Proof we were Created - Yes, I said Proof!

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

All roads lead one direction--to a creator.

You may be right, but you're searching for the wrong one.

On what foundation do you make this claim? If not the invariably symmetric creator, then who or what? God is not yielding to error and His word demonstrates all levels of natural law as a perfect mirror above and below. How much more clearly can it be made manifest?

Show me one source that can demonstrate at this level of perfection as compared to nature itself.

reply to post by EnochWasRight


This has to be the most ridiculous and ironic thing I've read about creationism in years.

Let's start with the irony.

First, let's get one thing out of the way. An argument ad hominem (WIKI) is an argument made against the opponent (or even belief system) and not at the evidence itself. I understand that this is the typical approach from most here on ATS.

You'd probably be correct about that, but here's the irony. Before this statement, you said the following:

I will show you undeniable proof that Creation over Evolution is the primary truth appealing to the rational mind. Delusion can be the only state of mind for anyone trying to cling to any other conclusion.

That is a direct ad-hominem attack on anybody who doesn't immediately agree with you, having read your OP or otherwise. So right off the bat, your credibility in trying to create an argument and a subsequent discussion, that is healthy and informative is entirely gone.

Now here's my other problem.

You expect me to take your opinion as fact. You expect me to take spurious math calculations, combine that with your, as well as some random's personal interpretation of scripture as a means of believing that Creationism is correct.

Effectively you want me to rely on the same things, that faith in general makes me rely on.

Nothing at all, but somebody's opinion and personal interpretations. Well considering I'm my own person and make my own decisions based on factual evidence and arguments, I cannot in good conscience do what you are asking.

What you've actually proven is that once again, in order for somebody to 'believe' in bible, you must investigate, read between the lines and actually make stuff up a lot of the time to justify what's in there.

Here's the thing about God. He would not be this complicated. Nor would he have shown up just the once, to get himself killed, then never show up again. Considering that our society and world is in far worse shape than it ever was when God actually is stated to have 'intervened', I call shenanigans.

Forgive me for my bluntness, but God isn't a single parent who writes books.

~Tenth

Originally posted by cosmicexplorer
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

If any god exists they are asleep at the wheel....

That is a biblical concept know as longsuffering. It's God's nature. You must be born again and you have been here many times. The veil over your consciousness keeps you from knowing this fact. God is raising you as a child. As such, you will not see until the image is removed. God is not the one asleep.

1 Corinthians 13

11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

reply to post by MDDoxs



thats why you go to the original Hebrew text

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant
Macbeth, Act II, Scene III

Macbeth says:
"The spring, the head, the fountain of your blood."

If you employ the same convoluted mathematics from your links to the above line, the result is 3.141584569 x 10^69, en even closer approximation.

Turns out Shakespeare was God.

You might have missunderstod the OP.

You should get exactly: 3.1415 no more than 4 desimals.

But i think the biggest different is that Macbeth text is about a different thing altogether compared to the text in the bible. That is probably why you ended up With a greater desimal.

Originally posted by Cuervo
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

I believe in creation and evolution. Since we can prove evolution already, I'm always excited when somebody also proposes evidence pointing to an intelligent design. However, this doesn't actually prove anything. You are using the same ole' circular logic that most people do concerning the bible. You are using an insulated system to prove that very same system. Logic can not not work that way nor can evidence. But... BUT...

It does prove it by many witnesses. Nature is a witness as a mirror. DNA is a witness as in a mirror. The letters of Hebrew speak directly to the letters of creation being WORD. It is evident on levels that probability cannot handle. When the probability reaches a certain point, we say that something is evident. Apart from any evidence against, it is solid proof that cannot be denied. My other witness is the fact that no reply in this thread has yet to reach out with anything other than Ad Hominem as a foundation. If the evidence itself cannot be refuted, it stands for now.

If there were not enough, the statements in Revelation, Isaiah and Matthew 24 all describe our current historical difficulties of tyranny with a precision that cannot be denied. Again, I cannot fathom how anyone misses it. It's in our faces with clarity.

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant
Macbeth, Act II, Scene III

Macbeth says:
"The spring, the head, the fountain of your blood."

If you employ the same convoluted mathematics from your links to the above line, the result is 3.141584569 x 10^69, en even closer approximation.

Turns out Shakespeare was God.

You might have missunderstod the OP.

You should get exactly: 3.1415 no more than 4 desimals.

