Obama starts his move against Firearms...as he said he would.

A Harvard Study titled "Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide?" looks at figures for "intentional deaths" throughout continental Europe and juxtaposes them with the U.S. to show that more gun control does not necessarily lead to lower death rates or violent crime.

Because the findings so clearly demonstrate that more gun laws may in fact increase death rates, the study says that "the mantra that more guns mean more deaths and that fewer guns, therefore, mean fewer deaths" is wrong.

For example, when the study shows numbers for Eastern European gun ownership and corresponding murder rates, it is readily apparent that less guns to do not mean less death. In Russia, where the rate of gun ownership is 4,000 per 100,000 inhabitants, the murder rate was 20.52 per 100,000 in 2002. That same year in Finland, where the rater of gun ownership is exceedingly higher--39,000 per 100,000--the murder rate was almost nill, at 1.98 per 100,000.

The murder rate in Russia, where handguns are banned, is 30.6; the rate in the U.S. is 7.8

Study: No Correlation Between Gun Control and Less Violent Crime

The Study pdf

The detailed statistics are in the pdf link

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow


I gotta ask... Where are you finding transferable Class III weapons for a few thousand? Heck..it's more than academic curiosity and I'll leave it there but to show what I'm seeing to be asking.

Class III Weapons on current auction

That may be different by the time others see this link in days or weeks to come, and why I used it. It gives a rolling look at what is on offer to the public.

Right now though? Well.. They are cheaper than I'm used to seeing. They have one 'wanna-be' cheapie little AK on the bottom for $1,700+. (I wouldn't shoot that junk on a bet). They have a MAC-10 for $4,500..and that's still junk in a trunk, but if someone likes the 'spray and pray' approach, I guess it'll work.

Then what I'm more used to seeing over there, am MP-40 WW-II style for just a hair under $14,000.

Just as an FYI to those who this comes as a shock to.. (It's amazing how many people think machine guns are illegal..lol) These were on Gun Broker the last time I did a thing on availability of light to heavy machine guns.

The venerable M-60 (with some mods...but I remember the original ad saying all stock parts were still with it for swapping back)



A real, honest to goodness Uzi vs. the Semi-auto clap traps they peddle at gun shows and call safe & sane.



and finally, last but never ever least... This is, as I recall it, a reproduction model but 100% fully functional and serviceable off-brand of the famous and trusty M-2 Browning Heavy Machine Gun.



.....and Obama whines like a child about family members or friends giving a firearm without his permission (background loophole)

He's standing in a flood, asking for an umbrella and wondering why people think he's a silly fool.

Originally posted by wrabbit2000
reply to post by Indigo5

 

This could probably be solved much more effectively and within the values of our nation and legal system by making the penalty for possessing a weapon as a person prohibited (Felon.. Domestic Violence... Etc) so draconian, it does one of two things ..and I don't care which, honestly.

I am confused Rabbit? You want more severe penalities for folks that posses guns illegally?? Whilst doing nothing about the dealers who would sell those guns to kids and criminals? And many a drive-by shooting etc. is done by kids without adult convictions on thier record...so technically they aren't convicted felons and often have no record at all yet. Then we make possesion of a firearm by a minor a massive offense? it gets tricky fast...And I am still unclear why the folks selling the guns to the criminals and gangs should be left alone?

Originally posted by wrabbit2000

He's standing in a flood, asking for an umbrella and wondering why people think he's a silly fool.

Which is it? I thought he was destroying the 2nd amendment and comming for our guns?

reply to post by Indigo5


I would be all for execution of criminals using guns in a crime against other people.

reply to post by Indigo5

Which is it? I thought he was destroying the 2nd amendment and comming for our guns?

He is!

He's the king of back door Executive Orders. There will be more to follow, including a ridiculously high tax on guns and ammo.

HR3018

There must some clever wording hidden in the proposed legislation, because there are already laws in place to cover these particular issues.

Originally posted by Indigo5

Originally posted by wrabbit2000
reply to post by Indigo5

 

This could probably be solved much more effectively and within the values of our nation and legal system by making the penalty for possessing a weapon as a person prohibited (Felon.. Domestic Violence... Etc) so draconian, it does one of two things ..and I don't care which, honestly.

I am confused Rabbit? You want more severe penalities for folks that posses guns illegally?? Whilst doing nothing about the dealers who would sell those guns to kids and criminals? And many a drive-by shooting etc. is done by kids without adult convictions on thier record...so technically they aren't convicted felons and often have no record at all yet. Then we make possesion of a firearm by a minor a massive offense? it gets tricky fast...And I am still unclear why the folks selling the guns to the criminals and gangs should be left alone?

Indigo... You're contradicting your own point here.

Yes...I am 100% for almost brutal penalties to people who would criminally mishandle firearms. I'm as sick of it as the most rabid anti-gunner. I'm just equally sick of short and quick solutions for political outcomes that do more harm than good on a consistent basis.

Now, if a person in possession of a firearm is a felon under the wrong conditions...then how would SELLING them that firearm not make for an equal or higher crime? It IS...by the way..although unenforced much of the time.

That is the problem. Enforcement. We see these anti-gun fruit loops go to gun shows and buy all kinds of things for their hidden cameras and make big stories about how they caught laws being broken.

Ask them who they reported that to...aside from the public in the form of a story. Who is being prosecuted from the gotcha cam footage in the gun shows where illegal deals DO happen? VERY RARELY do I hear that the people IN the film actually committing the crime got busted for it. It's just "an example of why we need new laws."

