To the Atheist: A reason Christians get heated when defending their belief.

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posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 07:59 AM
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In regard to the topic at hand, I'm not so sure that Atheists were overly concerned as to why some Christians get so 'heated' when defending their belief.

To some of them, at least in the discussions I've been a part of, or read here at ATS. it is little more than a game, and to others it's an opportunity for them to bash something that they have little to no respect for.

The same could be said of many Christians in these conversations.

Just my opinions based on my experiences here on ATS regarding the topics of Faith, Atheism and Religion.




posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 08:01 AM
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Originally posted by Prezbo369

Originally posted by Revolution9

Originally posted by Prezbo369

Originally posted by ServantOfTheLamb
I personally believe that God takes care of me. I struggle financially, yet at the moment when hope is gone I'll get some cash from a relative or a friend. I might be going hungry one day, and he has people stop over with food or something of the nature. He works in my life constantly, and I could never repay him for that any other way than by telling you all that he truly does hold me in his hands and take care of me as a child. I wish and pray that some of the threads I post that do discuss logical positions for our belief will show atleast one of you the truth.


Along with being able to tell the difference between fiction and non-fiction, taking responsibility for yourself is a major part of growing up to become an adult.

If you need someone/something to hold your hand throughout your entire life then you'll never grow up.


Well I am a Christian and you are an atheist. Please can you tell me why you are more "grown up" than I?

I don't think you are any more grown up than me. Prove to me that somehow I am more childish than you because I believe in The Creator and you do not. How can that possibly be a fact?

Are you grown up enough to embrace danger like I did in the middle of the night on The Mount of Olives in a Palestinian area where children were pretending to shoot me, lol?

I tell you Faith can make you very fearless, fearless enough to be slain by your enemy just to stand up for what you believe, like Martin Luther King did ( a very Faithful Martyr).

This is a silly supposition.


I wasn't actually talking about you personally, but.....

You just compared yourself to Martin Luther King, albeit indirectly

And you gave a dramatic account of something you claimed happened to you and how you reacted to it on an internet forum, and you expected me or anyone else to actually believe it...


edit on 2-9-2013 by Prezbo369 because: (no reason given)


I asure you what I have written did take place. It's no big deal either. An American guy was with me the second time I went there. Palestinian children really did pretend to shoot at us and my American companion got very frightened about it.

Of course I was not comparing myself to MLK! I would never do that because he was a great man and I am not. I was trying to show you that Faith can make you very brave. Those early Martyrs did have to lose their heads and get tortured in many horrible ways for Christ. You and I both know the history of that.

You can go to Israel and do what I did, too, quite easily. It is a free country and tourism is accepted there. There are so many lies and misleading statements about modern Israel. There are many Americans travelling there and lots of Black people live there.

I am a crazy kind of guy! I do these crazy kind of things.

Why should we treat everything on the internet as though it is a lot of rubbish? Why can we not tell other people over the internet about our personal experiences? Who are you to censor me in such a repressive manner? Is it because I challenged you about your statement that I am somehow more childish than you because I believe in Christ?. This thread is not rubbish. I have no reason to distrust anyone who is posting on this thread. I get a lot out of ATS because I do not automatically assume that people are ALL liars. Is that how you feel about it? Then why do you bother to come here and read what you believe to all be lies and not worthy of any trust?

You do not believe my words? Well that is up to you, but I have written from my heart and my family and friends KNOW that I went there and did what I did. To you I am just some stranger. Have you no trust in people any more? I still have trust in people. I know what is real and what is not. It is possible to read between the lines ya know.

I promise you what I have written is true. There is not much else I can do about your non acceptance of what I did there. If I can't convince you that I went back packing in Israel then there is little chance of me convincing you that Jesus walked on water and raised up dead people, lol!

Have some Faith here in the music of Peter Tosh quoting many sources from David's Psalms and John's Gospel. I hang out a lot with Mama Africa's people because like the Bible says these things have been hidden to to the wise and revealed to babes.

Lots of childish LOVE!





edit on 2-9-2013 by Revolution9 because: spelling and clarification.
edit on 2-9-2013 by Revolution9 because: inclusion of video.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 08:43 AM
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Originally posted by NthOther

Originally posted by ServantOfTheLamb

....we leave out a major reason that we believe in God, and that is the feeling that is experienced when one ask the Lord to save them from their sins. I have no doubt every Christian knows the exact feeling that I am talking about, and that once they felt it that was the day they decided, "I will never not believe in you again."

