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Do Governments Deter Humanity's Innately Evil Nature?

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posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:05 PM
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reply to post by tetra50
 


I'm sorry that you've had bad experiences,

This is the point I'm trying to make though. There are bad people out there, I don't know why they seem predisposed to act in the way in which they do, so how do we secure ourselves from these people? That's why I suggested government tries to protect us from these people by dealing with them in numerous ways.

Is that the best way I don't know, but what happens if one day you actually use this "rueger?" (I'm not a gun person) and you end up doing something that you regret? You can't turn back time, and if I could have people protected so that they weren't forced to take the law into their own hands, then I'd do it.

I'm not saying that your or anyone else isn't capable of fending for themselves, but do you want to have to pull a trigger and watch someone die? even if they are attacking you.
edit on 8-8-2013 by DAZ21 because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:13 PM
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reply to post by DAZ21
 


The government are humans too. Some want to help others and some are greedy.

You say we NEED a government because we need someone to "Protect" us, otherwise murderers and thieves will take over.

Actually, if there was no government, it would be even MORE obvious why compassion is important and all of the "good" people would get together to protect each other.

The government is also humans. They don't make anything better or worse. If there was no government there would probably be more violence since there would be more freedom, but guess what? With the government existing NOW, the government ITSELF is creating violence and wars, so it's basically the same thing...



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:20 PM
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Originally posted by DAZ21
reply to post by WhiteAlice
 


I know, it just doesn't make sense why we would need negative Media to make us feel better about ourselves, so we can say to ourselves, "At least we have a better life than that poor so and so." Etc.

What does that tell us about ourselves, that we need to always feel better off than others?

I don't know, maybe I'm thinking into this too deeply.


Nothing wrong in thinking deeply in a world where it sometimes seems like the world doesn't think enough (see my sig lol). Really wish I was more of an open person because i wrote something long ago that is so appropriate to our conversation here, lol.

Media, from what I can tell, operates purely on psychological levels and maintains a pretty sharp divide between two different types of subject matters, what I would call the "dredges" and the "aspirational". The "dredges" being shows like Hoarders, Cops, Honey Boo Boo, Toddlers and Tiaras. The aspirational would be shows or media (or commercials!) reflecting the societal "Jones'"--basically setting those bars of societal behavior or being that we all aspire to be (Touch, Heroes, American Idol and etc). It's all just psychologically driven hyper-reality on tap that says at the end of the day that we're really bipolar as a society. We ultimately drive what is on tv and in the news. They're just giving the people what they want because if they don't, well, ratings plummet and ad revenue streams start diminishing.

And yes, it does end up leaving one to ask the question about what that all says about us as the human race or how far we've really come in all of our efforts towards societal progress. Are we really any different from the crowds that would gather to watch a public execution for the sheer novelty of it? I don't think so. Yet, at the same time, we are still aspirational. It's the flip side of the coin that I keep clinging to. That's hope.



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by DAZ21
 


The government is also humans. They don't make anything better or worse. If there was no government there would probably be more violence since there would be more freedom, but guess what? With the government existing NOW, the government ITSELF is creating violence and wars, so it's basically the same thing...


If there was no government, there would probably be more violence, because there is freedom from the consequences. That's the question though, "Why would there be an increase in violence?"

But I suppose you're right with the fact that they create and fight wars so that balances the need for violence.

Why fight wars? Again it proves to me that people will do evil things to get what they want.
edit on 8-8-2013 by DAZ21 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:25 PM
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reply to post by DAZ21
 


Sorry to bring this to you, but is in human nature to be "evil" now evilness doesn't mean a devil worshiper but causing harm against other in order to pursue our own agendas

Governments, police force and any position of power are also run by humans, so do not expect any government to look for the well being of the people that they are governing because as you can see they are only looking after their own well being and those that pays them most to keep them in power.


Governments and those in positions of power can never, ever be trusted.



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:40 PM
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reply to post by WhiteAlice
 


A scary thought indeed, if beheading was brought back and put on public display I'm sure the public would veiw it by the millions. Then again would we sympathize with the "beheadee?" (If that's the right word)

Even so, as you say It's part of our human nature, quite disturbing when you think about it.

You know what they say about hope, "Hope springs eternal"

Well hopefully that's not the case in this instance.


