that I had no insurance so the doctor recommended me to the free clinic in the city for mental health issues. After sitting in that waiting room for eight hours I realized that I really wasn't bipolar but just going through hard times because of my parents. I was diagnosed by a schizophrenic who was there to pick up his medicine and a TRUE manic depressive who just happened to be on a high that day so felt like chiming in. Needless to say, I researched the issue and started working to quit alcohol, run, eat better, and be realistic in regard to my own ups and downs.

Most people aren't smart enough to not ridicule groups they deem different than themselves. People need to feel superior and so anything that moves them up slightly on the totem of totalitarianism makes them feel amazing. It's not just mental health that takes the blunt of the problem, it's everything. That's why I posted that link to psychohistory.com because it outlines how child abuse and war isn't a coincidental relationship.

Media Buries Psychiatric Drug Connection to Navy Shooter

Despite every indication that Navy Yard shooter Aaron Alexis was on SSRI drugs that have been linked to dozens of previous mass shootings, the mainstream media has once again avoided all discussion of the issue, preferring instead to blame the tragedy on a non-existent AR-15 that the gunman didn’t even use.

www.infowars.com...

This is a really interesting article about this drugged up nation and blaming a "mental disorder" as cause for violence instead of the drugs that make people wacky!

OrphanApology

WarminIndy
reply to post by OrphanApology

 

I know what you mean by over-diagnosis. I was diagnosed as "bipolar" when I was younger and going through some difficult life events. What helped me was that I had no insurance so the doctor recommended me to the free clinic in the city for mental health issues. After sitting in that waiting room for eight hours I realized that I really wasn't bipolar but just going through hard times because of my parents. I was diagnosed by a schizophrenic who was there to pick up his medicine and a TRUE manic depressive who just happened to be on a high that day so felt like chiming in. Needless to say, I researched the issue and started working to quit alcohol, run, eat better, and be realistic in regard to my own ups and downs.

Most people aren't smart enough to not ridicule groups they deem different than themselves. People need to feel superior and so anything that moves them up slightly on the totem of totalitarianism makes them feel amazing. It's not just mental health that takes the blunt of the problem, it's everything. That's why I posted that link to psychohistory.com because it outlines how child abuse and war isn't a coincidental relationship.

I didn't see the link, but I will look for it. Doctors now are saying that children who suffered abuse are on the same scale as soldiers with PTSD. That's frightening to think children suffer that greatly and very little is done about it.

I do think children with PTSD have grown up to become soldiers.

I am glad you learned what is wrong with you and took steps to correct it. I think we, as a society, need to start developing better support systems within our communities. At this point, our economy is so broke that mental health services are overwhelmed and challenged.

I also think our justice system needs to be overhauled. We have people in jails for stealing tennis shoes. That's a little much. Definitely our justice system is not designed for punishments to fit the crimes. I think we should have more community services for non-violent offenders.

If a person were to break into my home and steal my belongings, then he should be accountable for returning my belongings and compensating me, then he should do community service that I choose for him to do. It's really wasting a lot of money to keep him in jail for a year, feeding him for him to get out and do it again. But if he steals from a lot of people, let all those people decide what to do with him and if they want to pay for his keep.

Because really, that's what is happening. We are paying for their three meals a day and a bed for them to get out and keep doing it.

Violent offenders on the other hand, if someone were to harm me, then yes, they go to jail. But if they hurt me, I want to reserve the right to punch them in the face before sending them to prison. For someone to harm children, they need to be beaten in front of everyone. We need to let them know that we won't accept this.

The problem is that we are really taking care of them until they get out so they can do it again. If someone has done something so heinous that they get life in prison, keep them in prison.

OK, enough rant. So what can we do as a people to solve this problem?

reply to post by WarminIndy


There's nothing that we can do as a people to change things other than do a mass protest of taxes. Anything besides monetary protests have and will not work, now or in the past. What I just stated won't happen so the reality is that as a regular person there is nothing you can do to change the system or to make things better on a large scale. The monster that is government is too large and pervasive to be changed at this point.

