Internet Architects Plan Counter-Attack On NSA Snooping

Originally posted by PapagiorgioCZ
I think you don't know enough evil people so you can't imagine the world can look like soon.
Internet is (also) a scary and dangerous anarchistic place. One day you may pray for these alphabet stripped and starred tough, freckled and brave boys and girls so they can handle the situation instead of you.

Uh huh. Sure the internet is terrifying and anarchistic, the world is full of evil doers and the spies are gonna save us all. Frankly we and the internet don't need the parasitic alphabet agencies protecting us from their paranoid delusions. Most of us are praying for protection against those very agencies.

reply to post by Bassago


The internet Version 2

see i knew it was coming!

Originally posted by JBA2848
They need to come up with a data cable encryption device you can connect to your monitor and key board as a package that works together.

As long as they have the patent office wanting all the encryption software you use and they control the internet hubs your just out of luck. They can spy on you.

The data cable is plausible but I think they're going for a software solution. As far as patent office issues are concerned whatever is created will most likely be heavily debated, modified, tested and fully documented in a RFC anyway. It's pretty much public material. My hope is that once they devise the method it won't matter (at least for a while.)

reply to post by Bassago


As long as you do it with software you can be spied on. The government has teamed up with Invidia and they make your video cards. They even created a ghost user on systems with access to all of the files on your computer. Invidia is supplying NSA with all the heavily modified K10 Tesla cards to build there Super Computers. Hell Snowden was at the University studying under the Invidia program learning about Scientific Video Cards and that is how he became a Tech for the NSA. So if it is done in software they continue to spy. Hardware as a small device used between your computer and monitor/keyboard would be the way to go. Just like the cable box used on a TV or a modem for internet access. A box for personal encryption. Why not. It is simpler then people think.

But then again getting it past the patent office and NSA spying there would be hard.

No way-anyway. There are none better at cracking codes and encriptions worldwide than the NSA and others like them.

And as long as our stuff gets "sent"...it can be intercepted, broken down. No matter what we come up with...the net belongs to everyone..including TPTB...and they've spent...and will continue to spend...black-budget BILLIONS $$$$ to intercept it.

As long as we use cables, microwave and satt transmissions...nothing will ever be safe.

If you can SEND something...they can and will...intercept and break it. Its what they do best....and have the $$$$ and desire...and talent...to do it.

reply to post by mysterioustranger

reply to post by JBA2848


Like this?





It was a piece of cake.........

Originally posted by mysterioustranger
No way-anyway. There are none better at cracking codes and encriptions worldwide than the NSA and others like them.

If you can SEND something...they can and will...intercept and break it. Its what they do best....and have the $$$$ and desire...and talent...to do it.

Yes that's true to a point however there is no need for us to make it any easier on them. Yes they have huge black budgets to crush the little people but they are not super powerful. Anything they can create can be overcome, it will just take some work.

reply to post by mysterioustranger


Can you do it with the text? Try it. Don't just copy the picture. The text is what the NSA needs in order to data mine it. But the picture and avoiding the standards put in place by our friends the international stanards guys who give words and letters and so on a numbered meaning which is used for doing auto translate and even spying on what you are talking about looking for trigger words in order to flag you is defeated with the picture.

reply to post by Bassago

agreed....some forget too about old spy movies we'd watch where stuff has hidden in, under and around things like pictures, texts etc.

They always knew and found them out....our country as well used the very same spy techniques. There was always a way they could find them hidden.....

reply to post by mysterioustranger


I know the State Department was doing some weird crap not to long ago. I came across a script that was to be used to alter Microsoft Word and caused Microsoft Word to use a Video Codec to read the text document. I forget where they were using it. I want to say it was in Egypt Uprising started the first time against Mubarak. I held on to the file which explained how to install the single line of script in order to alter Microsoft Word for a while but never seen anything else about it. So I never knew what it was used for. I also seen where they were using the photos of citizen journalist during those protest to hide text under the photos of the journalist and photographers of stories. So they are still using these techniques.

reply to post by JBA2848

Courtesy of: WIKIPEDIA/Steganography (cut and paste link) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steganography

Ok..I am saying since all this…and more ....already exists and they know about it…it can be broken. That’s all.

