The Lost Cradle of Civilization

Very interesting and well done too.

I think there is much to find yet and maybe even a couple of manuscripts. As science finds out more I think they will find we have been here far longer than than they think. But I also think science must drop its arrogance that in the past man was a superstitious unintelligent being.

Now if we look at PhotonEffect's map, we see to the east of the Indus Valley Civilization, the submerged continental shelf covered by the Bay of Bengal. It is said that there are sunken cities there, as far off the coast as 50 km. Graham Hancock covered it in detail in Underworld. The list of possible/probable sunken civilizations is only going to grow...

S&F for Slayer.

The evidence keeps on mounting, albeit excruciatingly slow, that his-story is full of holes and gaps. I would love to see some full blown excavations in the desert sands, as well as underwater in the near future. It's time they put some funding, and some of that new technology to work on this, and stop dragging their feet.

Nevertheless, funding isn't always there for every project. I understand this to some degree, but I also think funding for some things is kept tight intentionally.

Who knows. I may yet see some of my pet theories come to light. Discoveries like this at least give me hope.

Thanks Slayer, for always keeping us abreast of new discoveries, and the possibilities they bring to the imagination.

reply to post by Hefficide

how 'bout we skip all that and figure out what we're going to do with the information?

reply to post by SLAYER69


It's hard to get a good feel for prehistorical geography. Temperature and thus sea levels and vegetation have shifted a great deal in the last 100K years plus. Another wildcard in imagining the development of early man is the many giant species that existed at the time, making survival a constant challenge- giant cats, bears, dogs, birds, etc.


I was wondering how you think the Toba eruption fits into all of this? It happened probably 70K ya or so, which is well before the possible situation you talk about here. But I've thought that if there were a precursor to the civilizations around 10,000 yo.... in way deeper history.... that it may have been in what is now Indonesia. Between rising sea levels and the super volcano, there could easily have been a legitimate civilization that left very scarce evidence. And it isn't too far to be part of a potential trade network with all of the big ones- Sumer, Indus, China, maybe the Persian Gulf.

ETA: Also, the migration to Australia has always been a piece to the puzzle that I find interesting. People there and also in New Guinea are closer genetically to Africa than SE Asia. Not sure how that fits, but with higher sea levels Indonesia is just a skip from Austrailia and if the ancient world's network is that big then Indonesia really becomes a central location.

Originally posted by semperfortis
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Outstanding Post!!!

More and more evidence is piling up that there was an ancient advanced civilization that guided our ancestors.. I truly appreciate what you have put together here

My sentiments, exactly. Another great thread, Slayer.

Excellent topic and fantastic read!

If in the future we not only study the area around the Persian Gulf, but more of the surrounding lands, we may be able to see much more similarities between the people from the near area and their counterpart cultures abroad. What is overwhelmingly interesting here is the fact that all these different cultures from around the world share the same ideas and building techniques yet none have been proven to have communicated with each other. At least not where I have read. That tells me these people must of learned their arts and skills from the same source or knowledge. I.e., they all came from the same area. But I believe this is a well acknowledged theory that is widely talked about in academia and slightly hinted at with your thread.

At least, that is what I got out of it.
As always, great thread!

wow...

All hail threadmaster Slayer69

Nice thread bro... S&F

reply to post by SLAYER69


It is weird that the Bible seems to be a better history book than I, for one, once thought it is, as far as geography at least. The evidence for earlier and earlier man is slowly growing, too (as in the recent find in the Americas of hunting traces going back 100,000 yrs.).

It isn't so earth-shattering that people have been around longer than we thought a few decades ago. These finds for old coastal settlements just adds to the growing pile of evidence of a longer history.

The rather condescending attitudes toward many old histories (read religious writing) is rightly being reevaluated by some, at least as far as the non-miraculous parts.

I bet the future will show a more extensive and interesting past.

I just wanted to thank everybody for their feedback and replies.