The best thing you can do is to understand the past and understand yourself. Don't hit or sexually abuse any children you have and make sure no friends or family do either. Focus inward since it is impossible to change everything on the outside. Even if you don't have symptoms of a schizophrenic, having children might mean they do. Perhaps consider adopting if you choose to have a family. Just ideas.


The link doesn't work, just type Psychohistory.com into your search bar.

OrphanApology
reply to post by squarehead666

 

Drug induced psychotic episode indeed. I think this is used far more than people realize. Not to mention that there could be hybrid drugs that have an effect of making people angry, aggressive, violent, and hallucinate at the same time. Think of the angriest alcoholic you can think of mixed with a meth addict and throw in a nice '___' trip, hand the guy a gun and well...you get what I'm saying.

Drugs would be the easiest because if it was an unknown/experimental (not street drug) it would never show in a autopsy/investigation.

edit on 17-9-2013 by OrphanApology because: edit

Reading through the conversations on the various threads that come up when this kind of seemingly "unexplained" rage and aggression takes place, it is surprising to me that no one mentions Prednisone and/or the combination of Hydrocortisone & Florinef.

www.medscape.com...

Side affects of these drugs include intense rage and at times extreme psychological changes that are grossly, IMO, underestimated by the medical community at large. In the article from the link above it states that Prednisone and it's equivalent are becoming dangerously over prescribed and that the side effects should not be taken lightly.

I am speaking from personal experience as I have been married to a man who struggles with these side effects and the dismissive attitude of the medical community when it comes to the psychological aspects of long term steroid use.

Penny

pennylemon

OrphanApology
reply to post by squarehead666

 

Drug induced psychotic episode indeed. I think this is used far more than people realize. Not to mention that there could be hybrid drugs that have an effect of making people angry, aggressive, violent, and hallucinate at the same time. Think of the angriest alcoholic you can think of mixed with a meth addict and throw in a nice '___' trip, hand the guy a gun and well...you get what I'm saying.

Drugs would be the easiest because if it was an unknown/experimental (not street drug) it would never show in a autopsy/investigation.

edit on 17-9-2013 by OrphanApology because: edit

Reading through the conversations on the various threads that come up when this kind of seemingly "unexplained" rage and aggression takes place, it is surprising to me that no one mentions Prednisone and/or the combination of Hydrocortisone & Florinef.

www.medscape.com...

Side affects of these drugs include intense rage and at times extreme psychological changes that are grossly, IMO, underestimated by the medical community at large. In the article from the link above it states that Prednisone and it's equivalent are becoming dangerously over prescribed and that the side effects should not be taken lightly.

I am speaking from personal experience as I have been married to a man who struggles with these side effects and the dismissive attitude of the medical community when it comes to the psychological aspects of long term steroid use.

Penny

What you would call "dismissed by the medical community",

I would call "actively supressed".

Pharmaceuticals is up there with arms sales and oil for profit margins. They are in no rush to deal with the real drug problem. The "legal" drug lobby is far too powerful, and they have far too much money to throw around for anyone to do anything about it.
One of the major drawbacks of capitalist profits vs peoples welfare.

reply to post by OneManArmy


Indeed OneManArmy,

I unfortunately would have to agree with you here as far as suppression goes. I suppose I am speaking from a more personal standpoint, and wanted to point out the fact that the families and/or loved ones are essentially alone to subdue, counsel and basically keep, my husband in this instance, from hurting themselves or others.

My point here is that as soon as it's stated that the suspect was complaining of hearing voices many immediately think schizophrenia. Maybe it is the fact that I have been living with a person that has had many severe breaks with "reality" throughout the fifteen years we have been married that leads me to wonder why it's never mentioned.

Penny

pennylemon
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Indeed OneManArmy,

I unfortunately would have to agree with you here as far as suppression goes. I suppose I am speaking from a more personal standpoint, and wanted to point out the fact that the families and/or loved ones are essentially alone to subdue, counsel and basically keep, my husband in this instance, from hurting themselves or others.

