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Why so much hatred towards Pagans?

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posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:00 AM
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I'll admit, I haven't done all that much research on the various Pagan religions, but given that I have done my homework on Christianity, I'm just curious as to why? The vibe that I get, based on the history and modern hatred, is that of some sort of ancient propaganda scheme that somehow continues to exist. And my honest opinion is that Christianity, as world spread as it is, is nothing but a successful attempt of a dieing empire to achieve immortality. I know that sounds odd, even insane, but hear me out.

I want to talk about the old religions of our world. Those that were capable of surviving thousands of years and are now, for some reason, seen as hierarchy, lunacy or even conspiracy. In political terms, the modern propaganda likes to label the U.S. Constitution or Magna Carta as lunacy (some old time script with no meaning). And that some how, the "old ways" (divine right, slavery, etc.) are seen as the new "progressive" ways (with a modern twist, like debt slavery). In a sense, that which is old and forgotten becomes new and exciting, right?

So let's look at this from a historical point of view. Meaning, exactly, who conquered who? It was the numerous attempts of the Roman Empire that forced the birth of our "modern society" on those of the British Isles. And yet, as karma see fit, it was those of the Ottaman Empire to force their same "modern society" on those of Constantinople. The point being, every aspect of human history is FORCED on the unwilling... and nobody is protected or exempt.

So my question being, for those knowing of the eventual collapse of the Western Roman Empire, how do you enshrine your legacy? How do you keep alive that which is doomed to fall? You want my opinion? That Pope sitting in Rome? That's your Emperor. That is the man who wears the smelted down crowns of every Christian monarch since the WRE fell. And I bet if you went through the archives, you'd know and see just as much.

There are signs in every parts of these Abrahamic religions that point to Paganism, ancient Egypt and Sumeria. From the stories in the scripture to the symbols. It's all watered down Pagan/old world beliefs. This "occult", all knowing and knowledgeable, get their arrogance based on the great lie that has deceived humanity for 2 thousand years now. And that's why Pagans were burned at the stake. That's why books were burned. And that's why modern Pagans are viewed as demon worshipers when they don't even subscribe to the Abrahamic structure. Because it's a lie.

It is of my opinion that the old world is the key to the modern world. And that there is absolutely no legitimacy in a 2000 year old book based on thousands of years of human history.




posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:24 AM
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reply to post by Schillinger
 


I don't have any HATRED towards Paganism, but I do think it belongs in the past. There are many reasons why I think this; here are some of them.

Pagan religions practised Human Sacrifice, of that there is no doubt. Archaeological discoveries all over the earth can vouch for that. The Bible describes these practises of pagans sacrificing their children to Moloch, etc.

Many people see Paganism as atavistic. There is a sense that it devolves us and that it is an attempt to return to something primeval that we have outgrown.

Christians believe that only through Christ were we able to evolve out of the need to shed blood. It is believed that Christ gave His blood to redeem us from sin for all time. Only through Him can we be freed from the guilt, sin and blood rituals that Adam and Eve brought into the world by eating from The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. They unbalanced the human spirit and made blood letting necessary by bringing knowledge of evil into the human realm of consciousness; Cane killed Abel and that was the first murder(there are many modern instances of human sacrifice that are still happening).

The Jews and Torah began with The Covenant of I AM and Abraham. That is a very modern phenomenon in terms of how long we have been on the planet; only a few thousand years ago that happened. The whole world was pagan before that. It still is pagan when Torah and Christ are absent from a society or group of people.

So really The Jews provided an alternative. Even the Monotheism of Egypt was still centred around Sun worship. The God of Abraham said that such worship is of an object that has no consciousness. The Sun is a ball of flame and only a part of Creation.

A lot of pagans are very rude about Christianity and Torah. Even you call it a lie! How do you know it is a lie when billions of people in the world don't think it is a lie?

So the polarity is that Paganism and Torah are different world views and belief systems. We live in a society of tolerance. I am prepared to tolerate pagan people as I believe in free will, but I expect the same respect in return; that they don't call me a liar. I never call pagans liars, ever!

I have been on both sides. I used to practise Shamanism, but I found solace in Christ and Torah. I know quite a bit about both world views.

As long as pagans don't sacrifice animals and people I will tolerate it. Christ having shed His blood meant that even The Jews did not have to sacrifice animals any longer. It was evolution at work through the human spirit.






edit on 9-8-2013 by Revolution9 because: clarification



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:33 AM
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reply to post by Revolution9
 


To a point, I can agree with you. And even though I might have stepped out of line, I was simply stating my opinion.

When it comes to sacrifice, I do understand the idea behind it, but don't agree with it (especially when it comes to humans). Animals on the other hand, there are predator species that do need to be thinned... it's why trapping still exists. And I honestly have no problem with that.

I just don't like the way Pagans are viewed as. They're all, in most people's minds, either witches or demon worshipers and it simply isn't true. I think that idea is something that needs to be corrected. We don't, as a Western society, view all Muslims as terrorists, for example.

