99% sure my friend is a (new) abductee. Can you help?

reply to post by greysnake


Good points.

I see the OP as very cautious about any hint of suggestions re his experiences.

I don't see any significant risk of her interactions with him being negative, hurtful or counterproductive.

She has great instincts and a big caring heart. Hard to go wrong with those. Add to those her brightness and facility in communicating gently etc. . . . I think she's a God-send to him and to his gf.

Needs psychological help.
Broken bones sometimes let bone marrow into the blood stream.
That can cause issues in the brain ...

reply to post by FlyersFan


Yeah. Important, imho. Agreed.

However . . . given the givens of the system there as described by the OP . . . that may not be overly realistic or timely to achieve . . .

However, OP, you might contact what's her name . . .

Paola Harris . . . let me get a link . . .

www.paolaharris.com...

I think she spends about half her time in Rome and half in the USA.

She should have some useful connections. Usually in such . . . countries . . . connections are crucial to getting good care.

She'd certainly know of professionals who'd be constructive re all the issues vs destructive out of bias and ignorance.

A caveat re Paola . . . I've talked with her face to face at some length.

One might have to be a bit cautious about her seemingly propagandized perspective that the critters are wonderful, benign etc. She was a frequent lunch partner with Msgr Balducci of the Vatican. The Vatican is increasingly on record as labeling the critters wonderful space brothers etc. etc. Hideous.

Anyway--short of that caution, I think Paola could be a great help in identifying professionals and giving the OP contact information for her friend.

FlyersFan
Needs psychological help.
Broken bones sometimes let bone marrow into the blood stream.
That can cause issues in the brain ...

Somewhat true but it will always end up in the lungs not the brain as a pulmonary embolism.

greysnake
Somewhat true but it will always end up in the lungs not the brain as a pulmonary embolism.

Mayo Clinic ... it can cause seizures and of course seizures .. no matter how big or small ... effect the brain. I still say get a check up for this AND get some psychological help first. If those are ruled out, then move on to the 'abduction' stuff .... IMHO

reply to post by FlyersFan


I think that sequence might be nice . . .

It doesn't seem practical or even wise in this situation as I understand it currently.

The abduction stuff is INTENSELY PRESENT as a pink elephant not just in the room but on his lap, so to speak.

There's no escaping it.

Ignoring at all for any significant number of hours, is, imho, insulting to the man and counter-productive to his healing.

Accept him where he is with his reality as he's experienced such and perceives such and is responding emotionally, in art, in withdrawal etc. to whatever experiences. Go from there.

I don't see it wise or loving to shove his reality into some tidy little box according to some professional comfort zones.

It could take considerable time to track down suitable professionals of significant quality within reach in that geographic context. I'd think it cruel to ignore his reality in the meantime.

Hi Silo,

Interesting post and a situation I can definitely see causing you to worry and want to investigate further into. However, despite Bo Xian's...enthusiastic explanations, these things are best worked through logically, and through a process of elimination. If, at the end of this, you have resolved and removed all possible likely answers, then the unlikely possibility of being abducted becomes more reasonable.

Let's look at the list you created of events:

1. Each and every one is of the same theme.
When someone new to art, of any kind, first starts - they often start with a single focus, working from that until they improve and refine their technique enough to move into other things. Like a new guitar player, who might play the same song endlessly until he gets it perfect, before every moving on.
2. The classic alien gray -
I'll admit this is an odd one to start with, however the shape is very easy to draw, and what may be the classic grey alien may also just be his interpretation of an anonymous face. Unfortunately, whether you want to admit it or not, unless he tells you directly that "yes, this is the face of an alien" or very similar, you only have your assumptions to go off of. They are not a bad assumption if the painting is as you describe, but only he can tell you for sure.
3. in diff shades of pastel colors.
Again, beginner artist, sticking with one theme and exploring variations of it to expand ability.
4. All the same.
See answers to 1 and 3
5. Now take into account the man who’s never held a paintbrush before in his life
Lots of people have never done things, and decided to start something. You think that because someone has not painted before he could not start off relatively good? That's kind of a discredit to your friend Silo. Now, that he started after an apparently traumatic event, with that theme; does make your conclusion totally understandable, but like #2, until he gives you a direct answer, you cannot dismiss that it could be a more mundane reason to start painting
6. is [now] a prolific producer of this one theme painting?
Again, see #1, #3. I will also admit, again, that the consistent theme of an "alien" face needs to be explored, but simply labeling it an "alien face" without knowing for sure his intent means you cannot be 100% sure.
7. When asked he replies they’re ‘in his head’ -
Yeah...that's usually where most things come from. What you're assuming is "They are in his head as memories" when there has been no definitive answer that they are not "in his head as imagination." Like before, unless he says specifically, you cannot rule out that is just imagination, as much as you want to.
8. but he can’t or will not remember the events his injury?
The thing is, -you- don't know what happened either. You're taking your inference from the above and drawing the conclusion that he can't remember a traumatic alien abduction. You completely disregard the many possible terrestrial events that could happen. I was an EMT-P for a number of years, in my own time I went to many people who had broken hips, fallen and injured themselves in someway, and just due to the shock and pain couldn't clearly say what happened. Now, again, I'll give you some leeway based on the fact that you say he seems to tear up remembering it, and display other signs of distress - but that could still be because of something other than aliens. I'm sorry, but that he could have been assaulted by some "quarry gangsters" is just as realistic, and possibly more so, as being abducted by aliens.

