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One man divided...

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posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 04:39 PM
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Sometimes I find myself going off into strange tangents of thought, mostly about stuff I'd never share. I'm posting in the gray area for various reasons, but mainly because it's hard to categorize, it can be looked at scientifically and philosophically I suppose. If mods feel it belongs elsewhere, I shan't argue.

This is borderline, if it weren't something I found so perplexing I'd probably keep it to myself, but I kinda want to discuss it with people...not my friends, who think I'm strange enough. It came from a film called Ironclad (great movie by the way). I won't go into the details of the film itself, it's based loosely around king John and the signing of the magna carta.

Anyway, I watched it for the second time a few nights ago, there's one particularly gory battle where a man is basically split in two by the stroke of a sword, gruesome indeed. from the top of his head right down through the chest.

I found myself contemplating this, it's an interesting subject. I could be wrong, but I tend to think that absolute instant death might not occur if this were to happen...does the brain/body/mind die instantly?

If my head were instantly to split in two...would I have two minds? Even for a brief moment? I just wondered if anyone else has ever thought about this, and thought it'd make for an interesting thread.

Be nice to get some input, be it scientific or philosophical...is it possible that the mind can be fractured? I kind of go round in circles thinking about it, I leap from one conclusion to the other,. One minute I think you'd be like two, fractured and incomplete consciousnesses at the same time, then I think...no, you'd surely die instantly, how can you be the same consciousness, but divided in two? Then I think...well, is the function of consciousness located in a specific area of the brain, in the brain at all, would one half of you be dead and the other conscious for even a microsecond before death? I can't really come to a definite conclusion - can anyone?

Maybe I shouldn't dwell on such matters, maybe it's stupid or trivial...am I being stupid? I hope not, if this notion doesn't interest anyone as much as it does me, I should probably quit thinking about stuff.




posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 04:47 PM
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reply to post by samerulesapply
 


That's just gruesome.

But... I think if one can survive the blood loss of the cut, the missing heart which is supposed to pump the blood to the brain (a heart which will only be present in only one half), and thus the clinical brain death that will come, then I think yes, the two minds might evolve individually, aka, split.



posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 04:51 PM
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I don't know, interesting question.

I don't believe you would have two minds. But you may not die straight away, some shotgun suicides go wrong and the person without half a head is still alive.

I suppose it depends what part of the brain is destroyed, as each part controls a specific function. Even so if you were to survive, having your brain exposed like that you won't survive for long unless you get urgent medical attention.



posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 04:53 PM
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reply to post by swanne
 


Sorry, it is kind of gruesome, I agree.

Do you think that those two consciousnesses would be fractured, like....half a conscious? That sounds really naive, even thinking about it, my mind struggles to articulate it.

The idea of a part of your consciousness occupying one space, the other half occupying another space is really bizarre, do you think there'd be some kind of connection or communication between them still?

I'm sure this has been discussed throughout the ages by others with such morbid thoughts, it's kinda hard to put into google and get meaningful results...utterly perplexing and fascinating.

ETA...just to add, I don't think the idea of half a consciousness itself is naive, just the expression "half a consciousness" sounds a little weird, don't really know how to express it, sorry if that came across as rude or arrogant.
edit on 7-8-2013 by samerulesapply because: Additional



posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 04:58 PM
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reply to post by samerulesapply
 


I don't know... But communication with one another? I doubt it... if the two parts are cut off from each other, then the cells can't send signals to the once-neighbouring cell. There is the point of the fact that brain cells will emit EM fields, but these field's strength are proportional with the inverse square of the distance. The other part wouldn't pick up much. A sensor might, though.



posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 05:07 PM
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reply to post by swanne
 


Yeah, I sort of get that, that's what throws me, but then I think, well where is consciousness located and how does it even function, some think it exits the body and carries on to pastures new.

Is consciousness nothing more than a collection of functions courtesy of the brain? Does it reside in one specific area or does it permeate the entire brain, I'm kinda frying my own brain to be honest.

I was kinda hoping someone would know if this has been discussed in depth before, perhaps in another thread or elsewhere.

I think I could drive myself mad thinking about it, I've even toyed with the notion that perhaps consciousness would simply exit the body and exist in the space between the two halves...or would be split in two parts and there'd be some kind of connection...I think of quantum entanglement and think...it might actually be possible, dual consciousness.
edit on 7-8-2013 by samerulesapply because: Corrections

edit on 7-8-2013 by samerulesapply because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 05:14 PM
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If your brain stem is compromised you die almost instantly. Your brain stem controls your heart, your breathing etc. destroy it and all those functions cease immediately. Same goes for the beginning of the spinal cord. At this point every function of your body is packed into the gelatinous nervy goodness that is your spinal cord, damage it and you're pretty much dead.

So to be split in two, you'd likely die with in seconds.

How ever, it is possible to have the brain literally severed in two and survive. Although surgically it is still practiced in controlling extreme epilepsy.

It is called Corpus Callosotomy.


Here is a link.

Corpus Callosotomy



posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 05:20 PM
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reply to post by Hijinx
 


Aaaah, little linky-pooh, something educational before bed.

I've never heard of this before, sounds quite extreme. Gonna have a read at that before bed time, I'll be back tomorrow to check this thread, I appreciate the responses, and the link.

