NY cops shoot two bystanders near Times Square

Shootout in Times Square.
Desperate, dangerous situation...

two officers fired a total of three shots. They missed him but struck a 54-year-old woman in the right knee and a grazed a 35-year-old woman in the buttocks

Police officers were reportedly attempting to detain a man who was seen running through traffic

“He was just wandering, running away from the cop,” a witness told the New York times.

...the man made his hand into a gun shape and “aimed at the cops”.

Because thats all it takes nowdays for cops to go crazy.

link
foxnews

I don't think there's any other way to describe the cops actions as anything other than delusional and dangerous 'movie cop' idiocy.

So... Just a pure hypothetical question..... Since self defense laws commonly apply to defense of others in mortal danger or imminent threat of death?

When does the cop become the killer to the 3rd party observer.....when shooting an unarmed man to pieces and hitting innocent people in the process? At what point ..does the cop himself have legitimate reason to wonder when someone might shoot HIM to save those he is shooting in such a casual way?

** Added

Drudge report has the story headline this thread is based on, and in the same box...SAME box for coming in timing?

Unarmed man, possibly looking for help after wreck, shot by police

I can say the second story at least has the cop being charged right away with voluntary manslaughter ..but the distinction between one and the other, aside from a dead citizen, is kinda lost on me. The action and total lack of legitimate reason for it seems about the same, eh? Crazy Crazy times.

wrabbit2000
So... Just a pure hypothetical question..... Since self defense laws commonly apply to defense of others in mortal danger or imminent threat of death?

When does the cop become the killer to the 3rd party observer.....when shooting an unarmed man to pieces and hitting innocent people in the process? At what point ..does the cop himself have legitimate reason to wonder when someone might shoot HIM to save those he is shooting in such a casual way?

** Added

Drudge report has the story headline this thread is based on, and in the same box...SAME box for coming in timing?

Unarmed man, possibly looking for help after wreck, shot by police

I can say the second story at least has the cop being charged right away with voluntary manslaughter ..but the distinction between one and the other, aside from a dead citizen, is kinda lost on me. The action and total lack of legitimate reason for it seems about the same, eh? Crazy Crazy times.

edit on 15-9-2013 by wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)

Great point. Like, what if there were a couple of armed citizens behind the cops and saw the cops shooting into a crowd? If they shot the cops (a person would have to since you can be sure they will try to kill you if you attempt to detain them), how would that be handled in court?

Basically, any action or movement outside of herd activity is cause for execution by the Authorities.

You go with the flow, walk the walk, or you will be killed under the guise and being a "threat" or being "dangerous," especially if you need help and run toward a cop.

You will conform and go along your merry way.

Glad to see the POS was charged. Conviction is an entirely different matter.

I still want to know if those two POS who shot up the newpaper delivery women during the Dorner ordeal were ever charged or punished.

Cops are not there to help, as evident by this incident.

Links to the youtube and story:

www.cbsnews.com...

www.youtube.com...

reply to post by alfa1

This is crazy, this is just effing CRAZY.

This has to be preplanned, correct?

Cops arent the sharpest knives in the drawer, but can they really be this stupid???

The point of this to show that we have a fully realized police state. No one is safe. NO ONE.

Seriously, if you see a cop, just avoid them at all costs.

Never invite a cop into your life. Never.

gladtobehere
reply to post by alfa1

 

No one is safe. NO ONE.

Seriously, if you see a cop, just avoid them at all costs.

Never invite a cop into your life. Never.

It's been my experience that no situation exists that can't be made worse by involving the police.

-Peace-

The bullets stuck two victims, including a 54-year-old woman on a walker who reportedly dropped to the ground when struck.

I am thinking a business that fits walkers with bullet proof glass might be a money maker. Several victims with walkers as of late. It can only increase.

reply to post by wrabbit2000

You have touched on a subject that could become a can of worms,indeed,Wrabbit.When are people going to start shooting cops,while said cop(s) are in the process of brutalising or murdering a defenceless,non-threatening victim? It could happen-and the moment that happens,a precedent is set.

