The video game industry needs new product

reply to post by mikegrouchy


HEHEHE love it!

Anyway, we could do this. Perhaps not easily but if we could generate an appealing trailer and set up a kickstarter campaign then there is no telling how far we could go with it.


Maybe something set in the future, based on (but not identical to) the alien races popular among Conspiracy Theorists, in which Earth was conquered and turned into a commerce planet.

The visual style would be best described as Intergalactic Oriental.

Genre: RPG

Originally posted by Thorneblood
We could do an entirely separate thread on fantasy art....especially in Video Games.

For some reason i am constantly finding great fantasy art pics that could be spun into amazing games but are never used.

Your right,
I'm drifting.

Here I'll try to reconverge.


I feel that no one has really made a video game
that is conducive to telling a story.

No one yet.

The quest system is growing repetitive.

I think this is what people really mean when they say the want epic.


Mike

reply to post by mikegrouchy


I agree, most quest systems seem so bland and i never got why...

I would love to set up a more traditional rpg style game that worked on module based quests instead of the typical stuff we see now.

Think of how D&D works now, make a character and choose your own adventure instead of following a standard storyline you would work through a series of modules as you leveled up your char.

I think the value of old school D&D lay in the fact
that players were using the game to debrief each other
about movies and books they had experienced.

I remember the year Cameron's Aliens came out.

No one wanted to play D&D that year,
everyone wanted to play Traveler and fight aliens in space.


But creating a story...
Minecraft is the closest so far.


Mike

reply to post by mikegrouchy


I don't know about that, i tend to find Minecraft pretty boring in both respects...

Don't get me wrong, i love the creative mode until i am done building but when it comes to survival i just get bored and play something with a real story and challenge.

Originally posted by Thorneblood
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

I don't know about that, i tend to find Minecraft pretty boring in both respects...

Don't get me wrong, i love the creative mode until i am done building but when it comes to survival i just get bored and play something with a real story and challenge.

I'm referring to all the Mods.

It's the closest thing to being a Game Master in a Video game so far.

What were some that impressed me.

Survival island
the 404 challenge
Mo Creatures

Just like you said.
Modules.


But you are right,
they still haven't figured out how to digitize a real story experience.


Emphasis on _they_.

>.>
Mike

reply to post by mikegrouchy


Well, unless you count Seedlings.
Which i know isn't a game, but it is rather well written and pretty funny for something built with Minecraft graphics and content.

Originally posted by Thorneblood
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

Well, unless you count Seedlings.
Which i know isn't a game, but it is rather well written and pretty funny for something built with Minecraft graphics and content.

Well, if the Seedling comes with a story,
like the 404 challenge did.

Not the ones that just say "plenty of diamond close by!"

Hell that one even had a contest to see who could survive the longest
under strict repressive rules of course,
with tons of people uploading videos of their repeated attempts.

It was an event.


Mike

reply to post by mikegrouchy


No seedlings is actually a series of short films with characters that live in the Minecraft universe. They aren't aware that it is a game, so when i say they live there i mean it.

They are only like five minutes each and are rather funny compared to a lot of what i have seen so far.


As for games

I would love to set up a very basic game that would essentially play like an episode of Man Vs Wild or one of those survival shows.

You are dropped somewhere Arctic/Swamp/Desert/Etc, you have to find food, shelter, fire as you make your way to an extraction point.

Neurogaming[edit source | editbeta] Currently, there is a new field of gaming called Neurogaming, which uses non-invasive BCI in order to improve gameplay so that users can interact with a console without the use of a traditional joystick.[66] Some Neurogaming software use a player's brain waves, heart rate, expressions, pupil dilation, and even emotions to complete tasks or effect the mood of the game.[67] For example, game developers at Emotiv have created non-invasive BCI that will determine the mood of a player and adjust music or scenery accordingly. Alongside Neurogaming, technology improvements in gaming gloves such as the Peregrine glove[68] are integrating newer, more efficient forms of gameplay for PC users. This new form of interaction between player and software will enable a player to have a more realistic gaming experience.[69] Because there will be less disconnect between a player and console, Neurogaming will allow individuals to utilize their "psychological state"[70] and have their reactions transfer to games in real-time.[69] However, since Neurogaming is still in its first stages, not much is written about the new industry. Due to this, the first NeuroGaming Conference will be held in San Francisco on May 1–2, 2013

Originally posted by Thorneblood
From what i can tell we are at least 10-15 years away from any sort of "holodeck" technology being available to the general public.

