UFO Religion the Raelians Want to Rehabilitate the Swastika

Personally I have never heard of this religious group before, even though they claim they're the largest UFO religion in the world with over 70000 followers.

As the beachgoers of Long Island soaked up the sun last month, their attention was caught by a light aircraft flying above with a flag trailing behind it. On it was a huge swastika and the web address "proswastika.org". People were outraged. Who was responsible for publicly flaunting this ugly symbol of hate? Neo-Nazis? Pranksters? Neither, apparently.

Before Hitler adopted it as the Nazi logo in 1920, variations of the swastika had been used by civilisations in China, Africa and South Asia since the bronze age.
"As long as we associate the swastika with Hitler and the horrors of the Nazi regime, they own it," argues Thomas Kaenzig, head of the pro-swastika movement.

The Guardian

They made this initiative for rehabilitation of swastika symbol which in my opinion is highly debatable decision to do just because it's deeply associated with Nazis, and the wounds are still fresh.
Frankly I didn't think about that whole issue more deeply, and I'm sure this isn't the first attempt for rehabilitation of the symbol in question.
Which led me to you ATS...
How would you feel that the swastika symbol can be used openly, like any other symbol?

Note: This subject is about the symbol, not Nazis, so please, keep it civil

Originally posted by zilebeliveunknown
How would you feel that the swastika symbol can be used openly, like any other symbol?

Meh. It's just a symbol, so I don't think that there is any reason that they can't use it, but the question is whether they should use it. And, unless they think it has some magical properties or something, probably not, as the symbol holds the taint of its use in the 20th Century, which has a lot more relevance than its use in the 3rd Century.

Sort of like how nobody names their kid Adolf anymore -- there's nothing wrong with the name, but it is so tainted by Hitler that the only reason you'd choose it is to be provocative, so it is no longer "just a name", and the swastika is no longer "just a symbol."

It is used openly in India still since they know the meaning of it in their culture. Its name comes the Sanskrit word svasti (sv = well; asti = is), meaning good fortune, luck and well-being. There may also be a connection with the swastika's magical connections, for Hitler and other Nazi leaders were keenly interested in the occult.

To make it into a symbol that all know is good would remove the power of fear the symbol was used for. Say what racial extremist want to wear a symbol that means "All is god and lovely and I love all things" on his clothes. It does not go well with the message of hate they like.

reply to post by zilebeliveunknown


Reading up on this group is hysterical and entertaining.

From what I've read, a childhood friend of the founder and leader of this group (Claude Vorilhon), admitted that he made it all up for publicity and attention.

Like a lot of cults, while they say they are out to promote world peace, sharing, democracy and nonviolence, here's what happens...

Raëlians believe that sex is a normal, natural and healthy part of life and encourages people to be true to their natural sexuality. They promote healing from damaging messages from strict puritanical belief systems and social stigmas that stifle one's natural sexuality. Acceptance of masturbation, homosexuality, bisexuality, pansexuality, naturism and any legal, safe and consensual adult activity is promoted as part of a healthy and long life, and this is used to attract young converts to the religion.

Raelians believe that sexuality is a gift of pleasure to mankind from the Elohim. The Raëlian book Let's Welcome our Fathers From Space says that new advanced extraterrestrial civilizations will ultimately practice a final religion or "religion of the infinite" that involves ubiquitous practice of Sensual Meditation.

en.wikipedia.org...

In the meanwhile, apparently there are plenty of "sexual abuse" allegations against them.

They have a spaceport in South America and have all taken "names" of non-existant planets...and are down there awaiting their "space-brothers" to arrive.

And the SWASTIKA symbol isnt NAZI at all, and is way older than the NAZI useage of it. It was used by the ancient Hebrews and Native American tribes way before Hitler used it. So, why not use it?

You should research the symbol to see.

PS The Raelians have been around and in the news a very long tim...at least 30 or so years. Dig up some of their videos. They are quite funny with their "galactic" names, clothing and banners...

They remind me of the Galactic Federation of Light in some ways.

It is certainly true the swastika symbol has been around for centuries,millenia even.Known by a wide diversity of cultures across the globe,it was a positive symbol for so long until Adolf took it and turned it into what we know so well today.

So it is a valid symbol to use,no argument there as long as it isn't left handed and set into a blood red background.

The thing is though just because something is valid and correct in theory that doesn't make it expediant or correct in practice.I mean to anybody born in the western world since the 1930's the swasika has a very dark and specific meaning.I'm not even sure what the point of trying to rebrand the swastika is exactly.

I remember learning in 1st year tech drawing when I was 11 that symbols (this was pertaining to hazchem symbols and other warning signs) are used because if you put up a message or instruction in text form you have to read the words and understand their meaning and context whereas with a symbol your brain instinctively understands the message without any concious thought.Why do you think brand logos are so prolific in todays society.

it's a very simple,direct and powerful way of conveying a message that far more effective than words would be.And it's that direct,often visceral associations we have with certain iconic symbols that,to me,makes the extreme effort it would take to give the swastika back it's original positive,esoteric meaning rather pointless.