The experience you're referring to is not exclusive to Christianity. But no matter what the specifics of your beliefs are, anyone who has had such an experience cannot deny that it happened. This is what atheists don't understand, because they can't understand it. They haven't had such an experience and, try as you may, you cannot explain something that cannot be described with words.

So there's really no reason to "get heated" about it. Why are you wasting your time defending your beliefs to people who are incapable of relating to the experience(s) that gave you cause for your convictions to begin with? I mean, I can get a little antagonistic towards atheists myself, but not because I'm defending or trying to convince people to adopt a different belief system--I just think atheists are mean-spirited, nasty people who need to be taken down a peg or two.



Wrong, wrong, wrong.
I am an Atheist but don't actually like the 'label' because really what I am is a normal person who happens not to believe in a sky god.
However what I have said many times before is that not believing in a god does not equal having no spirituality.
I still believe in a soul or something similar because an after life is in no way depending on a god. It could have its basics in quantum physics or multiverse theory for example [which to me makes far more sense].

As to the 'special' feeling you get from the bond between your god and yourself. I have that feeling too. It is just that it isn't with a god. Also when I ask the universe for help, I often get help. Again, I believe because of evidence that this has something to do with quantum physics rather than men with beards who get angry if I don't do what they tell me.

As a matter of fact this 'special feeling' that I always hear about when talking to christians is not at all a christian only thing. Buddhists have it, muslims have it, Atheists have it [if they are spiritual], everyone can have it.

The only people I have ever found 'nasty' or disrespectful were christians, especially new born ones. They have lied, cheated and been evasive towards me and those I know. You are not special, you have just been caught in a very intricate program that punishes you for even trying read up on other things and hence there is no easy way out.

I feel sorry for religious people but fortunately some make it out, those that ask questions.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 09:01 AM
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Originally posted by ServantOfTheLamb
I just kinda wanted to write this thread to shed a little light on why we get on here and try bombarding you with these logic games and facts and blah blah blah....one reason is you claim that is all you adhere to so we try and show the logical things and facts we believe support the belief, however, when we do this we leave out a major reason that we believe in God, and that is the feeling that is experienced when one ask the Lord to save them from their sins. I have no doubt every Christian knows the exact feeling that I am talking about, and that once they felt it that was the day they decided, "I will never not believe in you again." So, while you may think "oh this definitely disproves the Bible as the word of God," our personal relationship with Him is what makes it so hard to sway our opinion, and most of us won't share these experiences with you out of fear of ridicule and disbelief.
edit on 2-9-2013 by ServantOfTheLamb because: (no reason given)


Then use that logic instead. You can't argue with personal gnosis. If you were to tell people about your personal relationship with your god, they can't pull out a history book to tell you that you're wrong.

It's when Christians pull out the bible in order to prove the bible and then reinforce that "proof" with, yet again, the bible... that's when you are going to get a response you don't like.

Do you think it is only Christians who feel that feeling? Don't you think Muslims and Hindus do, as well? What about pagans, Shinto, and tribal faiths? If you think theirs is false and yours is real, then again, you will get a response you do not like.

It is extremely rare to meet a Christian who acknowledges that the bible has its flaws and that their personal relationship with their god is no more valid than other people to their gods. Those Christians only get picked on by other Christians, go figure.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 10:00 AM
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the same reason an athiest gets heated when you trample on his "intellectually" superior (dis)belief system



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 11:36 AM
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Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by BELIEVERpriest
reply to post by truejew
 


I agree, and no part of salvation ever involved work from the believer.


Faith is necessary for salvation. Faith without works is dead.


Eph2:8 "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them."

Salvation is based on faith alone.

James 2: 14 What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and be filled,” and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that? 17 Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself.

18 But someone may well say, “You have faith and I have works; show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works.”

This passage is about charit, giving and helping our brothers and sisters after salvation. Works must be done in the Holy Spirit. Work apart from the Holy Spirit is without faith. To assume that salvatipn is by faith AND work is to take this passage out of context. The context is "can your faith feed the hungry?" The answer is no. But to practice good works without faith is selfcentered vanity.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 01:23 PM
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reply to post by ZeroReady
 


You have absolutely no respect.

And, it is The Living Word, not what you call a Bronze Age document that saved/saves us. The Word is The Holy Spirit. He who knows Him, hears His Word.