But when it is, we could be there making the first bad ass games for it.

I hate to be a jerk but there are millions of kids thinking hey making video games will be awesome lol half of my college is in that industry and to be honest they are annoying, first off we have a T1 bonded connection and they kill the bandwidth to the point where my cheap arse dsl is faster. the college is small, very small but these people actually kill the speed. sorry I had to get that off my chest

new games will not be virtual reality, currently there are neural to computer tech" thought power to control electronic devices" this will be the new game experience. Virtual reality games will get the axe in favor of real results but it will cycle out eventually back to neural/virtual reality when it gets to the point where people cant tell the difference between reality or virtual reality.

The neural phase of gaming will be expensive and start out very small like racing rc cars but with time will move to an industry built for gaming, It will have positive impacts on mental clarity as people will practice it to become better gamers. I see the problem with attention deficit disorder being fazed out as people get better at controlling their minds in order to stay focused. lag time will equal milliseconds for neural control estimated time =10 years, will last 10 years to 20 years before the virtual phase kicks in then at the end of 20 years a new phase in gaming will happen the neural aspect will not rely on out side influences like sight, sound, smell ect and emotions will be electronically activated imagine living a movie feeling the persons emotions, smelling, exploring ect so in about 40 years you should expect the neural aspect to simply control the mind and environment without outside influences like tv's or visuals

reply to post by digital01anarchy


You are no jerk. One problem I see is that the video games are getting smarter, but the players aren't. Also, they are getting more expensive and people are bringing less money home, disposable income. Some one could develop a neural input to educate, bring the potential players "up to speed" so to speak. Of course, I am an idealist and the logistics may be unattainable. IDK.

Originally posted by mikegrouchy

Originally posted by Johnny76
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

Hi that's very interesting. However, surely "ideas" have copyright also. It's called a patent. ie. Bullet-time owned by Warner Bros

Thank you for raising that very real scenario.

Yes.

And it folds into experience this way.

As soon as Blizzard put a trade mark on the "Question Mark" over a character indicating that
the character had a "quest" for the player,
every other game company in the world stopped using it.
So they wouldn't have to pay patent royalties.

As soon as Bullet time was patented,
every other game company started looking for other ways to stand out.
So they wouldn't have to pay patent royalties.

As soon as a driving game patented using a large 3d Direction Arrow
to show the player which way to go, every other game company wouldn't use it.
You guessed it.
So they wouldn't have to pay patent royalties.




Have you ever noticed that every single game
has a different FONT than any other,
and none of them use the standard fonts of the operating system?

That's right.
Someone owns those fonts.

Several great games,
games far better than anything on the market
have been sued into oblivion
because the team used a standard font.

All their creative work
their art,
their ideas,
and code was lost.

Because they had one single piece of someone else's property.

Mike

edit on 19-8-2013 by mikegrouchy because: (no reason given)

Fonts have a one-time licensing fee. Most fonts cost less than $100 for a commercial license. Furthermore, there is a really easy workaround when it comes to fonts. If you edit the font in any way, even distorting the shape its characters by 0.01%, it is technically considered a new font, and you don't owe any royalties on it. The reason why companies hire typographers to make custom fonts for their products is mostly exclusivity and branding. For example, you don't want 5 different games using the Far Cry typeface; you want to keep that typeface exclusive to the Far Cry franchise. For this reason, you're not likely going to see most products use non-exclusive typefaces. Typefaces like Helvetica, which will have to be licensed, will be used pretty much everywhere else (i.e. in the Manual, inside the game menu, etc), or even as sub-text.

When it comes to creative arts, however, there are so many loopholes in copyright law that can, and often are, exploited to avoid paying royalties or licensing fees to artists, typographers, designers, illustrators, and photographers.

reply to post by Thorneblood


It's been a more than a decade, but I have done some 3d modeling and animation work, as well as textures and menus, for an indie game. 3DS max, lightwav and maya were what I was using. I think that if you aim for the right market, you might be able to get a company going.

Tablets are becoming an important game system revenue wise, and it's rather easy to get into the android market. the iStore is a little more rigid but it's a market to shoot for none the less.

Steam is also an option, just remember to aim at a goal that's reasonable. You probably aren't going to make crysis 4, but some of the most compelling games I've played are from small studios. If you want to take a peek at some esoteric games look for pixeljunk. I think 1 game is on pc, but the rest are for playstation. Eden, shooter, sidescroller, all fantastic games. Flower by 'that game company' is also pretty different.