It's not practical maybe not possible to overturn it's meaning in peoples minds such that when the see a swastika they automatically think of the ancient,rather vague meaning and only of Hitler and Nazi Germany second.Obviously,I'm talking of people my age,the kids just starting school could be taught it anew.

But again whats the point ??

The nazi swastika being the possibly one of the first calculated uses of a highly stylised symbol used on everything from the deck of the Bismarck to the heading on official stationary in a deliberate attempt to 'brand' a political movement/regime and what it represents directly into the mind of a whole population.

It's also the perfect example that represents the systematic and insiduos way they raised propoganda to a science and an artform in their efforts to control how people thought even.

In many ways it is of far greater value to the world and the future if it keeps it present dark association with the Nazis.

it's a still painful period of modern history that should not be forgotten,the memory kept alive particularly as those who witnessed it will all have passed soon and it fades from living mem.

Why is so important that it's kept in the worlds psyche ??

Because although it's easy to almost mock them with their jackboots and goosestepping,black crosses,death head badges and comic moustaches it was utterly cruel,merciless,violently oppressive where the petty,officous,insignificant,lowly civil servant had the power of life n death,given free reign to unleash their saddistic pleasures.

When one of the most sophisticated,enlightened and cultured countries can descend in less than two decades into a nation that when it understood it couldnt feed or deport the jews coldly decided to kill them all on an industrial scale.This is what happens when we revere our base,animalistic nature,where the 'strongest will survive' ethic becomes the mindset of the time.Where the state matters and individuals are subordinate in every way.

These lessons can't be forgotten particularly with our governments sheer ability to monitor and manipulate us with ease

So in summary i believe the swastika may have had a good meaning 100's of years ago but it's synominours with Hitler now no matter who believes otherwise and we cant change that nor should we

Imagine somebody announced that from midnight the Ford 'blue oval' now stands for Volkswagen or Coca Cola and not Ford,it'd be exactly the same

It is certainly true the swastika symbol has been around for centuries,millenia even.Known by a wide diversity of cultures across the globe,it was a positive symbol for so long until Adolf took it and turned it into what we know so well today.

So it is a valid symbol to use,no argument there as long as it isn't left handed and set into a blood red background.

The thing is though just because something is valid and correct in theory that doesn't make it expediant or correct in practice.I mean to anybody born in the western world since the 1930's the swasika has a very dark and specific meaning.I'm not even sure what the point of trying to rebrand the swastika is exactly.

I remember learning in 1st year tech drawing when I was 11 that symbols (this was pertaining to hazchem symbols and other warning signs) are used because if you put up a message or instruction in text form you have to read the words and understand their meaning and context whereas with a symbol your brain instinctively understands the message without any concious thought.Why do you think brand logos are so prolific in todays society.

it's a very simple,direct and powerful way of conveying a message that far more effective than words would be.And it's that direct,often visceral associations we have with certain iconic symbols that,to me,makes the extreme effort it would take to give the swastika back it's original positive,esoteric meaning rather pointless.

It's not practical maybe not possible to overturn it's meaning in peoples minds such that when the see a swastika they automatically think of the ancient,rather vague meaning and only of Hitler and Nazi Germany second.Obviously,I'm talking of people my age,the kids just starting school could be taught it anew.

But again whats the point ??

The nazi swastika being the possibly one of the first calculated uses of a highly stylised symbol used on everything from the deck of the Bismarck to the heading on official stationary in a deliberate attempt to 'brand' a political movement/regime and what it represents directly into the mind of a whole population.

It's also the perfect example that represents the systematic and insiduos way they raised propoganda to a science and an artform in their efforts to control how people thought even.

In many ways it is of far greater value to the world and the future if it keeps it present dark association with the Nazis.

it's a still painful period of modern history that should not be forgotten,the memory kept alive particularly as those who witnessed it will all have passed soon and it fades from living mem.

Why is so important that it's kept in the worlds psyche ??

Because although it's easy to almost mock them with their jackboots and goosestepping,black crosses,death head badges and comic moustaches it was utterly cruel,merciless,violently oppressive where the petty,officous,insignificant,lowly civil servant had the power of life n death,given free reign to unleash their saddistic pleasures.

When one of the most sophisticated,enlightened and cultured countries can descend in less than two decades into a nation that when it understood it couldnt feed or deport the jews coldly decided to kill them all on an industrial scale.This is what happens when we revere our base,animalistic nature,where the 'strongest will survive' ethic becomes the mindset of the time.Where the state matters and individuals are subordinate in every way.

These lessons can't be forgotten particularly with our governments sheer ability to monitor and manipulate us with ease

So in summary i believe the swastika may have had a good meaning 100's of years ago but it's synominours with Hitler now no matter who believes otherwise and we cant change that nor should we

Imagine somebody announced that from midnight the Ford 'blue oval' now stands for Volkswagen or Coca Cola and not Ford,it'd be exactly the same