Two choices. Live in the flesh, or live in spirit.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 01:57 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


I just said I agree. However, I do not agree when you say I am trying to outwit God, I am merely trying to listen to the signs he gives us, and the Bible tells us he will give us signs when his time is near.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 02:06 PM
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reply to post by truejew
 


My friend if you want to have an intellectual theological conversation you are going to have to back up your claims with facts. If you are just going to say no Pre-trib rapture, and not back it up with the Bible, well then its just your opinion and really doesn't matter to me. If you are going to say salvation is based on grace thru faith kept by works and not back it up with the Bible, again you are merely spouting of random accusations about me being wrong about my own doctrine and yet not using any of the Bible to prove your point. I am open to discussion but I do not believe he is wrong about the 70 weeks. If he was wrong and the 70 weeks had already been fulfilled the Church wouldn't be here anymore.....

Daniel 9
War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. 27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’[h] In the middle of the ‘seven’ he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple[j] he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.[k
edit on 2-9-2013 by ServantOfTheLamb because: (no reason given)

None of this has happened yet so it cannot be complete buddy.
edit on 2-9-2013 by ServantOfTheLamb because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 02:12 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 02:15 PM
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Originally posted by BELIEVERpriest

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by BELIEVERpriest
reply to post by truejew
 


I agree, and no part of salvation ever involved work from the believer.


Faith is necessary for salvation. Faith without works is dead.


Eph2:8 "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them."

Salvation is based on faith alone.

James 2: 14 What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and be filled,” and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that? 17 Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself.

18 But someone may well say, “You have faith and I have works; show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works.”

This passage is about charit, giving and helping our brothers and sisters after salvation. Works must be done in the Holy Spirit. Work apart from the Holy Spirit is without faith. To assume that salvatipn is by faith AND work is to take this passage out of context. The context is "can your faith feed the hungry?" The answer is no. But to practice good works without faith is selfcentered vanity.




Also if you believe that salvation is based on anything other than faith you are calling Jesus himself a liar.....
John 6
27 Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal.” 28 Therefore they said to Him, “What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?” 29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent.”



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 02:17 PM
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Originally posted by fishing4truth





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posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 02:32 PM
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Look at it this way. If when you die nothing happens oh well your dead. If when you die there is a heaven and hell well damn those atheists lost big time.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 02:35 PM
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And for all the people asking if I believe it is something unique to Christians, yes I do. I mean no disrespect to other religions, however, I would compare their sensation to one Mormons get when praying about the BoM. A burning in the heart is what most Mormons describe. This is not the same feeling, and I feel like God is telling me others do not experience what I am talking about otherwise I wouldn't have posted this thread.

You don't have to agree, this is just my belief.
edit on 2-9-2013 by ServantOfTheLamb because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 02:59 PM
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Originally posted by ServantOfTheLamb
reply to post by Akragon
 


I personally have no problem sharing this experience, and you both are misunderstanding. We fear you will hold no merit to personal revelations, and only criticize. I have already told one person on here that 10months ago God hit me like a brick to start studying the Bible. I hadn't gone to church in years, and am definitely not one to just go up and talk to people about God, but as of late I cannot contain myself. I fear my time to warn you all is running out, and I just want to make sure you know that if the rapture occurs and your left here during in the seven year tribulation there is a second chance.


There are much information on this planet when the mind is ready for it. I understand that some minds only look at one source of information for understanding. That is your choice. The only problem I have with dualistic christian:s is that some christian:s cannot understand that god has several way ready for the souls that are going home and are judging others that god has chosen.

And from my point of view soul brother Akragon is probably the least needing soul of any warning or spiritual guidance. To Akragon Namaste soul brother.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 03:03 PM
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Originally posted by LittleByLittle

Originally posted by ServantOfTheLamb
reply to post by Akragon
 


I personally have no problem sharing this experience, and you both are misunderstanding. We fear you will hold no merit to personal revelations, and only criticize. I have already told one person on here that 10months ago God hit me like a brick to start studying the Bible. I hadn't gone to church in years, and am definitely not one to just go up and talk to people about God, but as of late I cannot contain myself. I fear my time to warn you all is running out, and I just want to make sure you know that if the rapture occurs and your left here during in the seven year tribulation there is a second chance.


There are much information on this planet when the mind is ready for it. I understand that some minds only look at one source of information for understanding. That is your choice. The only problem I have with dualistic christian:s is that some christian:s cannot understand that god has several way ready for the souls that are going home and are judging others that god has chosen.

And from my point of view soul brother Akragon is probably the least needing soul of any warning or spiritual guidance. To Akragon Namaste soul brother.


I have no idea what point you are trying to get across?