Cheers, guys.



posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 05:46 PM
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Originally posted by samerulesapply
Sometimes I find myself going off into strange tangents of thought, mostly about stuff I'd never share. I'm posting in the gray area for various reasons, but mainly because it's hard to categorize, it can be looked at scientifically and philosophically I suppose. If mods feel it belongs elsewhere, I shan't argue.

This is borderline, if it weren't something I found so perplexing I'd probably keep it to myself, but I kinda want to discuss it with people...not my friends, who think I'm strange enough. It came from a film called Ironclad (great movie by the way). I won't go into the details of the film itself, it's based loosely around king John and the signing of the magna carta.

Anyway, I watched it for the second time a few nights ago, there's one particularly gory battle where a man is basically split in two by the stroke of a sword, gruesome indeed. from the top of his head right down through the chest.

I found myself contemplating this, it's an interesting subject. I could be wrong, but I tend to think that absolute instant death might not occur if this were to happen...does the brain/body/mind die instantly?

If my head were instantly to split in two...would I have two minds? Even for a brief moment? I just wondered if anyone else has ever thought about this, and thought it'd make for an interesting thread.

Be nice to get some input, be it scientific or philosophical...is it possible that the mind can be fractured? I kind of go round in circles thinking about it, I leap from one conclusion to the other,. One minute I think you'd be like two, fractured and incomplete consciousnesses at the same time, then I think...no, you'd surely die instantly, how can you be the same consciousness, but divided in two? Then I think...well, is the function of consciousness located in a specific area of the brain, in the brain at all, would one half of you be dead and the other conscious for even a microsecond before death? I can't really come to a definite conclusion - can anyone?

Maybe I shouldn't dwell on such matters, maybe it's stupid or trivial...am I being stupid? I hope not, if this notion doesn't interest anyone as much as it does me, I should probably quit thinking about stuff.


At Dawn we attack Poseidon. Roman Soldiers, go down to the shore and stab at the waters.



posted on Aug, 7 2013 @ 11:45 PM
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Haha an interesting thought, I will share my opinion on it. =)

I truly believe a clean cut down the middle like you describe would not instantly cause your brain to stop functioning nor leave you unconscious, however, you would still die within a matter of seconds at the most. But for the brief moments that you are still alive, I am not so sure that you would effectively have 2 "minds" or if you could even technically complete a real thought. I'll explain why.

We utilize both hemispheres of our brain to complete thought processes despite certain areas being the focus of a type of thought. In fact, without the full functions of both sides of your brain working together it's not possible to be receptive to your own consciousness. This means that while you would still technically be alive for those brief moments, you your soul or anything that defines you personally, would not be aware of what is happening. From a physical perspective however, your brain would definitely be trying to work properly. Signals would be sent from all over your body to your brain as best as they can. Your sensory organs, especially your eyes and ears, would still be working although in chaos I would imagine.

In short, your physical body would still be trying to work for the little time it can until the loss of blood becomes too much and everything shuts down. During that time your eyes would still see, ears would still hear and nose would still smell...but even in the midst of that, because your brain itself was cut in half, you would not be capable of being conscious of it all. Your mind would be essentially blank despite experiencing your body's final moments.
edit on 8/7/2013 by ExjKae because: (no reason given)

edit on 8/7/2013 by ExjKae because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 22 2013 @ 07:01 AM
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Originally posted by samerulesapply
Sometimes I find myself going off into strange tangents of thought, mostly about stuff I'd never share. I'm posting in the gray area for various reasons, but mainly because it's hard to categorize, it can be looked at scientifically and philosophically I suppose. If mods feel it belongs elsewhere, I shan't argue.

This is borderline, if it weren't something I found so perplexing I'd probably keep it to myself, but I kinda want to discuss it with people...not my friends, who think I'm strange enough. It came from a film called Ironclad (great movie by the way). I won't go into the details of the film itself, it's based loosely around king John and the signing of the magna carta.

Anyway, I watched it for the second time a few nights ago, there's one particularly gory battle where a man is basically split in two by the stroke of a sword, gruesome indeed. from the top of his head right down through the chest.

I found myself contemplating this, it's an interesting subject. I could be wrong, but I tend to think that absolute instant death might not occur if this were to happen...does the brain/body/mind die instantly?

If my head were instantly to split in two...would I have two minds? Even for a brief moment? I just wondered if anyone else has ever thought about this, and thought it'd make for an interesting thread.

Be nice to get some input, be it scientific or philosophical...is it possible that the mind can be fractured? I kind of go round in circles thinking about it, I leap from one conclusion to the other,. One minute I think you'd be like two, fractured and incomplete consciousnesses at the same time, then I think...no, you'd surely die instantly, how can you be the same consciousness, but divided in two? Then I think...well, is the function of consciousness located in a specific area of the brain, in the brain at all, would one half of you be dead and the other conscious for even a microsecond before death? I can't really come to a definite conclusion - can anyone?

Maybe I shouldn't dwell on such matters, maybe it's stupid or trivial...am I being stupid? I hope not, if this notion doesn't interest anyone as much as it does me, I should probably quit thinking about stuff.


Maybe you should split youre computer then youd have two



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