9. That he just happened to pick up painting right after breaking a hip
I picked up sketching after I badly sprained my leg during a martial arts tournament and couldn't walk for three weeks. I had never had any interest in it before. These things happen when you get bored.
10. in the middle of the night
The better question is: why was he out there in the middle of the night? Clandestine meeting with quarry gangsters, or any other person of human origin, is just as likely or more likely than alien abduction.
11. when his dogs did not sound off
Do you know that for certain? Were you there to observe his dogs not going off? Was his girlfriend? This sounds like supposition.
12. and his security lights for the gravel pit didn’t go on
Again, how do you know this for certain? Were you there? Who was there to observe that they didn't go on? Are they on a timer? They could have easily gone on and turned off in the time elapsed.
13. his long term GF finding him after curled in a ball
I'd never not gone to a scene of a broken hip, in my time, where the injured person wasn't just lying on the ground.
14. ‘out of it’.
Broken hips are exceedingly painful. The body releases numerous chemicals to attempt to allay that, as well as inducing shock.
15. No drinking
That you're aware of. Until this is conclusively proven you can't fully dismiss it. I'll give you a pass and say if he has never been a drinker then it's unlikely, but that doesn't mean assurity.
16. no drugs
That you're aware of. Again, if he's never been an abuser, it's probably not likely...but again, alien abduction is incredibly unlikely too, but you think is the cause. So clearly unlikely things aren't improbable.
17. no outward signs of any other trauma than a broken hip?
Define outward signs of any other trauma? Do you mean there was no physical indication of harm inflicted on him besides the damage from his "fall"? Were you there to see him directly at the hospital after his girlfriend found him? Do you know, for certain, that there wasn't other physical harm they just didn't want to make you privy to?

Look, the bottom line is that until you can answer, clearly, all the variables; you only have an assumption to go off of. That assumption is based on your opinion and experience. While that is not to be discounted, you can't make a conclusion on incomplete data.

As his friend you either need to let him work through it on his own, offering your support when asked and just generally being there for him and his family, or decide that your curiosity and certainty of abduction warrant you invasively questioning him.

FlyersFan

greysnake
Somewhat true but it will always end up in the lungs not the brain as a pulmonary embolism.

Mayo Clinic ... it can cause seizures and of course seizures .. no matter how big or small ... effect the brain. I still say get a check up for this AND get some psychological help first. If those are ruled out, then move on to the 'abduction' stuff .... IMHO

It's news to me but a fair point and a fair source too. I also agree with your psychiatric angle. This does need to be confronted but as always I remain open minded until the situation develops. I imagine for every abduction story that is explained away with psychiatric disorders, a few genuine cases may slip through the net. Western medicine is so quick to pigeonhole.

18. Can't avoid painting them. Many abductions leave folks feeling or 'literally' COMPELLED to do some action--typically write, publicize, art etc.

BO XIAN
Great list of factoids . . . let me count them . . .

silo13
reply to post by nightstalker78

 

If you don't want to allow there's the possibility of some strangeness going on here - right along with tangible evidence of a peculiar nature - all the paintings?

1. Each and every one is of the same theme.
2. The classic alien gray -
3. in diff shades of pastel colors.
4. All the same.
5. Now take into account the man who’s never held a paintbrush before in his life
6. is [now] a prolific producer of this one theme painting?
7. When asked he replies they’re ‘in his head’ -
8. but he can’t or will not remember the events his injury?