Oh..No.. It's an example of why EXISTING laws would work FINE ...if they were ever enforced and then penalties were given to matter.

Where anyone EVER got the idea I was for being soft of people who peddle firearms to people who cannot legally own them or, by common sense, should NOT own them..is beyond me? Bag the bastards and let them share the cell next to their criminal customers.

Any proof yet that mr anti christ is taking away your guns, when i say proof i mean a law, not a blog, not a tv report, just good old proof.

How many different opion pieces a day do people need to base on how much they dispise the potus, too bad hes just a pupet and too bad nothing will change.

Keep up the complaints and blogs on the evilest man in the world, might make you forget whats really going on.

Just my 2 cents, oh and i wont reply to smily faces, personal attacks.

Have a good day

Good Luck getting all the guns Obama !!



Number of guns per capita by country

reply to post by wrabbit2000


Okay...enforce existing laws? I am all for that....Unfortunately the NRA and GOP have made that virtually impossible...

Honestly Rabbit...I know you have the intellectual courage to watch and listen whereas most posters don't.

Part 1
www.thedailyshow.com...

Part 2
www.thedailyshow.com...

Originally posted by wrabbit2000

Where anyone EVER got the idea I was for being soft of people who peddle firearms to people who cannot legally own them or, by common sense, should NOT own them..is beyond me? Bag the bastards and let them share the cell next to their criminal customers.

edit on 29-8-2013 by wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)

Because when I posted about folks that deal/sell guns to criminals your solution was pretty specific and focused on the purchaser?

Originally posted by wrabbit2000
reply to post by Indigo5

 

This could probably be solved much more effectively and within the values of our nation and legal system by making the penalty for possessing a weapon as a person prohibited (Felon.. Domestic Violence... Etc) so draconian, it does one of two things ..and I don't care which, honestly.

But I am glad you are for cracking down on folks that sell guns withou background checks or records as well.

Originally posted by seabag
reply to post by Indigo5

 

Which is it? I thought he was destroying the 2nd amendment and comming for our guns?

He is!

He's the king of back door Executive Orders. There will be more to follow, including a ridiculously high tax on guns and ammo.

HR3018

Yes...It's got an entire TWO congressmen backing it!

Fear monger much? Next up...the GOP have tried over 40 times to repeal Obamacare and failed and they have the majority in Congress!

But hell..yah...Just two congressmen looking to raise taxes on Ammo...That's going to pass...the tyrant Obama is comming for your guns.

It is a literal idiot factory around here.

Originally posted by neo96

Thursday on gun control, curbing the import of military surplus weapons and proposing to close a little-known loophole that lets felons and others circumvent background checks by registering guns to corporations.

That is another Obama lie. Felons can't own guns even using that 'corporate loophole' which most people call gun trusts.

Felons DON'T USE that method.They buy them out of a trunk. They don't go all that trouble.

And the biggest reason this is bullsnip.

Not a single shooting that went national used gun trusts.

Not one!

edit on 29-8-2013 by neo96 because: (no reason given)

^^ This.

Anyone watching this season of Breaking Bad? Does Walt buy his huge assault rifle through his car wash (that may be incorporated?) NO.

He buys it from some shady guy at a Waffle House parking lot.

Originally posted by MystikMushroom

Anyone watching this season of Breaking Bad? Does Walt buy his huge assault rifle through his car wash (that may be incorporated?) NO.

He buys it from some shady guy at a Waffle House parking lot.

Yah...If you saw some character on a TV show do it....it must be fact!

reply to post by neo96


Yes but amendments mean nothing to this guy .He uses them for toilet paper as far as I can see .

reply to post by Indigo5

Okay...enforce existing laws? I am all for that....Unfortunately the NRA and GOP have made that virtually impossible...

How So ? ^^^^^^^^



reply to post by Indigo5

Fear monger much? Next up...the GOP have tried over 40 times to repeal Obamacare and failed and they have the majority in Congress!

GOP majority is only in the House.
Senate majority is Democrat


Just leveling the table....

reply to post by Indigo5


So, criminals (with felonies) just walk into stores and buy brand new guns?

Originally posted by neo96

Thursday on gun control, curbing the import of military surplus weapons and proposing to close a little-known loophole that lets felons and others circumvent background checks by registering guns to corporations.

That is another Obama lie.

.......

And the biggest reason this is bullsnip.

Not a single shooting that went national used gun trusts.

Not one!

SPEAKING OF BS...

Christopher J. Dorner, the former Los Angeles police officer who embarked on a weeklong assault on law enforcement officers this month that ended with his death on Feb. 12, said in a rambling 11,000-word manifesto that he had used a gun trust to buy silencers and a short-barreled rifle from a gun store in Nevada without a background check.

....

A growing number of shooting enthusiasts are creating legal trusts to acquire machine guns, silencers or other items whose sale is restricted by federal law — a mechanism that bypasses the need to obtain law enforcement approval or even undergo criminal background checks.

www.nytimes.com...

Originally posted by MystikMushroom
reply to post by Indigo5

 

So, criminals (with felonies) just walk into stores and buy brand new guns?

edit on 29-8-2013 by MystikMushroom because: (no reason given)

But because of a loophole in federal regulations, buying restricted firearms through a trust also exempts the trust’s members from requirements that apply to individual buyers, including being fingerprinted, obtaining the approval of a chief local law enforcement officer and undergoing a background check.

www.nytimes.com...