If you are looking towards something like that, out of the box, I'd love to offer any help I could. Don't ignore kickstarter if you get serious about game design.

reply to post by mikegrouchy


I'd take a peek at 'the last of us' on the ps3. That's the closest thing to a cohesive movie, I've ever played. They tell the story, and pretty darn well I might add. It's gorgeous, and it has zombies, who doesn't love zombies?

But that was the first game I've played that elicited an emotional response other than rage.

Originally posted by digital01anarchy


new games will not be virtual reality, currently there are neural to computer tech" thought power to control electronic devices" this will be the new game experience. Virtual reality games will get the axe in favor of real results but it will cycle out eventually back to neural/virtual reality when it gets to the point where people cant tell the difference between reality or virtual reality.

The neural phase of gaming will be expensive and start out very small like racing rc cars but with time will move to an industry built for gaming, It will have positive impacts on mental clarity as people will practice it to become better gamers. I see the problem with attention deficit disorder being fazed out as people get better at controlling their minds in order to stay focused. lag time will equal milliseconds for neural control estimated time =10 years, will last 10 years to 20 years before the virtual phase kicks in then at the end of 20 years a new phase in gaming will happen the neural aspect will not rely on out side influences like sight, sound, smell ect and emotions will be electronically activated imagine living a movie feeling the persons emotions, smelling, exploring ect so in about 40 years you should expect the neural aspect to simply control the mind and environment without outside influences like tv's or visuals

You have told me a story from the future,
now I will tell you a story from the future.

Volunteer: Brain Tapping is amazing!

Scientist: [ nods ]

Volunteer: Last night I ran the Tape of IP man and this morning I'm sore but my Muscles are bigger. It was so real. Look. [ does a stance and breath ] I even have the muscle memory. And the smells. I dreamed about the smells after I logged out and went to sleep.

Scientists: [ still nodding ] Yes, yes. I thought you would like it. But you volunteered and we took you off of death row for a very dangerous test. No one has survived it yet. And now I have to brief you on it. [ pause ] Are you ready?

Volunteer: [ Gulps his premium coffee ] Ok, doc, shoot.

Scientists: As you well know transmission of any Brain Tape that includes the Death of the recorder is illegal,
and Caries the Death Penalty itself, as it puts the unsuspecting recipient into a permanent coma. A vegetative state.

Volunteer: Bitch deserved it.

Scientist: I'm not finished. [ Waves to the attendants to refill the volunteers coffee ]
Scientist: We are hoping that this will not be the case for someone who is "prepaired" for it. We gave you the Buddhist masters tape so that you could achieve a deep transcendental state of consciousness before we play a tape for you of someone who has died.

Volunteer: Why not use surveillance footage of the killing. You don't need a volunteer to know what happened. That's how they caught me.

Scientists: This is different. It's for military space travel. We have a quantum drive that has achieved faster than light travel. The problem is that every living organism arrives at the other side of the Jump dead. We thought we could make a brain tape of something onboard during the jump and analyze the tape safely. But every AI we have fed the tape into has also ... um .... turned off. And remains incapable of booting again.

Scientists: [ clicks on a video on the main wall ] As you can see we have plenty of full spectrum "footage" of the event. But the pilot just goes limp, along with all the test animals. Our theory is that .... [ the scientist looks nervously around the room at the attendants ] .... that faster than light travel is somehow separating the soul from the body.

Volunteer: [ Puts down the coffee ]

Scientists: The head shrinkers theorize that the best chance is someone how pegs off-the-chart on selfishness, coupled with the transcendental selflessness of The Buddha, could. I emphasise, could. Either survive the experience, or failing that, at least leave us a brain tape with something on it to analyze.

Volunteer: You want me to record a jump on one of those experimental rockets? Doc, I'm no space walker.

Scientist: Oh, no, no. We just want to record you brain as you view the Brain tape of that Pilot I just showed you.

Volunteer: [ picks up the coffee ] # it. My sister gets the insurance settlement when I croak right?

Scientist: Yes.

Volunteer: We doing this or what. All of you standing around me is makin me nervous.

Lab: [ springs into action ]

reply to post by Thorneblood


Awesome new platform that will transport you to lands of adventure, intrigue, mystery, romance, whatever your heart desires!

Be whisked away to the planet Tralfamadore!

Fight a zombie apocaypse!

Be stranded on a desert isle!


