Chemtrail (?) attack over Marion Illinois 9-15-2013

reply to post by tsurfer2000h


I would agree with you, but if that member has been monitoring activity, as they say they have, I'd be fascinated to see their data.

This is a picture I took from Orland park Illinois of two planes right next to each other leaving contrail/chemtrail , I'm not exactly sure whee I stand on the chemtrail issue because I live in the flight path of both O'hare and Midway airports and have witnessed varying degrees of contrails my entire life, I used to work at O'hare airport and my father worked there for 50 years before retiring. Both of us have witnessed contrails that have had their own varying degrees of dispersal in many different weather conditions, some contrails spread out pretty wide depending on wind conditions and some linger for very long periods in mild wind conditions,so like I believe it would be almost impossible to tell the difference between the two from a ground point of view, but even my dad agrees with me that it is unusual for two planes to be entering the contrail altitude at the same time as appears in the picture unless it was a pair of military fighter jets flying in formation

FreeThinkerIdealist
I think the debate would go a bit easier on both sides if the anti-chemtrail people would admit that there is a chance that someone could have a system of spraying chemicals, that would not be released from the exhaust of the engines.

There is not only a chance of what you describe, but it can be definitively proven that such a thing not only exists, but is in daily use. My issue ( and others I'm sure) is when the chemtrail believers attempt to pass off contrails as chemtrails with no reasonable foundation for such claims. Their fixation on visible trails is leading them astray, chemical sprays would not be seen from the ground.

We are all here due to an interest in this topic. It's just that the ones who don't grasp the reality of contrail behaviour think the rest of us are in denial. In reality the ones forever pointing to photos of contrails are aiding and abetting in a widespread hoax that helps to hide any nefarious activities that do occur. The criminal GE dump off the coast of Canada a while back left no trails in the sky but all the chemmies angrily gazing at clouds and slaking their fists at them would be completely oblivious to it.

Though, the only problem I can see is the anti-chemtrial proponents would have to cease and desist the use of the word 'debunked' in reference to this discussion, and instead use terms like highly-unlikely, improbable, or in case of threads with pictures, explain why this particular incident (even if they've explained it on a thousand prior threads) isn't a chemtrail, but a contrail.

However, when a picture of a ballast test set up in a prototype is revealed to be exactly that, rather than the chemtrail set up its is claimed to be, then the word debunked is completely appropriate.

My personal feelings is water vapor by environmental conditions spurred by the actions of the plane creating the catalyst for change (plane make purty clouds) is generally what people see, and more often as we fly at different heights with improved technologies. I don't discount there might be planes spraying chemicals for all kinds of testing, as history has proven corporations and governments will do a lot in secret, regardless of the effects it may have on the world and its populations.

Yes, I agree, there may well be. But sure as eggs is eggs, getting wound up over contrails ain't never going to lead to the truth about such activities being revealed.

reply to post by DonVoigt


You caught a sun dog in that picture as well
I have been seeing a lot of those lately, especially when I have on my HD sunglasses.

reply to post by DonVoigt


Yes, it could be a pair of F-15's or suchlike flying together. With such sightings use of the FR24 app can help,eliminate commercial aircraft but I think only a zoom camera would reveal the nature of military aircraft (canon SX50 is probably best for this purpose if someone wants to do it but does not have a DSLR).

reply to post by FreeThinkerIdealist


Actually, we all agree that it is possible to have spray planes. Hell, they even have such things, there were planes that sprayed defoliants in Viet Nam (agent orange), there was the spraying of corexit in the gulf not long ago. There is no doubt it could be done.

Where we come in is when someone posts a picture of a contrail and claims it's a chemtrail. Why? Because it looks like a chemtrail. Never understanding the science that exists to explain persistent contrails. Seriously, if you look at these discussions, you will see time and again, where we (debunkers) are only trying to get the thick headed folks to crack into the facts just a bit. Yet they cling to their chemtrail religion.

Oh, and as far as chemicals intentionally coming out of the exhaust, that is not likely as the engine would burn up most chemicals as they went through, or at least change their properties. What you see is ice crystals that come from the heating of the air through the engine.

reply to post by DonVoigt


In all your time, or your dad's time at the airport, did you ever witness any spray apparatus on a plane, or see any tankers bringing something that wasn't fuel to the planes? Was there a special "chemtrail" shed where the pumpers all worked out of?

reply to post by waynos


The reason I think it's military fighter jets is because my uncle Terry lives down at Schaefer lake in Indiana and we see f15s in training maneuvers all the time and that is the same direction as my uncle's house

reply to post by network dude


No there have never been out of the ordinary airplanes that I noticed on the airfields and no I know which company uses each of the hangers on O'hate airfield , and yes I had airfield security access because the building I worked in was right next to the runways

reply to post by DonVoigt


This is important. If you use a flight tracking software, and you realize that its commercial flights leaving persistent contrails, yet you know what really goes on at a commercial airport (behind the scenes) then you know that the likely hood of that trail being anything other than a contrail is every, very low.

Thanks for your input.

reply to post by network dude


Well yes I agree that the likelihood that they are contrails is the more reasonable answer just because of my personal experiences, but I always keep my mind open to other possibilities, however I lean towards no when it comes to chemtrails because the elite breath the same air that every other human being breaths.

DonVoigt
but even my dad agrees with me that it is unusual for two planes to be entering the contrail altitude at the same time as appears in the picture unless it was a pair of military fighter jets flying in formation

It could be military in formation but I'd like to point out that there isn't A contrail altitude. It could be that the conditions for contrail formation existed over a few thousand feet

reply to post by mrthumpy


Well of course the altitude where contrails can occur can change depending on weather conditions, it's just a statement describing a threshold.

DonVoigt
reply to post by mrthumpy

 

Well of course the altitude where contrails can occur can change depending on weather conditions, it's just a statement describing a threshold.

What I meant (but didn't really make clear) was the planes might not necessarily be at the same altitude

sayzaar
reply to post by _BoneZ_

 

Not to mention, WHY, the first reply of a chemtrail thread is an attemp to debunk or flame it ?

Is it?


I see the first reply as a polite and logical question that has no bearing to any side of the debate,

Just a reasonable question compared to what is provided in the OP.


Please explain how it was an attempt to debunk and you really need the explain how it was an attempt to flame.

That is the sole purpose of your post, however it would nice to point out how the first reply was anything you say it was,

thanks

sayzaar
reply to post by _BoneZ_

 

Not to mention, WHY, the first reply of a chemtrail thread is an attemp to debunk or flame it ?

Inhale exhale, sadly this sort of response typifies how some believers perceive any attempt to actually discuss their claims. The only way such responses make sense to me is if they already know they don't have the facts to support their claim in a dialogue and so deploy this as a pre emotive defence mechanism. They can't cope with anything other than "OMG you are so right" lol.

It is so much better when a believer can actually engage in discussion, so long as their responses actually make sense (no names)

originally posted by: rickymouse
reply to post by rickymouse

 

Even if it is contrails, look at the pollution these jets are creating, Maybe instead of trying to prove they are chemtrails we should challenge the need for all the traveling all over the world. The Government should examine this practice to see the impact on the world.....Yeah, right....as if that will even be considered since it will negatively impact the economy.....It is easier to tax us.

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