Gnite

reply to post by SLAYER69

Great thread SLAYER, I too believe there was some deep connection between Sumer and Indus valley can't say if there was a super civilization that exist and got flooded with survivors branching out archaeological boots on the ground may very well fleshed that out,now there is some confusion by the ancients of where some of these places were located.

Although at a later age and successor civilization we have this

The first mention of the Meluhha in Egyptian texts were written during the rule of Ramses II letter to the Hittites (KUB III 52) where he mentions that he was ending men of Meluhha to the Hittite royal court. During this period and later periods Meluhha=Kashi (Kush).

The Meluhhaites according to the inscriptions of Sargon II (c. 712 BC) mention the “bowmen, chariots and horses of the king of Meluhha”, together with the Egyptians fought the Assyrians in Palestine. Later the Assyrian king Assurbanipal of Assyria, noted in his inscriptions that he “ marched against Magan (Egypt) and Meluhha (Kush) in order to defeat the armies of Tarku (Taharqa), king of Egypt and Kush .

This is even more confusing given there are two Kush on the above map.

In 1999, an Egypt-Assyrian synchronism from the Great Inscription of Tang-i Var in Iran was re-discovered and re-analysed. Carved by Sargon II of Assyria (722-705 BC), the inscription dates to the period around 707/706 BC and reveals that it was Shebitku, king of Egypt, who extradited the rebel king Iamanni of Ashdod into Sargon's hands, rather than Shabaka as previously thought.[5] The pertinent section of the inscription by Sargon II reads: “

"(19) I (scil. Sargon) plundered the city of Ashdod, Iamani,[6] its king, feared [my weapons] and...He fled to the region of the land of Meluhha and lived (there) stealthfully (literally:like a thief). (20) Shapataku' (Shabatka) king of the land of Meluhha, heard of the mig[ht] of the gods Ashur, Nabu (and) Marduk which I had [demonstrated] over all lands...(21) He put (Iamani) in manacles and handcuffs...he had him brought captive into my presence

www.abovetopsecret.com...
From a thread I broached: Possible Location Of Meluhha,Dulium and Megan,
As in the case of Kush similar place names can occur independently, however one is tempted to reflect on the begats of the Bible where Kush begat Nimrod in the land of Shinar or Sumer to bring the two in line.

However travel to Meluhha if it was located in the Indus valley for trade would make life easier although not impossible than going all the way to Africa.

In any case great outside the box thinking.

reply to post by SLAYER69


I didn't find this thread until it was too late for me to read.I will read
it in the morning after I have my coffee.

Very good article. I like open minds, especially ones that show some evidence that their theories are possible. I doubt if we will know if this is viable for a while, it seems like it does not meet present consensus. Maybe ten years and the evidence will be accepted.

I think the great flood existed, but who knows how long ago. That information could have been orally passed down for a hundred thousand years, nobody knows where it came from. The whole layout of the land since man has been around on this planet could be different. When I say man, I also include the ancestors that may have been a little neanderthal or possibly cromagnum, it appears that there is different humanlike beings blended into our DNA. I don't know about you guys, but I am not going to deny any of my ancestors are not my ancestors. I am proud that they got me here to experience this life, no matter who they were. To me, If I have part neanderthal in me, one of my great great....on and on...grandparents was full neanderthal. I'd be proud to meet them.

I'm going to go back now and read some of the comments. S&F

I have cassette tapes from 1980's of a Los Angeles station KABC show called Open Mind on Saturday nights...during the New Age movement. I still remember a tidbit on what the Spirit World calls two lost great civilalizations.
I need a week to search in my storage unit...

Nice one!!

reply to post by SLAYER69

Could there have been a period much much earlier in our prehistory of a civilization that was centrally located between the two?

Now that I have had some time to think about this I am going to propose a Hollywood script from 'Sahara'.