Oh, and yeah that is a good signature.

edit on 8-8-2013 by DAZ21 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:46 PM
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reply to post by marg6043
 


Ahh but I disagree,

A government is made up of many people, therefore we can expect them to make decisions as a microcosm of the larger society, so even if a few had evil agendas, the greater good would surel prevail.

Now a dictatorship on the other hand, well then you're pretty much screwed.



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:50 PM
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reply to post by DAZ21
 


If you trust government this days with all that is been going on in our own nation with the corporate dictatorship that has take over, I mean no disrespect to you when I say that you are a fool.

But everybody with their own agenda. Right, if it make you happy, then peace be with you.




posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:54 PM
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No, humans are not innately evil. This is a learned behavior, and the government does a damn good job helping humanity to learn the tricks of the trade.



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:55 PM
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reply to post by DAZ21
 


there would be consequences for instigating violence in a ideal freedom. Maybe able to get over on a few, but there is always someone more deadly than you, and those people free to protect themselves and others is more of a determent than any cop that will not make it in time to save your life.



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 05:56 PM
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reply to post by marg6043
 


I trust them as much as I trust the next stranger, but you know what they say, "sometimes It's better the devil you know."

Cut the head off and another will grow in Its place. In other words, there's nothing we can do, even if your or I tried.
edit on 8-8-2013 by DAZ21 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 06:02 PM
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Originally posted by NightGypsy
No, humans are not innately evil. This is a learned behavior, and the government does a damn good job helping humanity to learn the tricks of the trade.


Well they did an experiment with toddlers, and they mostly did the good thing, but it was found that if the bribe was big enough, (a few biscuits) they could be made to do the wrongful thing.

Also, if It's not natural to be evil, then why do we have to teach our children how to be good. When parents do a bad job of that, the kids usually turn out pretty bad too.

edit on 8-8-2013 by DAZ21 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 06:16 PM
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Originally posted by DAZ21
reply to post by tetra50
 


I'm sorry that you've had bad experiences,

This is the point I'm trying to make though. There are bad people out there, I don't know why they seem predisposed to act in the way in which they do, so how do we secure ourselves from these people? That's why I suggested government tries to protect us from these people by dealing with them in numerous ways.

Is that the best way I don't know, but what happens if one day you actually use this "rueger?" (I'm not a gun person) and you end up doing something that you regret? You can't turn back time, and if I could have people protected so that they weren't forced to take the law into their own hands, then I'd do it.

I'm not saying that your or anyone else isn't capable of fending for themselves, but do you want to have to pull a trigger and watch someone die? even if they are attacking you.
edit on 8-8-2013 by DAZ21 because: (no reason given)


I am a very moral person. Do not wish to end anyone's life. but if you've got hold of my child, for instance, I will put that trigger in a hot second and not look back---not only did it save my child, but perhaps others, as well.

The fact that the "government" isn't stopping this kind of violence and exploitation now, means I have absolutely no faith they will later. And it's not a question of needing to control us more. In fact, I believe the "controls" already in place are part and parcel of what is going on violence wise, so we will give up our freedoms for the "safety" they promise, but don't deliver now.

I am not even sure this is government;s purpose. that's a broad term, anyhow, We have a legistlative branch, executive branch, judicial branch, on down to the correction/penal system. None of it appears to work particularly well. Do you remember a very old movie called "And Justic for All," with Al Pacino as a public defender, I think. It speaks very well to the judicial system, and justice being bought and sold and dependent upon the defendent and the plaintiff. It's a complicated web, but increasingly i think it's ony in place to give an apppearance of solving a problem that it is, in fact, being added to daily, to give people jobs, status, importance, just to name a few reasons.

In the end, I long ago realized there was no real "safe" place, and no one was going to protect me, least of all the government. But if you know my post history and true history at all, you would understand where I come from. To me, the government is about making pretty speeches, telling people what they want to hear, while acting behind their backs totally antithetical to the constitution and what they've told the people. I'ts just a show, in other words, to keep us distracted while the real controls are being applied, and those of us who know disenfranchised and neutralized, because we won't play either the blame game or the lying game. And for sure, a lot of us end of crying over it, for very good reasons.
Appreciate your OP, and good questions and answers, all.

tetra50
edit on 8-8-2013 by tetra50 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 06:25 PM
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Last statement; NO, I DO NOT DESERVE TO BE CONTROLLED. And it is within my right as a human that I not be.