9. That he just happened to pick up painting right after breaking a hip
10. in the middle of the night
11. when his dogs did not sound off
12. and his security lights for the gravel pit didn’t go on - his long term GF
13. finding him after curled in a ball
14. ‘out of it’.
15. No drinking,
16. no drugs,
17. no outward signs of any other trauma than a broken hip?


peace

Interesting . . . ALL 17 items are CONSISTENT with an abduction phenomena. Yet the RABID DENIERS on the thread refuse to apply Ockham's razor fittingly to the list of 17 items.

Fascinating . . . sort of . . . to a point.

Sheesh what hypocrisy.

reply to post by UnmitigatedDisaster


imho, that's a beautiful and thoughtful bunch of points that CONCEIVABLY fit some constructions on such realities.

I just think that such explanations miss the realities involved like ships passing in the night.


I just believe that the OP has a LOT of understanding conscious and barely conscious which give her practical insights that may be difficult to articulate or elaborately justify.

And, I think most folks on this thread are missing nuances in the narrative which, imho, are quite telling and convincing.

Time will tell.

reply to post by BO XIAN

I think its time to leave "Fox" behind. Stop this bull# you are playing with someones life.

BO XIAN
reply to post by HairlessApe

 

Asking the old man

WHY he's coming up with creepy critter art

is NOT a wise,
NOT a clever,
NOT a caring approach.

"Why" questions tend to come across as accusing.

They are at least rather OFF-PUTTING.

That's the OPPOSITE of what the bloke needs from anyone.

Sheesh.

Not sure I agree with your take on this. I guess it would depend not only on the situation, and the friend's personality and state at the time, but how it was handled. Things like that can be handled tactfully, you know. And besides-- if it's innocent, and he just "decided to take it up" as he claims, then there should be no offense in asking. Curiosity and casual questioning is only going along with the story that the friend, himself, gave.


"You know, these paintings are really interesting, and ever since I saw them I've been thinking about it. I'm really curious about the subject matter you chose..."


...does not sound like an accusation.



And if he gives a vague explanation / description, that is also a potential door / segue to: "You know what these remind me of....?"


And that kind of question / statement might be a good way to gauge his mood, or feelings on that matter, if he isn't being particularly open about it.


Just some thoughts....

BO XIAN


She could say something like . . .

"I'm interested in your thoughts about the origins of these events."

"I'm curious about your thoughts on the causes of these events."

"I'm curious about the sequence of specific actions and experiences throughout the whole episode."


the art:

"I'm interested in your thoughts leading up to the beginning of this painting."

"I'm interested in your feelings just prior to drawing the basic outline of this face."

"I'm interested in your thoughts and feelings as you began to draw these eyes."

edit on 15/9/2013 by BO XIAN because: addition

Wait... so you're saying that a simple, straightforward "why," or "I'm curious about your subject matter" is a bad, insensitive way to go, but thorough, repeated, clinical sounding questioning (that sounds like it came from a psychiatrist) is a good way to make him feel comfortable?

That doesn't make sense to me. And that would only work if he has a very particular personality type. Otherwise he could feel interrogated.




Anyway, back to OP: I forgot to mention in my last post-- If he is not the type to normally drink or drug, if he did go on a bender one night, that could make him more reluctant to admit it.


You also mention a broken hip and silver hair. You know, a lot of people associate falls, and subsequent broken hip, to be associated with old age. It is common in the elderly. The mood changes you're seeing could be a depression brought on by the idea that he's growing old, and fears that his body is more frail, and not getting any younger.


On that note, if he is taking pain meds for this condition, those can affect a person's moods. People react differently to that stuff, and I've talked to some people who get blatant depression and dysphoria from opiate painkillers.

silo13
reply to post by violet

 

Thanks Violet - I meant to add that earlier - and you can read up in my last reply.

There are no narcotics onboard. They're not prescribed here for home use. It just doesn't happen. A cultural thing I'd like to post about on the boards here at some point but the time isn't now.

Nope - he's not under the influence of any opiates/narcotics. Just not a possibility.

peace

That's terrible. Seems barbaric, to me.

And on that note-- some people, when they are in extreme pain and unable to get medicine from a (barbarically unwilling) medical professional, they turn to stuff from the streets. And from the sound of it, I would imagine that sort of thing is even more common over there than over here. But perhaps not.


That being said-- if he was in the hospital for any length of time, being given painkillers, and then discharged still with plenty of pain, that could have an impact on mood as well. The pain alone. Some people handle that kind of thing much better than others. And it's not just a matter of mental strength of weakness-- some people just have a higher pain threshold, or mentally / emotionally process it differently.