The point behind this thread was to point out how Pagans have been and are treated in society. We've gone from witch burnings to still calling them witches and now demon worshipers... all because of the need to push the good book. There's something very wrong with that.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:44 AM
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Pagans are failed Satanists.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:46 AM
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Originally posted by Schillinger
reply to post by Revolution9
 


To a point, I can agree with you. And even though I might have stepped out of line, I was simply stating my opinion.

When it comes to sacrifice, I do understand the idea behind it, but don't agree with it (especially when it comes to humans). Animals on the other hand, there are predator species that do need to be thinned... it's why trapping still exists. And I honestly have no problem with that.

I just don't like the way Pagans are viewed as. They're all, in most people's minds, either witches or demon worshipers and it simply isn't true. I think that idea is something that needs to be corrected. We don't, as a Western society, view all Muslims as terrorists, for example.

The point behind this thread was to point out how Pagans have been and are treated in society. We've gone from witch burnings to still calling them witches and now demon worshipers... all because of the need to push the good book. There's something very wrong with that.


Well I will never call pagans that. There are many people in the world that practise it. I still like learning about the ancient world. I read many esoteric books still.

It is the old way. Humans for as long as we have been here did not know any different until the advent of Judaism through Abraham. Abram was his name before I AM spoke to him and made The Covenant. Abram was a pagan, too, and then came the big upheavel.

I live in Cornwall UK. It is a very rural place and loads of people are pagan here. Doesn't bother me slightly. I really do believe in free will and freedom. What else can we do? Was no use burning witches! Was no use killing Christians. Until GOD says otherwise I will allow people to be who they want to be. I am not their judge.


edit on 9-8-2013 by Revolution9 because: punctuation.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:47 AM
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Originally posted by AthlonSavage
Pagans are failed Satanists.


Paganism has nothing to do with Abrahamaic religion. It predates it. I'd like for you to explain to me how people were worshiping Satan before Satan even existed... unless you subscribe to the idea that Satan is actually Enki and is therefor the true Abrahamic God.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:52 AM
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reply to post by Schillinger
 


I still find Shamanism fascinating. It is the realm of Magic and Creativity through vision. I have many experiences that way still. I am not sure if it is un Christian to do this, but I love playing with my mind so much.

I do have some sympathy with what you are saying. May be I am a bit naughty. A lot of Christians would say I was. I believe in Christ. People do not realise that Christ, too, was a Shaman. All the miracles He did and the healings are no different to the Medicine Men and Women. May be Priests are Shamans? Trying to be imaginative about this.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:55 AM
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reply to post by Schillinger
 





Originally posted by AthlonSavage
Pagans are failed Satanists.


And failed christens



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:55 AM
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Originally posted by AthlonSavage
Pagans are failed Satanists.


St John said we should respect The Fallen One. If we are tempted we should only say as Michael did, "The LORD rebuke You", or "Get behind me" as Christ said.

It is very un Christian to slander any Angel or creature of The Creator.

The Story has not ended yet. What if GOD writes a Third Covenant where The Fallen Angels gain redemption? The LORD of Creation can do whatever HE likes remember. HE already had one Revolution where Christ turned the tables on Judaism. There could be more in the pipeline, lol.
edit on 9-8-2013 by Revolution9 because: punctuation.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 04:57 AM
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reply to post by Revolution9
 


I think that we as a species (and animal of this planet) have a connection to the Earth. That's all I'll really say about magick. And I don't think that any god that would deny us our birth right is one to be worshiped.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 05:01 AM
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I have yet to meet a pagan that I didn't like. However, I've met plenty of main stream religious people that were obnoxious to the point of nearly making me pull my hair out. I disagree with the religious beliefs of pagans but I won't judge their souls. That's God's job. (the One Big Guy ... that God
)



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 05:03 AM
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reply to post by Schillinger
 


One thing I do hate is the fact that millions of western so called Christians have condoned slaughter. We have seen how people turn their backs on Africa and Arabia and allow their governments to arms deal and create havoc in those countries so that they can reap the economic rewards in our countries.

Thou shall not kill! Lol, yeah right!!!



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 05:06 AM
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Originally posted by Revolution9
reply to post by Schillinger
 


One thing I do hate is the fact that millions of western so called Christians have condoned slaughter. We have seen how people turn their backs on Africa and Arabia and allow their governments to arms deal and create havoc in those countries so that they can reap the economic rewards in our countries.

Thou shall not kill! Lol, yeah right!!!


You would not finance the Klu Klux Klan or Black Panthers to wage war, so why finance the Zionist Jews to do the same? When your political administration uses tax dollars to back a supremacy group, it can't end well no matter which religion your nation is based on.

There are good Christians, good Muslims and good Jews. Those that choose supremacy and actually believe to be God's "chosen people" are a problem.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 05:07 AM
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Originally posted by Schillinger
reply to post by Revolution9
 


I think that we as a species (and animal of this planet) have a connection to the Earth. That's all I'll really say about magick. And I don't think that any god that would deny us our birth right is one to be worshiped.


