Hmmm! Well wasn't the particular strain of Ames anthrax virus spread during the post-911 period directly traceable back to Porton Down?
And isn't anthrax vaccine producer Bioport merely a commercial arm of Porton Down? Note the 'port' bit
And wasn't Dr David Kelly,a Porton Down scientist, murdered apparently because of his insider knowledge of non-existant Iraqi bioweapons, factually because of his insider knowledge of homeland bioweapons to be used against the homeland populations, as maybe applied to all those other eminent microbiologists who have died under mysterious circumstances?
And haven't we got lots of questions about the origin of AIDS, Ebola, BSE/vCJD?
And might not chemtrails have a lot to answer for?
And might it be that DNA/RNA are vibratory strings, as well as particulate, that can be infested with viruses attenuated through the HAARP/chemtrails/cell tower network?
And do you think things have changed since these early primitive experiments on the human race?

yeah wouldnt effect the human race.. sickness nad after diease the random unioin will find away to get back

Fair enough.

All of the bacteria used where harmless though (or thought to be, even then they are only dangerous to certain, highly susceptible individuals), and i doubt the MOD has neither the need or the will to mass poison the population. I am not concerned if they do it now, I know people within the MOD, and they all have families and children, so are unlikely to do anything harmful.

It does state in that report that the MOD was more concerned with how spores/bacterium spread than testing the bacteria themselves, as it was highlighted that a plane skirting the territorial airspace could infect the entire UK with an Aerosol suspended pathogen.

I am aware of the place, I am also aware of other experiments that the MOD has done. Mostly on willing subjects I might add. And some where rather amusing, others slightly more disturbing...But hey, back on topic:

The mass aerial spraying of e-coli is insignificant as the bacteria would die. They where only used in that experiment to compare how far spores travel compared to normal bacterium. The other bacterium where harmless, and you would probably be at more risk from going to a Hospital or a public toilet.

Like I said, I wouldn't panic, nor object, as it is not harmfull. They where doing it to study how best to prepare for a suspected REAL bio attack by the Soviets, which was a probability.

You haven't answered my question; Are you saying it's OK to spray massive quantities of living bacteria across populated areas as it would only be dangerous to certain, highly suceptible individuals?

The mass aerial spraying of e-coli is insignificant as the bacteria would die.

The bacteria were sprayed at night, during the winter months for the express reason of ensuring they reached their target areas before dying. In other words, residents of the target areas would have inhaled and ingested the E.coli before they had a chance to die.

In later trials, the E.coli were encapsulated in a protective substance in order to keep them alive in daylight and in a contaminated environment.



It's important to remember that these bacteria were deliberately sized in order to mimic a real BW agent. That is, they were sized to get past the body's natural defences and reach the alvioli, the deepest part of the lung.

They where only used in that experiment to compare how far spores travel compared to normal bacterium

Wrong. I don't know where you got that information from? Even Porton Down haven't tried to say that.

E.coli and Bacillus subtilis were used together in the experiments.

If you suffered from a serious underlying disease, these experiments were potentially lethal. According to Prof Spratt the experiments could have caused blood poisoning or pneumonia, neither of which are to be treated lightly.

You have to remember that not many people in the Government were aware of these experiments. No official Government policy permission was asked for or given for them to be conducted. Authority rested with the Director of MRE Porton Down.

For that reason alone, it makes a mockery of saying that the MOD wouldn't risk harming people. Hardly anyone in the MOD new about them. If you check the history of the MRE Porton Down you will find it was autonomous, a law unto itself.


zero lift



[edit on 12-11-2004 by zero lift]

Lots of time and effort goes into predicting the next biological weapon,

The UK BW experiments to which I referred are likely to be conducted for large area detection purposes. Not BW weapons prediction. The work is sponsored by the UK Ministry of Defence and is not, repeat not designed for the protection of the general public. Dstl Porton Down have stated many times that BW protection for the general public is the responsibility of the Home Office, not the MOD.

You infer that the danger presented by a pandemic of avian influenza being greater than these proposed UK BW public area experiments. Well that's obvious. But the difference is that I can lobby effectively against the MOD BW experiments, whereas lobbying against governmental inaction on the dangers of avian influenza is a much more difficult situation.


zero lift

Tom wrote

There is a program on BBC4 tonight about the lost Village of Imber. A ghost town not far from Porton Down I believe? Now a MOD base.

Funnily enough Tom, Porton have often used this "commandeered" village in order to investigate the use of various Chemical Weapons. The information on these experiments is just starting to enter the public domain.

A large series of aircraft delivered mock nerve agent attacks took place at Imber during the late 1950s - early 1960s. Sea Venom aircraft "attacked" infantry who were dispersed around Imber because of the threat of tactical nukes.
The aircraft contaminated the soldiers with Diethyl phthalate, used as a V agent simulant. (Phthalates are now being investigated as a possible health threat)


zero lift