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 03:22 PM
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Originally posted by BELIEVERpriest
reply to post by truejew
 


Faith is faith. Dead faith is the lack of faith. Acts depicted the temporary gifts of healing,prophecy and tongues. These legitamate fucntions of the Holy Spirit continued until the completion of the canon of scripture. There is no prophecy for the church age other than the rapture which closes the church age. There is no more speaking in tongues, or public healing in the Church age either. God may chose to heal as a response to prayer, but no man is a designated healer by the Holy Spirit. So emotional experience is not relevant. Part of the reason the chrch has apostacized is due to the dilusion of tongues, healing, and ecstatic emotion.


But now days you have reiki healing coming back even thought it is quite low effecting in most practitioners. You have people experiencing both synchronicity (prophecy/fate) and the speaking in tongue when they get awakened or wake up to crown chakra/third eye activation. Just because christianity lost the spiritual part, does not mean other religions did. And most spiritual people avoid the organised churches since they have nothing to offer but judging what they do not understand or have experienced.
edit on 2-9-2013 by LittleByLittle because: Spellchecking



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 03:28 PM
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reply to post by LittleByLittle
 


Yes and almost all of that information leads to nowhere, as it is designed to do.

More traps than you can wrap your head around, I grew up with parents who are evangelical and can be actually very spiritual, however they are forever being blasted with grace dogma that often routes them off into the wilderness, and then they go looking for help from , the SAME PLACE !

Man, I have had spiritual experiences that FAR outweigh anything you will feel when you "thought" you invited something into your heart, (fact is you just fired some network in your brain that had not been activated before).

It is very easy to see, that hope, faith and all other jargons tossed around are the very traps you think you are working through.

I have personally pulled a good 50 people out of this terrible loop, and you should see them living now, Christianity "Freed" them, but then what insane work it was to free them from THAT burden, it was even more difficult to replace all the fear they had been taught that was joy, and truth, with the knowledge that the lies CAN be found out, and have nothing to do with any entity in ANY FORM.

Oh man I cannot forget all the speeches of how some poor Hindu or Muslim or whatever kind of witchdoctor came across some amazing church, and then found Jesus and was transformed...

This same garbage and actual occurrences take place IN those other churches, but you have been told that is impossible, so you can never buy it.

As with any pyramid scheme, it is necessary to fill the perceptions of the sheep with tales of terrible woes, followed by the one and only answer...and then cap the believer into thinking an end all be all has been found, if only they can "accept it"!

Following your joy is a mantra just as stupid and weak as "saved thru grace" is,

As is how they have programmed most of the world into believing the feelings they have when confronted with opposing thoughts to the paradigm they are in, are actually FEAR, and since they do not know any better, they run from those feelings which would likely free them , and have FAR greater manifestation, power , and knowledge than any of there feelings before.

Realize that ALL religions are classified by the Masons themselves, in there highest books , as being Created by them , and they even show you how, and why...and it has nothing to do with any God that the peons believe they worship.

All are meant to dissuade from finding the real goings on, all are meant to brainwash, and are literally MIND KONTROL.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 03:34 PM
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Originally posted by BELIEVERpriest
reply to post by truejew
 


I agree, and no part of salvation ever involved work from the believer. Now, spiritual growth on the other hand is very laborous. All work must be done while filled with the Holy Spirit. Non-believers do not have the Holy Spirit, and therefore can not produce works of faith.


A view that I know is completely false by my own experience.

You can wake up instantly from a amygdala fear overload without being religious/believer before, but still have been walking the narrow path. Some souls only believe in higher ideals and god saves them also. By ideals and what we are we call the name and we get an answer.



posted on Sep, 2 2013 @ 03:45 PM
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Originally posted by ServantOfTheLamb

Originally posted by LittleByLittle

Originally posted by ServantOfTheLamb
reply to post by Akragon
 


I personally have no problem sharing this experience, and you both are misunderstanding. We fear you will hold no merit to personal revelations, and only criticize. I have already told one person on here that 10months ago God hit me like a brick to start studying the Bible. I hadn't gone to church in years, and am definitely not one to just go up and talk to people about God, but as of late I cannot contain myself. I fear my time to warn you all is running out, and I just want to make sure you know that if the rapture occurs and your left here during in the seven year tribulation there is a second chance.


There are much information on this planet when the mind is ready for it. I understand that some minds only look at one source of information for understanding. That is your choice. The only problem I have with dualistic christian:s is that some christian:s cannot understand that god has several way ready for the souls that are going home and are judging others that god has chosen.

And from my point of view soul brother Akragon is probably the least needing soul of any warning or spiritual guidance. To Akragon Namaste soul brother.


I have no idea what point you are trying to get across?


Go your road and be happy for it but do not judge a buddhist going his/hers road that will end up at the same end. If you play the duality game you will only get trapped with small understanding of the whole story.






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