Folks, say hello to . . . BOOKS!

===== 1 Year later ===========

Setting Briefing chamber deep underground on the Moon.

Surveillance footage to the Volunteer strapped into a chair. He is deep breathing and doesn't notice them jacking him in and loading the tape. On the view screen across from the subject is the pilot jacking in and launching. When faster than light happens, every lab assistant in the room drops dead. The screen goes blank.

General: This is worse.

Admiral: You haven't solved the problem, you've figured out how to broadcast the negative side effects.

Major: So faster than light will never carry inorganics. You could have sent me a memo. This meeting is a waste of my time.

Senior Scientist: No gentlemen. This briefing is about a new weapon. [ walks to the head of the table and holds up a small Disk ] We have found that anyone in the vicinity of the volunteers brain tape, when played, also suffers soul separation. It is conceivable that this brain tape could destroy an entire city, maybe even an entire planet.

Minister of Interior: You know perfectly well Dr that it is treason to mention the soul in any scientific work.

Senior Scientist: Call it what you want. But this is the ultimate, untraceable, one hundred percent clean, weapon of mass destruction.

Everyone sits forward and a lively discussion fills the room.

============= Mean while ================

The Buddha and the anti-Buddha are siting in Nirvana facing each other.
As the aeons pass the Buddha grows smaller, and the anti-Buddha grows ever larger.

The anti-Buddha begins to cackle like a mad man.

/end

Originally posted by DestroyDestroyDestroy

Fonts have a one-time licensing fee. Most fonts cost less than $100 for a commercial license. Furthermore, there is a really easy workaround when it comes to fonts. If you edit the font in any way, even distorting the shape its characters by 0.01%, it is technically considered a new font, and you don't owe any royalties on it. The reason why companies hire typographers to make custom fonts for their products is mostly exclusivity and branding. For example, you don't want 5 different games using the Far Cry typeface; you want to keep that typeface exclusive to the Far Cry franchise. For this reason, you're not likely going to see most products use non-exclusive typefaces. Typefaces like Helvetica, which will have to be licensed, will be used pretty much everywhere else (i.e. in the Manual, inside the game menu, etc), or even as sub-text.

When it comes to creative arts, however, there are so many loopholes in copyright law that can, and often are, exploited to avoid paying royalties or licensing fees to artists, typographers, designers, illustrators, and photographers.

That's right.

I just further emphasizes the point I was trying to make.
Many people who want to write computer games have idealistic approaches
and don't realize how many teams of people it requires, to make sure it is done right.

. [color=gold] It takes an entire civilization to make a computer game.

Most people assume the tech has advanced, and all that is left is development of the new ideas.

But as you have illustrated,
its the tiny, often overlooked details, the demand most of the development time.

For instance the $100 font license fee. A round of contact, contract, and consideration.
Most budding game designer/owners don't even realize they should have a person to handle this.


Mike

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters

It's been a more than a decade, but I have done some 3d modeling and animation work, as well as textures and menus, for an indie game. [color=gold] 3DS max, lightwav and maya were what I was using. I think that if you aim for the right market, you might be able to get a company going.

Tablets are becoming an important game system revenue wise, and it's rather easy to get into the android market. the iStore is a little more rigid but it's a market to shoot for none the less.

Those were the three to know in 90's.
Have you kept up with it?


Mike

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters
Steam is also an option, just remember to aim at a goal that's reasonable. [color=gold] You probably aren't going to make crysis 4, but some of the most compelling games I've played are from small studios. If you want to take a peek at some esoteric games look for pixeljunk. I think 1 game is on pc, but the rest are for playstation. Eden, shooter, sidescroller, all fantastic games. Flower by 'that game company' is also pretty different.

If you are looking towards something like that, out of the box, I'd love to offer any help I could. Don't ignore kickstarter if you get serious about game design.

Good advice.
I detect the voice of experience here.


Mike

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

I'd take a peek at 'the last of us' on the ps3. That's the closest thing to a cohesive movie, I've ever played. They tell the story, and pretty darn well I might add. It's gorgeous, and it has zombies, who doesn't love zombies?

But that was the first game I've played that elicited an emotional response other than rage.

I like the way you describe it,
and I will use your terminology.

Books can elicit and emotional response.
Movies can elicit an emotional response.
And as you show, yes, video games can elicit an emotional response.

What has yet to be developed,
from what I've seen out there,
is a system that responds to emotional investment.

Sandbox games are the first step in this direction.


Mike