WIKIPEDIA:
“Modern steganography entered the world in 1985 with the advent of the personal computers being applied to classical steganography problems.[4] Development following that was very slow, but has since taken off, going by the large number of steganography software available:
Concealing messages within the lowest bits of noisy images or sound files.
Concealing data within encrypted data or within random data. The data to be concealed are first encrypted before being used to overwrite part of a much larger block of encrypted data or a block of random data (an unbreakable cipher like the one-time pad generates ciphertexts that look perfectly random if one does not have the private key).
Chaffing and winnowing.
Mimic functions convert one file to have the statistical profile of another. This can thwart statistical methods that help brute-force attacks identify the right solution in a ciphertext-only attack.
Concealed messages in tampered executable files, exploiting redundancy in the targeted instruction set.
Pictures embedded in video material (optionally played at slower or faster speed).
Injecting imperceptible delays to packets sent over the network from the keyboard. Delays in keypresses in some applications (telnet or remote desktop software) can mean a delay in packets, and the delays in the packets can be used to encode data.
Changing the order of elements in a set.
Content-Aware Steganography hides information in the semantics a human user assigns to a datagram. These systems offer security against a non-human adversary/warden.
Blog-Steganography. Messages are fractionalized and the (encrypted) pieces are added as comments of orphaned web-logs (or pin boards on social network platforms). In this case the selection of blogs is the symmetric key that sender and recipient are using; the carrier of the hidden message is the whole blogosphere.
Modifying the echo of a sound file (Echo Steganography).[5]
Secure Steganography for Audio Signals.[6]
Image bit-plane complexity segmentation steganography
Including data in ignored sections of a file, such as after the logical end of the carrier file.
Making text the same color as the background in word processor documents, e-mails, and forum posts"

All these things are not new. To us...or them...
.

reply to post by mysterioustranger


And pretty much none of the software that NSA is using for mass interception and spying looks for any of it. They have to send them to a analyst who then has to sit down and figure it out. By beating there automation you beat there mass spying. By using the standards put in place you allow them to auto mate there mass spying.

Originally posted by JBA2848
reply to post by mysterioustranger

 

Can you do it with the text? Try it. Don't just copy the picture. The text is what the NSA needs in order to data mine it. But the picture and avoiding the standards put in place by our friends the international stanards guys who give words and letters and so on a numbered meaning which is used for doing auto translate and even spying on what you are talking about looking for trigger words in order to flag you is defeated with the picture.

edit on 25-8-2013 by JBA2848 because: (no reason given)

It depends on if they try to read every image, that software is readily available and can be applied in real time, spammers do it constantly to defeat captcha. Quite frankly it's such a basic concept that not automatically attempting to read the text on every image would be a huge oversight. I give them a little more credit than that.

reply to post by Strewth


Yeah not I have a hole in the middle of My telly thanks.

Seriously though this is cool and great news.

reply to post by stormcell

Originally posted by stormcell

Originally posted by Bassago
reply to post by mideast

 

Not really. If an underlying protocol layer could be implemented using 256 bit AES encryption and a large random generated key it would take a huge amount of brute force to decrypt. It would also take years even with a super computer. This tech is already publicly available. We just need to incorporate it and make it user friendly.

It would have to operate at the hardware level at the "physical level" of the TCP/IP stack. NSA could still have out-of-band communication with the network board via the internet. Basically they could have secret data packets that is only read by the hardware and not sent up to the operating-system - the postal equivalent would be those bar codes that couriers like Fed-Ex use.

Here's an example - certain servers that are switched off can be activated where a "magic packet" can be sent to the MAC address of that PC despite it being switched off. That means the network chip is always active and listening to the network despite the PC being switched off... what else on the PC is still active?

www.cyberciti.biz...

The quasi magic packet would still be visible on a protocol analyzer. And a savvy network administrator could probably block it at the border router.

Dex

I once worked for a company that was a member of the IETF. In fact the project that I worked on was IPSec/ISAKMP. That's the encryption and key management protocol used in most VPNs today.

These engineers are quite talented and highly intelligent. And, for the most part, they tend to be non-conformist and distrustful of government. If there were a mole in their midst, he would likely be ferreted out relatively quickly. In any event, when a new protocol or algorithm is defined it is publicly debated, revised and tested for quite some time before it becomes a standard.

Several years ago I heard a rumor from some engineers who had spooks as close friends who indicated that the NSA has been employing quantum computing technology to decrypt encrypted messages in real-time. Does anyone remember how the US government suddenly dropped its opposition to export of encryption technology in the 90's under the Clinton administration?...

Now my question is why is a new protocol necessary. SSL, SSH, TLS, IPSec, etc. already exist. End-to-end encryption is already feasible, it just needs to be more widely implemented. But, as was previously stated in another post, traffic analysis can still yield a considerable amount of information.

And typically data at the endpoints are stored in the clear, so a sweeping Homeland Security search warrant can be used to get any data they want. Not to mention that the technology to read data from a computer monitor based on it EM signature has been around since the 1960's. If you really want to be afraid just google "blackhat."

I applaud the efforts of the IETF. As the RSA chief scientist put it, "it is a noble goal." But I believe it is nearly impossible to lock out the spooks who have virtually unlimited budgets for analysts, equipment, and other technology. Not to mention the power congress has handed them to pretty much do anything they want.

Dex

reply to post by Bassago


If I was super rich I would create a non-US based fully encrypted Google infrastructure for the rest of the world. There's a real market there now, big time huge.

reply to post by Bassago


Once again, leave it up to the free market and voluntary effort to fight the tyrannical state.

Who says the free market doesn't work? Even something as big and omnipotent as the NSA can't control it.

Don't forget what Obama said on Jay Leno : "THERE IS NO DOMESTIC SPYING PROGRAM"