Just thinking aloud.


But I really do want to see these paintings!

reply to post by iwilliam


That's a bit puzzling.

You sounded like you sort of disagreed.

Then your suggested wording essentially matched mine in avoiding "Why?"

"Why" tends to feel like someone has a long pointy finger on your sternum with fierce interrogation in their eyes and tone. The degree depends on a lot of factors on the part of the questioner as well as the listener.

As I've noted . . . I'm confident the OP is well able to translate suggested wording into her own words and into words the old man is quite familiar with and comfortable with.

Sigh.

reply to post by imod02


I gather you are attacking me and my inputs on this thread.

I have no idea what you mean by "Fox."

Personally, I don't "play with" lives except in the sense that I do all I can to help folks live better lives, more free, more whole, more at peace, more in-tune and in a walk with God etc. In that sense, I "play for keeps." i.e., I take it all quite seriously.

By the same token, I recognize that with the best of input from everyone in someone's social and professional networks, many folks . . . most folks . . . are still quite resistant to change. They will more or less continue to do what they've usually done . . . regardless.

In this case, the OP is very bright, loving, sensitive, responsible. I'm confident she will sort and sift all the inputs and do and say what makes the best sense to her at the time. I expect that to be very helpful to her friend.

So all its takes for you to be 99% sure someone was forceably abducted by visiting aliens and then returned to earth is sleepwalking and pictures that might 'look' like aliens to you.?

reply to post by silo13


Silo,

I simply do not understand so many folks' incredulity about your assessment of the paintings. Sheesh! And that without seeing them whereas you have seen them!

It's not as though there's a LOT of ambiguity regarding such images!

Typical grey type alien images do

NOT

look like

--a cow
--an elephant
--Marilyn Monroe
--JFK
--Kissinger
--Mona Lisa
--a dog
--a duck

The net sure tends to bring out the DISCOUNT-IT-DERIDE-IT-RATIONALIZEL-IT-AWAY-DISMISS-IT-SHRED-IT-REGARDLESS worst in people.

It seems like some folks suck on a sugar-tit of skepticism 24/7 and nurse it as though it were Gollum's !MY PRECIOUS! Sigh.

BO XIAN
reply to post by UnmitigatedDisaster

 

imho, that's a beautiful and thoughtful bunch of points that CONCEIVABLY fit some constructions on such realities.

I just think that such explanations miss the realities involved like ships passing in the night.


I just believe that the OP has a LOT of understanding conscious and barely conscious which give her practical insights that may be difficult to articulate or elaborately justify.

And, I think most folks on this thread are missing nuances in the narrative which, imho, are quite telling and convincing.

Time will tell.

But that's just it, there is no reality in the description of events so far except that their friend fell, broke his hip, and since then has been displaying some PTSD like symptoms and painting faces that the OP has interpreted as extraterrestrial life.

Again - as I said to the OP - I don't doubt their interpretation of the paintings is wrong, but I do think that the information known thus far doesn't only point to alien abduction. There are a few possible scenarios, but until the other possibilities are eliminated or greatly reduced in probability, the chances of this being alien abduction are low.

It's logical to try to fill in the gaps, but to just immediately point to aliens is irresponsible, especially when the person is clearly suffering from the event.

Could it be aliens? Sure. I fully concede the possibility. But could it be something more terrestrial? Given the nature of humans and our general aholery, yeah - I'd buy that.

And just because he is relatively physically fit does not mean he is incapable of simply falling down. It happens to everyone from the feeble to Olympic athletes. Gravity is a cruel but useful mistress

I'll tell ya something between us and those reading. I believe that there are extraterrestrials; though not entirely that they are coming to our planet, or that there is a huge cover up over it. But the only way to quantify that kind of visitation and interaction is to approach those who claim it rationally. Deal with it more logically than just gut instinct. Eliminate the mundane possibilities systematically until the improbable becomes probable and even likely.

To the OP - I'd love to see pictures if you are able to obtain them. I am not completely discounting the possibility. Indeed, the ET believer in me squees a bit at it, even if I feel bad for your friend; but I was taught to question everything, and I think that is true whether it be the government or claims of ET interaction.

reply to post by BO XIAN

Sorry did not mean to seem to attack you, just ment when some one is in as much detress as her friend is its much safer to stay with conventional treatments, hope we are ok now . if you want to know what fox ment, look up x files. Be safe