Shall I Compare Thee to a Flame...

I was sat around thinking earlier, as you do, when I started thinking about what conscieousness and the Buddhist idea of it as a stream that is never ending. I don't get it. I can't comprehend it that way.

The way I just thought of explaining my views was as a comparison to a flame.

1 spark (possibly electric)
1 wooden log
1 Garden ful of Oxygen

These things under the right circumstances bring about the beginning of the manifestation that is fire. Take away the Oxygen, for example, and POOF, gone.

Or

1 Body of correct tissues
1 Blood supply of Oxygen
1 Spark (possilby electric)

Could this explain us as a manifestation with a beginning and an end?

And more importantly, will this mean we should give persoonhood to fires? Will reusing candles be on a parr with organ donation? Do flames have rights? Can they claim benefits? Are they alien life forms? Will there be an uprising? Ok, well, maybe ignore the last paragraph.

Thoughts?

Consciousness is not your brain on fire. Consciousness is the awareness that while your body is temporary, your essence is permanent. The material world makes it difficult to know this, so some people choose to meditate, pray, use psychedelics, or some other method to enjoy that awareness.

Physical matter is 3% or less of the universe. Whatever else makes up our universe (it used to be called aether) is what your essence is made of. While it resides in your body, it can be free and happy or neglected and miserable.

reply to post by Saoquim


I am not suggesting concsiousness is a fire. I am saying I had an idea that it could be a manifestation similar, with a beginning and an end.

I have problems contemplating conscioussness as a permanent state, just because I don't get it, not because I have evidence either way.

Take fork lightening for example.

There is no fork lightening.
Then circumstances come together to bring about fork lightening.
Storm goes away, back to there being no fork lightening.

I couldn't say that the essence of flames or lightening bolts have an eternal esscence as I have seen them disappear. Like when a consciousness leaves a body.

However, if anyone can explain how these entities could be permanent manifestations as opposed to temporary phenomena I would be one step closer to believing in a form of afterlife.

reply to post by InkontinentiaBouquet


I see where you're going. I like your fork lightning analogy. Better than the flame analogy anyways

It's very difficult to provide hard evidence of the permanence or impermanence of consciousness. Because of this, I trust people's personal experiences over the milennia- near death experiences, talking with the dead, reincarnation, and so on. These experiences are so profound, they can be the biggest thing that ever happens to them. Who am I to tell them they are wrong? Who am I to try to explain it away, sweep it under the rug, and declare 'nothing to see here'?

So I take their testimonies as evidence. Of course, it is neither proof of nor the unequivocal truth of consciousness. But it is important evidence. I also use meditation, contemplation, research of spiritual traditions and philosophy to come to my own conclusions, which are incomplete and always improved upon.

I figure that if more the 97% of the universe is entirely unknown and/or misunderstood by science, our essence is permanently tethered to this immaterial part of it.

Many times I wonder- is the Earth conscious? Are the other planets conscious? Is the Sun conscious? Is the universe conscious? We can't say for sure because we know so little about consciousness. It may come in forms completely unrecognizable to us.

I'm having a bit of difficulty with your analogies, although I kind of understand why your comparing a soul to a flame.

Consciousness has often been compared to the soul, and in most religions(from what I know anyways), souls are almost considered indestructible in their nature. As far as we know consciousness seems to run on/or is electricity in some weird bio/chemistry way, and some scientists say electromagnetic forces are always around us, since light is supposedly a form electromagnetism. However, our understanding of such forces, are limited, since we just don't know.

I tend to view a soul like a rock at times, as in, it just there. It could be compared to a flame, like food for the spirit, or dampening the spirit.

Live a good life. If there is an afterlife you will have assured yourself a reward. Live a good life. If there is nothing but darkness, you will have lived a good life. Seems like it doesn't really matter if there's anything else or not as long as you use this time to live a good life.

a reply to: InkontinentiaBouquet

I've had similar thoughts, specially in regards to passing on that spark (the survival of the species). We pass on our spark to another, and they pass it on to another, and basically in the grand scheme of things we're just one flame that's fighting being snuffed out for good.