My point here is that as soon as it's stated that the suspect was complaining of hearing voices many immediately think schizophrenia. Maybe it is the fact that I have been living with a person that has had many severe breaks with "reality" throughout the fifteen years we have been married that leads me to wonder why it's never mentioned.

Penny

And thank you for sharing, there is no better evidence for the "drug" conspiracy than personal testimony.
My best wishes for you in dealing with the situation life has dealt you, and I hope that one day this situation will either sort itself out, or you find a method of helping him control it.

pennylemon
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Indeed OneManArmy,

I unfortunately would have to agree with you here as far as suppression goes. I suppose I am speaking from a more personal standpoint, and wanted to point out the fact that the families and/or loved ones are essentially alone to subdue, counsel and basically keep, my husband in this instance, from hurting themselves or others.

My point here is that as soon as it's stated that the suspect was complaining of hearing voices many immediately think schizophrenia. Maybe it is the fact that I have been living with a person that has had many severe breaks with "reality" throughout the fifteen years we have been married that leads me to wonder why it's never mentioned.

Penny

Exactly, 100%.

Oh my goodness, hugs for you. That is very tough. When you took the vow "in sickness and in health" I don't think anyone told you it might include mental illness. You must be a very strong person to care about him enough to be with him through his breaks. Many Schizophrenics don't have family support at all and end up wandering the streets.

reply to post by OneManArmy


reply to post by WarminIndy


Thank you both for your kind words. The point I was hoping to make here as it relates to this case and others like it is that not only is there no safety net but there is really no net at all. I also was hoping to make it clear that the only cause for my husbands breaks are, as we finally pinned it down this year, the side effects of the medications he must take to live. He must take precise doses of hydrocortisone and flourinef for Addison's disease. These daily doses are small in comparison with not only prescribed ingestion of these types of steroids but when you combine that with possible over the counter topical hydrocortisone I can see how more and more people are suffering from these kinds of rages.

Every time I see something like this shooting I think, how hard it must have been for the families and that the warning signs are not only missed but out right ignored by most medical and law enforcement officials.

Penny

unphased
Funny, CNN seemed to know more about electromagnetic mind control in 1985 than they do now...

I've noticed that too. Once these super sciences and technologies are weaponized by clandestine agencies & black projects, they become fringe sciences and subjects that no body except conspiracy investigators talk about. What a strange coincidence, of which this world is increasingly full of!

8000 Americans have died from guns since the Sandy Hook massacre.

U - S - A! U - S - A!

reply to post by MisterMahound


MisterMahound,

I'm not going to try and downplay the fact that far to many lives are lost to this particular brand of violence. I am, however, unsure of how lobbing these kinds of statements back and forth will heal those that have lost loved ones or does anything to further the discussion. Are the only conversations worth having pertain only to what kind of weapon a person uses, or is it that we really cannot look at how a human being began to head down a path like this.

This is a huge part of the problem IMO and until we get past the politics and the one liners and get down to the why of it all we will never see an end to it. I'm not implying that there won't be maniacs of all sorts wreaking havoc in the world, but this particular type of rage and self destructiveness can in my opinion be stopped.

Sorry for the bit of a rant there,
Penny

unphased
Police: D.C. shooter said last month an individual sent three people to "keep him awake and send vibrations into his body."

Aaron Alexis -- the man authorities say is responsible for killing 12 people at the Washington Navy Yard -- told Newport, Rhode Island, police last month that an individual "had sent three people to follow him and to talk, keep him awake and send vibrations into his body," according to a police report.

Ok this is a little weird... However reading further, he allegedly goes into more detail.

According to that report, which is related to an investigation into a harassment complaint at a Marriott hotel in Newport, Alexis said he first heard the people "talking to him through a wall" at a Residence Inn in Middletown, Rhode Island, where he'd been staying. He packed up and went to an unidentified hotel on a Navy base in Newport where he heard the same voices talking to him.

He moved to a third hotel, the Marriott, according to the police report. There, Alexis first told authorities that the three individuals spoke to him through the floor and then the ceiling. Alexis said the individuals were using "some sort of microwave machine" that sent "vibrations through the ceiling, penetrating his body so he cannot fall asleep."