What we know is the climate has dramatically changed over that period of time. Rivers once flowing have turned to sand and dust and here is the part underground rivers that have been covered with the age of time.

So very plausible as most archaeological excavations only deal with relics, not so much as geographical 'landmarks' such as a rivers or streams could have been as we are talking about thousands of years.

Of course for that hollywood flick 'a storm' flooded the river,allowing boat travel, and a 100+years dried it up.

You make the call that was kinda throwing me civilizations always need water, and what we see today wasn't necessarily so back then.

reply to post by SLAYER69


What a wanderful thread.
Step by step we go through the real, "still hidden", history of human civilization on this planet.

I can feel what lies beneath the waters of Persian Gulf, and what lies beneath the shores of India.

After all "The Lost Book of God Enki" was right....

S&F.

reply to post by SLAYER69


The first proof of a big bang in consciousness is found in Chauvet (some 32000 years ago in France). It looks like that special human first lived underground and step by step it came out of its caves and spread around the world. I think that human was a woman.
She bore children and cross breaded with Homo Sapiens (that maybe came out of Aftica but that's a detail).

What can we proof? That art looses its beauty bit by bit by the years as if humanity degenerated.

Than some 12.000 years ago there must have been a great flood. Plato and much other sources let us little doubt about that.

What do I think (nothing special but there we go) : that first human with its big bang was a mutant or a well considered creature of the gods.

But degeneration was a failure. So the gods (that maybe lived on earth for hundreds of thousands of years) created the flood and humanity could start all over again ...

Graham Hancock and so many other conspiracy thinkers are on the good track. There were (lost) civilizations before 12000 yars ago that communicated on a telepathic way. It 's a long story -but Gobekli Tepe should give us a little bit of real proof)-

Sorry for those who think (and dislike) I make a little bit promotion for my site - which is true but you can always ignore it :-)

www.evawaseerst.be...

No!; When will you people learn.
Even though there is strong evidence of our ancestors using fire to cook food over 1 million years ago....up until 3000 years ago we just wandered around in sandals not doing a great deal.

Gobeleki Tepe does not exist and was not backfilled in an an attempt to bury it.
People were not using gears and levers 5000 years ago in the indus valley
No one was travelling to China to conduct trade 5000 years ago.
There is no evidence to suggest that early civilisations would have been "most likely" to be based next to the sea and sea levels in likely inhabited areas did not fluctuate by upto 50 metres within 5000 years.

Hi Slayer, nice topic to ponder.

The immediate point that comes to mind is the currently well established time of around 8000 years ago that hunter gatherers transitioned to farming, which led to permanent residences, societies etc and all the trimmings that go along with that. The theory you are presenting here is that there were fully developed and functioning structures of society in place at about this time, and trade between many such places. There was evidence in your presentation that seaworthy ships were found. What you seem to be proposing is that there were hunter gatherer/fishing communities, and the settled communities did not require the change to an agricultural society to develop.

To state it simply, hunter-gatherers hunt game and collect plant foods (called foraging) rather than grow or tend crops. Hunter gatherers is the term used by anthropologists to describe a specific kind of lifestyle, that of all human beings until the invention of agriculture about 8000 years ago.

Recent studies have identified the importance of fish and maritime resources as a component of some coastal-based hunter-gatherers. Hunter-gatherers who rely on marine resources (such as the Mesolithic Ertebølle-Ellerbeck culture are known as hunter-gatherer-fishers.

Source

A natural disaster that would have destroyed all of these coastal areas, that permitted the hunter gatherer/fisher lifestyle to be possible, could be the explanation for the sudden change to agriculture. The lush coastal regions that sustained them were no longer there.

reply to post by SLAYER69

Op good thread and a good effort. Lets not forget that the Bible is also correct.
Adam and Eve were cast into the outer darkness by disobeying God's orders.
IMO Garden of Eden was another time and space.
The outer darkness which we now inhabit may have had many pre civilizations and such
and a clear answer may never be found.