How long after,before innocent cops are shot because the shooter claimed that a cop was about to kill an innocent non-threatening citizen-even if this was not the case?And the shooter would be believed,the way things are going now.A can of worms indeed.Eventually people are going to say,no more! And a backlash will start.
Will that backlash start on the day a thug in uniform shoots a small child running away,in the back? Because he felt "threatened"? Would not surprise me one bit

reply to post by Eryiedes

It certainly seems to be the case these days-in my country,there would be little point calling them,they often don't bother coming+if they did,the vast majority would not be up to dealing with a dangerous situation anyway-and in your country you may well end up getting shot by the very cop you called to help you.
There ARE good cops,I have personally known one-but while our police force are only inefficient+corrupt-yours are becoming more+more dangerous to the very citizenry they have a duty to protect+serve.This should be a big worry for all Americans.

Alfa 1,may I ask,as a South African-outside of sites like ATS,what is the general American perception of all the trouble with cops using extreme prejudice and/or brutality these days? Outside of sites like these-are the American public in general outraged? Are Americans in general aware of this worrying situation?
Not being American.it is something I wonder about.I mean,here on ATS it seems like a well-known concern,a matter of due worry+outrage-but I wonder if the population in general are also aware of the problem?
Thank you,wishing you a good week ahead.

reply to post by alfa1


So what. # happens. Guarenteed the articles you linked aren't the full story.

Much ado about nothing. Just like most anti-cop posts here.

reply to post by Raxoxane


As an American,NO most of us do NOT hate cops like most posters here.

They have a tough job. And deal with some trash here in the states.

The posts you see here are the ones they want you to see.

They won't show you the crime ridden neighborhoods they work in for what,$29000 a year? Risk your life for that? Yet they wonder why they're trigger happy. Go work in a gang controlled ghetto area then get back to me ATS.

nightstalker78
reply to post by Raxoxane

 

They won't show you the crime ridden neighborhoods they work in for what,$29000 a year? Risk your life for that? Yet they wonder why they're trigger happy. Go work in a gang controlled ghetto area then get back to me ATS.

Risk is part of the job description, this cop (and the one in Charlotte NC) should consider accounting instead.

reply to post by Raxoxane


You know, it's a really scary thing to see starting to become an issue too. That being, the very concept of self defense shootings vs. uniformed Police. Another of those things I never thought I'd see the day come to find raised as a serious thing to be addressed.

The problem I see isn't with cops (Criminals with badges..in this example) who go so far over any line of decency that even an average citizen feels compelled to intervene and with all necessary force. That situation, by nature, would be so clear as to remove the moral/legal questions...we'd hope.

It's that once the precedent is set, as you note, where does 'creative exercise' lead? Every law has people creatively push bounaries and for most? On a daily basis, somewhere. Imagine where THIS one leads to be tested that way? Anarchy....Chaos...and a break down of civil order, in the most dire of scenarios over time.

I wish cops would just leave the damn gun in the holster or at least...fingers OFF those triggers ..unless someone is clearly in danger of DYING in the next moment. Period. That would solve it all before getting into the stickier issues, eh?

reply to post by Biigs


Yet, I hear it form the left all of the time: only the police are responsible enough to have guns.

reply to post by nightstalker78

Thank you nightstalker for the perspective on this.Yes in my country cop salaries are also not what they should be-i know a woman cop who seems to have an adequate +comfortable enough financial situation but that's from her husband's job-were she unmarried with 2 children,she would really have battled.Most cops in my country have wives that have to work,or else there would be problems facing that family.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

Hi Wrabbit,yes that's the 1st scenario that popped into my mind when I read your post-once that precedent is set(and I hope it never does,but it is not impossible,I think) how it can be abused by the unscrupulous.Cops in my country were targeted for years after 1994,cops of all races,many cops were shot dead by armed criminals,it became a great concern,a very tragic time,though it seems to have slowed down by now. And not for a particular reason-except they were cops+the assailants would simply kill a cop to obtain yet another gun.