Has anybody ever heard a claim like this? Could this be the first real MSM reference to some sort of mind control program?

Perhaps these provide an answer:

Army site used to have a page on the technology:
web.archive.org...://call.army.mil/products/thesaur/00016275.htm

Still exists here...

Federation of American Scientists: Voice to Skull Devices
www.fas.org...


voice to skull devices

Definition/Scope:

Nonlethal weapon which includes (1) a neuro-electromagnetic device which uses microwave transmission of sound into the skull of persons or animals by way of pulse-modulated microwave radiation; and (2) a silent sound device which can transmit sound into the skull of person or animals. NOTE: The sound modulation may be voice or audio subliminal messages. One application of V2K is use as an electronic scarecrow to frighten birds in the vicinity of airports.

Acronym:

V2K

Military.com story:
www.military.com...

Wired story on the technology:
www.wired.com...

Wired story on the Army yanking the page down:
www.wired.com...

Washington Post story which mentions the same use of microwaves to project sound inside one's head:

www.washingtonpost.com...

Gibbs, the Marine Corps official who first funded Bitar, has a fondness for edgy ideas. A chemical engineer and longtime proponent of nonlethal weaponry, Gibbs funds other offbeat projects, such as Medusa, an attempt to develop a weapon that uses low-power microwaves -- believed to cause an audible buzzing in subjects' heads -- to make people think God is speaking to them. Another such weapon would use beams of energy to make people dizzy and lose their balance.

Possibly related...

csc.asu.edu...

reply to post by AlliumIslelily


All reports say that Alexis was an intelligent guy. If he suspected that he was having some sort of mental issue, whether it be questioning his own sanity or prolonged sleep troubles, then he would've sought help. Not a single thing says the guy was stupid. Because he was intelligent would mean that he would be very aware that what he said would be deemed crazy. The problem with the quote about the family history is that we lose all tone in how it was said. If he stated it defensively, then he was defending his own sanity. If he stated it in a puzzled tone, it could imply that he wasn't certain if he was going insane or if it was really happening. The fact that he sought help from the VA for sleep disturbance and other issues rather implies that, at least at that point, he was aware that he was potentially coming unhinged.

#4 presumes that the police aren't likely to be overloaded at the time. Overall, I think they got lazy because what they should have done was taken him into custody and delivered him to a psychiatric ward for observation. You're absolutely right. If the guy sounded like a paranoid schizophrenic and had a weapon on him, then they should have shown more due diligence in the matter. Considering that Alexis sought help for himself, I doubt that they would've had a hard time getting him to go. Or heck, they could've spun it as "let's take you somewhere where access to you will be more controlled and see if it continues". That's the thing that really upsets me about this. It could've been potentially prevented if those police officers had acted and 13 people would still be alive and with their families--including Alexis.

unphased
reply to post by OrphanApology

 

Check out the video in the OP, and look how far along this technology was almost 30 years ago.

Oh, this technology goes back much farther than you think! I will just simply say that someone very close to me who's now deceased (my father) was planted into Vietnam back in 1960 by his CO/Commanding Officer (he got sent there as a 19 year old kid because his superior was screwing his wife), before the so called war broke out. My Dad is/was one of the first Green Beret's in US Military history...the first of 100 so called "advisors". Now, my Dad went missing for over a month from his Platoon for more than 60 days (by the way he was a black man). When he returned he was missing teeth!!! My Dad, dam near until the day he died, pretended like he was never in Vietnam, like he was never in the region...he told me he was in Korea. He had total memory loss or at least his memory was "jammed". Well, he wasn't in Korea and his DD-214 acknowledged that he traveled "overseas".

Bull Crap, I said! Just prior to my father passing from Prostate Cancer in 2007 (after being sprayed/doused with agents, White, Blue, Orange and Pink back in the early 60's during Operation Ranch Hand) he finally, slightly acknowledged to me that it could have "been possible" that he was in Vietnam on the DMZ, but highly unlikely (he later went on to deny ever having that conversation with me). Although he could not remember for sure (memory loss). A record I received from a VA Medical Center in Indianapolis, IN.(Roudebush VA Facility), confirmed that he was in fact in Vietnam for more than 16 months and that he had gone "missing" for at least 60 days, yet never determined a POW. Once he retuned, he was missing teeth. Ten years later after an honorable discharge (with high medals/decorations), he suffered an anuerism to his brain (1973) which popped and flooded his cranial cavity with blood. He was not expected to live, yet he did and he had to learn how to walk, talk, read, write etc., all over again at the age of 32.

