yeah i guess im kinda stupid. i did smoke a lot of grass way back when, like this after noon its hard to read sometimes though after you smoke grass, esp to remember what you read. dwelling on the past and present is all jim dandy, but how are we to create a solution to problem of intriquetly intertwined coorperate influence on american infrastructure??? or mabye just forget it and all turn to the dark side *que star wars music*

Just read the Jay's Treaty, nothing it in indicated we are in debt forever. The only debt to be paid back to the Crown was all outstanding debt until the signing of the treaty (refered to as the "peace"). See article VI
earlyamerica.com...

Additionaly the Jay Treaty made provisions for insolvency. After reading this Treaty I cannot see any reason to assume that the Crown owns this country. Knowing the way Hamilton thought, there was now way he as Secutary of the Treasury, would allow something like that to happen. To be fair they could be other documents, later on, that references this idea. If there are any you know about please post them so I can view them.

Just read the Jay's Treaty, nothing it in indicated we are in debt forever. The only debt to be paid back to the Crown was all outstanding debt until the signing of the treaty (refered to as the "peace"). See article VI
earlyamerica.com...

Additionaly the Jay Treaty made provisions for insolvency. After reading this Treaty I cannot see any reason to assume that the Crown owns this country. Knowing the way Hamilton thought, there was now way he as Secutary of the Treasury, would allow something like that to happen. To be fair they could be other documents, later on, that references this idea. If there are any you know about please post them so I can view them.

Nope. I have my original Birth Certificate. Not a single foreign stamp on it. So your entire argument is shot in the arse, IMO.

JSOBECKY

You have your original copy? I thought that was fairly impossible. But anyway, there are documented cases of this happening. You sure it's not a copy? You have to get the one held by the County Clerk. But anyway, though I highly doubt it's not true that our birth certificates aren't security, there is no way that would shoot my argument down in the arse.

Becuase, in fact, it is not an argument. It's the way things are, and the details of this are far more broad than birth certificates. So, if you wish to pick up a manual of the UCC, Federal Reserve Act, Trading with the Enemies Act and its Amendment in 1933, by all means do so, and prove me wrong. But, I think you will get much further if you review this documents in the spirit of insight. Every citizen should know the history and function of their government.

But anyway, Jay's Treaty said that the amount of debt owed was to be determined later, and since many of these merchants were owned, at least in a part, by the Crown, there is a partial argument there. But the idea that America is still a British Colony is not something I am fairly knowledgable about. There are a wealth of books and resources that will be able to explain it better than I.

So, I recommend to all to realize that this is merely an introduction and if you are truly honest about gaining more knowledge on this particular subject, in the end, you will have to take upon yourself to learn.

Nah, I don't believe a word of it. Pure speculation. Words on a piece of paper. You know what we do with those, don't you?

Besides

Ridiculous. Besides the fact that one must be of legal age to enter into a contract, this would be an example of illegal indenture.

Sorry, Jamuhn. I just can't take this seriously.

"An rebutted affadavit becomes the judgement in commerce."

It is true what you say, but since you are not fully aware of your contractual obligations it is, in effect, occuring at birth.

By the way, you never told me what the deal was with your birth certificate.

But honestly, I really don't care if you take me seriously or not on this. All I am asking is that you at least do a little bit of OUTSIDE research on the subject apart from this thread. It will be worth your time.

[edit on 13-11-2004 by Jamuhn]

jamuhn..isnt' it funny how others disprove this type of info with one word confermations...i guess if you google 'ridiculous' you will find a whole bunch of info on this subject also, you don't have you ORIGINAL birth certicicate.....the one i have says that it is a 'official reproduction' of the original.

how many people have stopped paying on thier credit cards?? i don't know but, those that i do know have never been taken to court to get them to pay it back. why would that be?? didn't they sign a contract saying that they will pay it back? so why isn't there legal action?? yes, SOME have there wages garnished but the VAST majority nothing happens. ( i will do what i hate to see...that is state something as true without backing it up with some type documentation..i have lost the info....) because you unknowingly entered into a fradulent agreement there are clauses in the UCC that outline when and what a bank can charge interest on......unsecured lines of credit are not covered....the banks know that so they charge off the delinquent credit card account and give it to a 3rd party to collect on. if one wanted you can settle for as little as 1 third of the original account balance....most of that $$ goes to the 3rd party and not the bank....