But i think the biggest different is that Macbeth text is about a different thing altogether compared to the text in the bible. That is probably why you ended up With a greater desimal.

I understand. My point being is that these kinds of things happen in other texts, and the fact that it happened in the Bible should not validate the Bible as being written by a god.

reply to post by EnochWasRight


God is not in a book, that's for sure. To say so is to limit him to a few thousand pages in an ancient book, not very fair to him if you ask me.

You're stuck in a revolving door going round and round and round, digging deeper and deeper into a rabbit hole that never ends. Your search has made you delusional, seeing signs in numbers and words that aren't there and creating connections that don't exist. The only one who thinks what you're saying is clear is yourself.

You have been trapped into believing one concept and never letting go of it. God is not in a book, he's everywhere, inside of you and outside of you. You only look outside of yourself, that is your biggest mistake in my opinion.

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant
Macbeth, Act II, Scene III

Macbeth says:
"The spring, the head, the fountain of your blood."

If you employ the same convoluted mathematics from your links to the above line, the result is 3.141584569 x 10^69, en even closer approximation.

Turns out Shakespeare was God.

You might have missunderstod the OP.

You should get exactly: 3.1415 no more than 4 desimals.

But i think the biggest different is that Macbeth text is about a different thing altogether compared to the text in the bible. That is probably why you ended up With a greater desimal.

I understand. My point being is that these kinds of things happen in other texts, and the fact that it happened in the Bible should not validate the Bible as being written by a god.

The Bible is not written by God. There is only two Things i know of that God has written.

1. The writing on the wall.
2. The 10 commandments.

Jesus, Lived to manifest Our written Word of God.

reply to post by EnochWasRight


I hold with ToTheTenthPower's post. He has essentially expressed every flaw I feel is blatantly evident in virtually every thread you have posted so far. If I see your name as the author of any thread from this day forward, I will most likely close the thread immediately. You have cried wolf far too many times, Enoch. I no longer believe in your wolf, nor trust your judgment in recognizing one.

Have a good one.

Originally posted by auraelium

The Dead Sea Scrolls demonstrate that the word is accurate and preserved by 99.9% accuracy.

Meanings of Phoenician have been known forever. It is not until recently that we now know that Phoenician is the root of all semetic languages. A guy named Jeff Binner has come out with a good lexicon showing each of the 22 letters of Phoenician as compared to the 22 of Hebrew. They are the same. We know the meaning.

None of the dead sea scrolls written in Phoenician, they are written in Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek, and Nabataean which including Phoenician are all descended from Ugaritic which is the root language of all semetics not Phoenician.

"Phoenician was a language originally spoken in the coastal (Mediterranean) region then called "Canaan" in Phoenician, Arabic, Greek, and Aramaic, "Phoenicia" in Greek and Latin, and "Pūt" in Ancient Egyptian. Phoenician is a Semitic language of the Canaanite subgroup; its closest living relative is Hebrew, to which it is very similar. WIKIPEDIA

Ask any Hebrew scholar about the meaning of the Letters of Hebrew compared to the Phoenician and he will tell you that they are the same. I have a book here at my side by a Hebrew Rabbi. The letters of his book match perfectly. They are the same. Even the shape of the letters are nearly alike to Hebrew. Early Hebrew was Phoenician, also used by Abraham at that period of time. They have even found these letters in America on rocks near sites that practice Hebrew rituals.

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant
Macbeth, Act II, Scene III

Macbeth says:
"The spring, the head, the fountain of your blood."

If you employ the same convoluted mathematics from your links to the above line, the result is 3.141584569 x 10^69, en even closer approximation.

Turns out Shakespeare was God.

You might have missunderstod the OP.

You should get exactly: 3.1415 no more than 4 desimals.

But i think the biggest different is that Macbeth text is about a different thing altogether compared to the text in the bible. That is probably why you ended up With a greater desimal.

I understand. My point being is that these kinds of things happen in other texts, and the fact that it happened in the Bible should not validate the Bible as being written by a god.

The Bible is not written by God. There is only two Things i know of that God has written.

1. The writing on the wall.
2. The 10 commandments.

Jesus, Lived to manifest Our written Word of God.

edit on 27.06.08 by spy66 because: (no reason given)

Surely you can't really be missing my point.

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant

Originally posted by EnochWasRight

Originally posted by Wertdagf
This bull%&*^ only works in English?... and its not even pi? That's not proof....