My Dad was not crazy and I honestly believe that he did endure extreme hardships. I believe my father did things via mind control that maybe he didn't want to remember...maybe he could not remember. This technology is by no means new. By the way, it's called Mind Control for a reason.

I offer no proof of what I say, except that I'm saying it....and it's true, as some of this is what he told me on his death bed and from info I have dug up on my own. The mind can be manipulated in ways that you could not imagine.

I'll tell you what, these military guys haven't shown up at my house for nothing over the past 3 years looking for me. I have been paid visits by several military officials since...the only thing between me and them is that I "wasn't available" at the time they came by...but my husband of 20 years was. The military has capabilities you could not nor would not ever imagine....a part of this is mind control from at least 50 years back.

I'm not saying this guy was under some kind of spell or mind control (the Washington D.C. guy), then carried out this horrific event. However, I'm saying it's not impossible either.

reply to post by ThePublicEnemyNo1


He had a stroke? That's a pretty good indication he may have had memory loss from a physiological point. He could have also suffered PTSD. Sometimes people with PTSD don't have memories of an event, but their body reacts to triggers that they might not be aware of.

There are a thousand reasons why people have memory loss. I am sure it was tough for him in the jungle alone, but he survived it. Suppose he was taken as POW by the Vietcong, why would they just experiment on him for 60 days just to turn him loose for him to not do anything since then?

I don't know your dad so I won't make any assumptions about him or what he could have or not done. But we have heard many stories of Vietnam being a psychological war. But every war has some elements of being psychological. My grandfather was a POW in Bataan, was in the Bataan Death March and witnessed a lot of atrocious things while there. He wrote his memoirs about his time there. It is amazing how these men survived that, but they all needed to be treated when they came home, and weren't.

I think the times plays a big part of psychology in war. During WW2, we were still fairly distant from Europe and we still lived under the Isolationist Policy until we were attacked. In that time we were in the Great Depression so our focus was not on European politics. We didn't have the view that we were a super power, we had won WWI, but it still didn't make that impact in the minds of Americans that we were standing on the brink of world power. The Japanese recognized this. Yamamoto said if he continued the assault, that the sleeping giant would awaken. We did awaken and this country became a super power, with as much force as the USSR. We beat the Axis on both sides of the planet.

So by the time of Vietnam just 20 years later, a generation had grown. Americans had experienced the post war boom and prosperity and then the Civil Rights Movement that the United States had never experienced before. So young people had become accustomed to now addressing social issues instead of just working for survival. And that played a huge role in how the wars were viewed. Young people didn't want to go to war, they were comfortable in this new prosperity and promoting social issues. We were in a war at home with the Civil Rights Movement. This psychology was formed in the minds of young people. Why fight there when we have issues here?

So this began the distrust of government, young people viewed the government now as their enemy. So why not now believe in all the rumors of governments using mind control experiments against unwitting victims? If you could believe the Communist government was doing it, why not the US government as well?

Black soldiers especially had that distrust, after all, the government didn't care about them. So why wouldn't the US government use mind control over soldiers, especially black soldiers? They were told by Malcolm X that the government was already setting them up for failure by making them drink alcohol. So you can imagine the mindset of these young people before they even went to Vietnam. They were set up for failure, and who set them up? The government.

And Communist China already knew this, and it became so easy to daily remind American soldiers of being set up, then musicians and actors got into it and promoted the same thing. If you watch MASH, you would understand this, how soldiers were conditioned for failure. MASH was set in Korea, but it was an Anti-Vietnam protest television show. Young people watched this and believed the conditioning.

So why not believe the government could use mind control? After all, they were set for failure anyway.