The Creator is allowing it so I do, too.

It is obvious that we humans are being given a long leash to experiment and find our way the long way round.

It's all a crazy game. We are told not to kill yet given the freedom to do just that. The older I get the less judgemental, for sure.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 05:10 AM
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Originally posted by Schillinger

Originally posted by Revolution9
reply to post by Schillinger
 


One thing I do hate is the fact that millions of western so called Christians have condoned slaughter. We have seen how people turn their backs on Africa and Arabia and allow their governments to arms deal and create havoc in those countries so that they can reap the economic rewards in our countries.

Thou shall not kill! Lol, yeah right!!!


You would not finance the Klu Klux Klan or Black Panthers to wage war, so why finance the Zionist Jews to do the same? When your political administration uses tax dollars to back a supremacy group, it can't end well no matter which religion your nation is based on.

There are good Christians, good Muslims and good Jews. Those that choose supremacy and actually believe to be God's "chosen people" are a problem.


I agree totally. Hypocrisy is rife in the world.

It's nice we can talk this way. You are obviously a thinking guy and that is refreshing. I just wanted you to know that there are people who believe in Christ that think, too. Not all of us are robots!



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 05:12 AM
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reply to post by Revolution9
 


I was raised Christian, I chose to abandon it. I have no religion, but I know something created this universe. That is who or what I call God.

But as they say, trust in God, but tie your camel. Nothing in this world is given freely.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 05:29 AM
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reply to post by Schillinger
 


I must admit that the one thing I cannot get my head around is how GOD told Moses to tell the people "You shall not kill". Then HE proceeded to have the Israelites slaughter anyone they came across in The Promised Land of Canaan.

Can anyone clarify that? Jesus was peaceful. His example is not that of war and conflict.

It still bothers me. It is a sore point of faith that GOD expressed Himself so vengefully in The Old Covenant.



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 06:17 AM
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Originally posted by Revolution9
reply to post by Schillinger
 


I must admit that the one thing I cannot get my head around is how GOD told Moses to tell the people "You shall not kill". Then HE proceeded to have the Israelites slaughter anyone they came across in The Promised Land of Canaan.

Can anyone clarify that? Jesus was peaceful. His example is not that of war and conflict.

It still bothers me. It is a sore point of faith that GOD expressed Himself so vengefully in The Old Covenant.



Yeah, I can clarify it quite well, with 3 words:

MAN HAS FAILED.

Man has failed to adequately describe that amazing fundamental force he connected with in his moments of inspiration and insight. He failed in the Bible, the Talmud, the Gita, and every other holy text. They're all laughable. The force man sought to describe is real, but man has failed to find a language to describe it, despite all those admirable attempts, because man is hopelessly flawed. Those of us to claim to have "the interpretations of what happened", who claim to have cracked the "code" behind the events, are more often than not the biggest freaking jackasses of all.

But what is, is what is, and it offers all of us an opportunity to connect to it in our own way. Its there, and we can all find it in our way. But that's as good as it gets. No recipe book, no parsing of the words of another ancient guy can act as a substitute for a personal connection to the real thing.

So lets all forget about old stories of other individuals, and seek to connect with truth in our own way. Art, dance, science, love, etc. Whatever each of us is called upon to be, lets be it.

PEace



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 06:32 AM
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Its bizarre how paganism is linked to Satan which is part of abrahamic beliefs, so actual word for satan connected paganism is neo-paganism not as paganism in original form. Original paganists believed in natural forces like earth wind and fire and has nothing to do with Satan.

Let´s take a look at christianity and how it took over the pagan beliefs was to use same holidays as pagans did. Actual date when Jesus was born is unknown and some calculations tells that his date of birth was on September 29 in the year of 4 B.C and not December 25 as we belief. Pagan holidays in December was around winter solstice about the time we celebrate christmas ( winter solstice day varies from 20th to 23th ) the time of the year when Roman´s had the Bacchus festival and Feast of Saturn, Queen of heaven in Babylonian´s belief gave birth to her son. Iranian God Mithra´s birthday was December 25th and even Jews celebrate Hanukkah at that same time of year. It was not coincidence .. early Christians and Catholic church were marketing geniuses.

(Christmas )Fir tree comes from pagan Rome, Candles from Judaism, Santa is actually pagan Winter Stag god. Holly, Yule and mistletoe comes from paganism.

Easter has symbols of paganism too, Eater Bunny is about fertility and easter egg is about birth of goddess Astarte ( Easter)


So why to hate paganism in its original form as it seems that we are still Pagan ?



posted on Aug, 9 2013 @ 06:51 AM
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reply to post by Schillinger
 



I think that we as a species (and animal of this planet) have a connection to the Earth. That's all I'll really say about magick. And I don't think that any god that would deny us our birth right is one to be worshiped.


I'm not sure I understand what you're saying here. Can you explain?

God gave man dominion over the earth and the animals, yet God still has dominion over us, because he created us. What exactly is your definition of "birth right? Unless we created the earth and ourselves to be born into it, what right do we really have?



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