do i digress??..no.. it comes back to what J was saying about the UCC. it is a quagmire of legal B.S. that is meant to confuse us to the point that we do not, will not look into it and do our own homework. we will get a British Acredited Registy lawyer....B.A.R. for those in the knowingly bought cheap seats. why 'british'????

here are some links..questions and reference links

a page of links

carefull..these are probably far right wing kook links and you brain may be sucked out of your ears and into your computer......or is it just a whole heck of a lot of reading?????

Don't see the point really. If you take yourself out of the system you would have to be completely self sufficient. It would be annoying and time consuming as well. See what happens when you get pulled over by a cop and you show them a DL that doesn't match the state issued one. Sure, you may be able to get the arrest overturned in the maritime (read: Military) court if you have an impeccable common law lawyer. But you're still going to jail. You're still going to lose time/money from whatever work you do. Try to get an account anywhere without an SS number. Banks, Credit Cards, Department Stores.

The system is completely rigged. The good news is they left many loop holes open for their friends.

So...

you could just,

1. Open an offshore bank account in Euros (the dollar is going to fall hard)
2. Start an offshore corporation in a tax haven (Belize is nice)
3. Start a Nevada corporation with the offshore corporation listed for the 4 roles needed (Nevada corporation meetings can be held anywhere in the world)
4. Sell Crap to people with too much credit
5. Buy an island behind a barrier reef somewhere (Belize is nice)
6. Tell the Corporation "Kiss my tan ..."

Not necessarily Shadow. The point is take control of the name which you interact with the state and the government. As well, if your name is ever again put on official documents (like if a cop sends you to jail), before they do so you serve them with a copyright notice saying that if they write your name down, they will have to pay fines of copyright infringment. Then, it's a catch22 for the police. If the write your name down, you sue them. If they don't write your name down, you sue them for an illegal jailing.

They will let you go, as I have heard, the police officers will call their superiors when confronted with copyright papers and the superiors always let them go.

Now, there is a lot more to it, so don't go and try it, but it's a start.

I've looked into this particular aspect of the game and I agree there is a lot more to it. However, I've not read anything about the copyright of your name. Please explain that further. If possible, can you provide some background such as exerts from the U.S. Code.

And, most important I think, have you done anything towards this aim?

I once had an Internation Driver's License which worked as I got pulled over twice with it. But the laws have changed on that. Now you have to get a valid U.S. license in a certain period of time.

The one thing I was thinking of doing is getting out of the Social Security system. You are supposed to get back everything you paid into the SS "redistribution of wealth" machine.

Anyway, there is always interest in these topics. Heck, it's a conspiracy board. Sure we have plenty of cointelpro on here but it's mostly people that don't realize they are helping the system. General Law is what's it's called I think.

When one copyrights their name, it is done through British common law, a common law copyright. But there is a lot more to it, and I cannot go further into it. There are many resources out there.

Hey, J, my computer does not like this link. Any ideas??



[edit on 13-11-2004 by DontTreadOnMe]

Link

Weird, it's not working for me either. You will just have to copy and paste it I guess.

Still no good, but Shados's link worked.
Here's another scary excerpt:
source
And, no Jamuhn, I do not think you are making too much out of this...or reading too much into this. I think this is IRL.
There's a whole load of bills and addenda that are passed by the various legislatures throught out this land. They either get NO publicity or are passed in the middle of the night. Geez, I remember the good ole days, when the biggest concern was for the pork that got enacted into law at 3 a.m.

[edit on 13-11-2004 by DontTreadOnMe]

I just check, the new military id, your name is not all caps.... I don't know what that means but it's not

I don't have a military ID, so I don't know. To figure it out, you would have to look at the contract involved when joining the military.

Like I said, I'm not trying to argue and I don't have all the answers, but what I have posted is truthful. Contractual relationships in general (such as with the military, which is additional to the one between trade name and US corp.) must be taken on a case by case basis.

[edit on 13-11-2004 by Jamuhn]