And, in shot, it may very well be they encourage the evil nature, for it justifies their very existence and controls placed upon us.
edit on 8-8-2013 by tetra50 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 06:57 PM
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It's as simple as the concept that when you "work together" you're better off. People who don't want to "work together" are selfish and not favored because they introduce disorder.

Picture a random population of blobs. Trillions upon trillions. They're gyrating at different rates and at different ranges. They die at random times for various reasons due to dangers in their environment. Some of them become organized and revolve around each other. These blobs live longer.

Government is like the blobs that organize and live longer. And government started when two or more people decided that working together was more effective against delaying death and preserving the species. By that definiition, government has been with us since the very beginning.

Government doesn't deter us from being evil, it's just the outward expression of humans cooperating to have better lives. It's like asking if climbing a hill to avoid the tsunami will save the lives of the people who don't climb the hill. The people who don't climb it will most likely die...

It doesn't deter evil, it just stands in its place.

Government is proof that we're not innately evil. We're, if anything, innately good and evil.
edit on 8-8-2013 by jonnywhite because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 07:21 PM
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The alien was shown into the president.

Alien: Greetings. We come in peace.

President: I understand you have a gift for "all of humanity"

Alien: Yes. We have been monitoring and recording humans for two hundred thousand years.
We have a complete recording of every single persons' life who ever lived in that period.
Everything they ever wrote, invented, or said, and original copies of all knowledge.
We even have an archive of every crime that was ever committed according
to the laws of the land at that period, whether reported or not.

President: Do you have anything else?

Alien: we could give you TV instead.


Mike Grouchy
edit on 8-8-2013 by mikegrouchy because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 07:28 PM
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Mike



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 07:35 PM
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Executive Elite School

In the classroom, the children could get materials when they needed them and took what they needed from closets and from the teacher's desk. They were in charge of the office at lunchtime. During class they did not have to sign out or ask permission to leave the room; they just got up and left. Because of the pressure to get work done, however, they did not leave the room very often. The teachers were very polite to the children, and the investigator heard no sarcasm, no nasty remarks, and few direct orders. The teachers never called the children "honey" or "dear" but always called them by name. The teachers were expected to be available before school, after school, and for part of their lunchtime to provide extra help if needed.

Social Class and the Hidden Curriculum of Work


You should see the crap that the survey
found in the working class, and middle class schools.


Mike



In both working-class schools, work in language arts is mechanics of punctuation (commas, periods, question marks, exclamation points), capitalization, and the four kinds of sentences. One teacher explained to me, "Simple punctuation is all they'll ever use." Regarding punctuation, either a teacher or a ditto stated the rules for where, for example, to put commas. The investigator heard no classroom discussion of the aural context of punctuation (which, of course, is what gives each mark its meaning). Nor did the investigator hear any statement or inference that placing a punctuation mark could be a decision-making process, depending, for example, on one's intended meaning. Rather, the children were told to follow the rules.


edit on 8-8-2013 by mikegrouchy because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 08:13 PM
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So where is this so-called Righteous Government?
It's called "The Law" and say bye-bye to it.
The last phase of a world order is
the removal of law for 'the people'
and having it replaced with arbitration, and arbitration firms.


Mike Grouchy



The Securities Arbitration Law Firm of Klayman & Toskes Continues To Investigate Claims Against Underwriters of MF Global Notes As Noteholders May Get As Little As 10% of Investment

Yesterday, Fitch Ratings said that owners of MF Global's senior unsecured debt will recover 30 cents to [color=gold] as low as 10 cents on the dollar of their investment, in the company's bankruptcy.

MF Global Notes
Novemeber 2nd, 2011

edit on 8-8-2013 by mikegrouchy because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2013 @ 08:22 PM
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Ten Golden Tax Deductions


Here,
look at this.
Most of these
are for corporations only.

Poor poor human citizens of the US.
I guess we'll just be left out of everything.

Have you ever wondered why every accountant
encourages someone who wants to start a buisness to incorporate?

There used to be four types of ownership in this country.
    Sole Proprietorship
    Partnership
    Corporation
    Cooperative

What dirty little secret
about corporate law are they hiding from us
until every other form of business is destroyed?

Could it be stuff like 'hostile take overs'
and 'governance laws' that don't apply to Sole Proprietorships?


/sarcasm
Naw.
Can't be.
Let's all just hate on the generic broad brush Humanity.
yeah! that'll work.
/sarcasm off


Mike



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