We should all be wary because people that make threads like these always end up hurting themselves or others.

edit on 24-8-2013 by Wertdagf because: (no reason given)

It's always important you read the OP first. Here is the link to the HEBREW. HEBREW WORDS

Your argument is based on Ad Hominem, speaking down on the object rather than speaking to the subject. Try a different approach after you read the OP.

I don't see how you can continuously deny the fact that this occurs in other non religious texts.

In the OP, I used Greek and Latin. Again, read the OP.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

God is not in a book, that's for sure. To say so is to limit him to a few thousand pages in an ancient book, not very fair to him if you ask me.

You're stuck in a revolving door going round and round and round, digging deeper and deeper into a rabbit hole that never ends. Your search has made you delusional, seeing signs in numbers and words that aren't there and creating connections that don't exist. The only one who thinks what you're saying is clear is yourself.

You have been trapped into believing one concept and never letting go of it. God is not in a book, he's everywhere, inside of you and outside of you. You only look outside of yourself, that is your biggest mistake in my opinion.

As long as you are using the word "you" and "God" as objects describing your bias, you are using the Ad Hominem argument. It's a fallacy.

Speak to the subject.

reply to post by EnochWasRight


I have been known to create things, I am a creator. We are all creators. Is it possible that the Yahweh of the bible is not the One Infinite Creator in it's entirety, but rather an individualized portion of the Intelligent Infinity that some may refer to as "God"? That is, is it possible that Yahweh is only a sub-creator, or sub-logos, of the Infinite Creator in it's entirety?

Anyway, thank you for making this thread, I find your threads to be some of the most compelling and well-presented on all of ATS, perhaps I'll return later after having further studied the material presented.

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

Nothing proves that more than the acceptance of other Non judeo christian based religions and philosophy.

Say you have proof of Niburu and it makes the front page, but say you have a logical argument for anything Christianity has to offer ...

in my college days I was atheist and I could not see a christian argument as worth even listening to, it took monumental circumstances for me to change my views.

All we can do is plant the seed.

edit on 24-8-2013 by benrl because: (no reason given)

Sorry you had to endure the circumstances you did to make that change. Sadly many don't get that chance. What I am most excited about all of it is that I am made in his image. That is an extremely exciting thought and gives me great hope for the future. I look forward to the day when I am free and this image is released.

Our spirit, or soul must be beautiful.

The Bot

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by TheTalentedMrBryant
Macbeth, Act II, Scene III

Macbeth says:
"The spring, the head, the fountain of your blood."

If you employ the same convoluted mathematics from your links to the above line, the result is 3.141584569 x 10^69, en even closer approximation.

Turns out Shakespeare was God.

You might have missunderstod the OP.

You should get exactly: 3.1415 no more than 4 desimals.

But i think the biggest different is that Macbeth text is about a different thing altogether compared to the text in the bible. That is probably why you ended up With a greater desimal.

I understand. My point being is that these kinds of things happen in other texts, and the fact that it happened in the Bible should not validate the Bible as being written by a god.

The Bible is not written by God. There is only two Things i know of that God has written.

1. The writing on the wall.
2. The 10 commandments.

Jesus, Lived to manifest Our written Word of God.

edit on 27.06.08 by spy66 because: (no reason given)

Surely you can't really be missing my point.

I think i must be missing Your point, if what i said made no sense?

reply to post by EnochWasRight


What was one of the first things you typed in the OP? That anyone who disagrees with you is delusional. Tit for tat my friend.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

I hold with ToTheTenthPower's post. He has essentially expressed every flaw I feel is blatantly evident in virtually every thread you have posted so far. If I see your name as the author of any thread from this day forward, I will most likely close the thread immediately. You have cried wolf far too many times, Enoch. I no longer believe in your wolf, nor trust your judgment in recognizing one.

Have a good one.

You have argued against every thread I have ever authored. Why should your statement above appear different in the next thread I author? Speak to the subject. It is evident. I have nothing to do with it other than showing why it is so. In every post, I have added more information as an additional layer. ATS has the mandate to deny ignorance. Attacking me does not deny the OP.

reply to post by spy66


Many things in the Bible are paraphrased renditions of writings from cultures both older and far removed. This is evidence that a great deal of the Bible is not actually original, but an amalgamation of an unspecified number of cultures. That is the point MrBryant was making.