Bedroom Tax Question

reply to post by andy06shake


If read the whole thread and I'm wondering what would your proposal be ti solve this issue. You are not alone in this situation many more face the same problems.

First of all, I'm not living in the UK, but bedroom tax isn't about tax right its about getting less benefits or am I wrong?

But how would you solve the problem, given the same amount of cash to spread over the people who use it, given the same housing possibilties and the same revenue for house owners who can rent their utilities as social housing?
How would you cut the cheese.

I'm not trying to attack you, but you say you can't work because of a disability so why don't you move to a city, town or village where there is less pressure on the housing market?

I too live in social housing, I gave up my career and so my income when my partner passed away. So I can't move and I have a small house but it is ok because I chose to.

Getting kids is a complex issue, although I understand you want to raise a family I just had a huge fight with an at that moment possible new partner about kids. I said I want a lot of kids as soon as I/we could afford them, the other side said kids should only come from love. IMO if you love your kid you should make anything happen to take care of them. If you know you can't is it fair to the kid ti let him be born in. Circumstances you don't agree with that you know in front. I don't say I'm right its a complex issue but as you can imagen now I'm still a single parent.

Edit to say:

Waiting list here in cities is about 8 to 10 years so IMO 3 to 5 would be doable

i am 34 and a lot years old and live in a 1 bedroom house .. i also have been effected by the tax .. and am being forced to downsize to a smaller 1 bedroom place ..
i am disabled and have been since i was 12 .. i started working at 18 when i left college working in a nursing home for the elderly mentally ill .. and did that for 9 back breaking years even with my disability in which ultimately made me worse .. i was advised not to work any more from the doctors .. the same ones basicly telling me told you so for working .. but anyway .. here i am ..
my brother stays at the weekend and helps out .. as we as in my social workers new from last year what was going down i have been actively bidding for up to 3 houses a week and still waiting ..

i look at how much i cost a year .. and then look at what the average prisoner costs a year ... and i have to wonder .. why criminals are more well paid for and looked after then me?

reply to post by SearchLightsInc

This mean's people can no longer afford other services - Such as private housing. Land lords here would rather their house's sit empty rather than lower the price to make them affordable. We are now facing a generation of kids who wont be able to move out of their parents house's until their late 20's and that will only get worse if nothing is done about the housing crisis.

Also i would like to point out the effect of immigration. People who have migrated over here to work need to be housed and this again has put excess pressure on the system we have in place. It was so bad at one point a couple of years ago that immigrants were surpassing families that had been on the housing list YEARS.

The OP is just your average UK brit who cant afford to pay a private landlord a ridiculous amount of money for sub standard housing - Many landlords are shady and dont look after their properties. They just want the money, that's it. I have a friend who has a sh!t load of damp in the room she rents, you think the land lord did anything about it? NOPE.

I'm just an average brit, in a single income household and I pay a private landlord..I have to in order to keep a roof over mine and my daughter's heads.

As for landlords keeping properties empty rather than reducing rents, that's nonsense, they don't make any money that way and their property is liable to damp and water damage etc if not lived in, particularly during the winter months. In fact in the area I live, rents have not really changed that much in over 20 yrs,whilst there was a jump during the stupid housing boom that saw the price of a 3 bed semi jump from about £60,000 to £150,00, once the market stagnated, rents soon came down again (though notably house prices remain pretty much the same, though they are not selling and thankfully they're not going up anymore) I live in a 2 bed flat that costs £104 per week and that's pretty average for the area, some may be as low as £90 per week and others (new builds with en-suites, private parking etc) may be as much as £125 per week, but that's not really unreasonable. against the maximum that the local authority will pay in housing benefit to someone who meets the criteria for a 2 bed flat and is currently set at £98 per week.

However, under govt legislation, before a landlord can be approved to receive payments from housing benefits, they have to be registered and their property must meet certain standards, which is going a long way to get rid of rogue landlords with rubbish property and you can report sub standard accommodation to the local authority and the landlord must comply and make any necessary repairs.

I agree with the problems of immigration, and I don't think that those coming to the country should be given social housing ahead of the indigenous population.

Originally posted by Ta1ntedJustice
i am 34 and a lot years old and live in a 1 bedroom house .. i also have been effected by the tax .. and am being forced to downsize to a smaller 1 bedroom place ..
i am disabled and have been since i was 12 .. i started working at 18 when i left college working in a nursing home for the elderly mentally ill .. and did that for 9 back breaking years even with my disability in which ultimately made me worse .. i was advised not to work any more from the doctors .. the same ones basicly telling me told you so for working .. but anyway .. here i am ..
my brother stays at the weekend and helps out .. as we as in my social workers new from last year what was going down i have been actively bidding for up to 3 houses a week and still waiting ..

i look at how much i cost a year .. and then look at what the average prisoner costs a year ... and i have to wonder .. why criminals are more well paid for and looked after then me?

It is NOT A TAX...and how can you downsize from a 1 bed? It's not the type of property that's the issue, it's the number of bedrooms, and as I have said previously, if you are in the private sector there is the discretionary payment that can cover either all or most of the top up rent

reply to post by destination now


my mistake im in a 2 bedroomed house .. and private or public u get the discretionary payment which is a joke and was raised in parliament on question day . ..i know because i have 2 reapply for it every 12 weeks for a measly 2.67 of the TAX so what do you mean? my bathroom is bigger then the spare room .....

reply to post by Ta1ntedJustice


Well I don't know what local authority you live in, but in mine once you are approved for the discretionary payment, they will continue to pay it for the duration of your housing benefit claim.

And don't forget, the public purse is not limitless and whilst I think that some of the tax payers money is not spent in the best way (i.e. foreign aid to countries with space programs and welfare payments and child benefit to people who moved to this country to milk the system) there has to be a limit at some point.

Sorry but I sometimes get annoyed at people complaining about having to pay an extra £15 quid and they're sitting there with a fag in their hand and covered in tattoos,not saying that you are, but I've seen plenty like that in media reports, moaning on whilst spending that amount per day for cigarettes and goodness knows what for their tattoos (and of course not forgetting the giant flatscreen tv and the sky subscription)
Edit to add IT IS NOT A FLIPPING TAX..IT IS A REDUCTION IN HOUSING BENEFIT FOR SOCIAL HOUSING TENANTS WHICH HAS BEEN IN FORCE IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR SINCE HOUSING BENEFIT STARTED TO BE PAID

reply to post by destination now


soo your going of what you have seen on tv? i'm living in the real world .. in the real world i don't have sky i don't have luxuries of smoking eating everyday .. my 2 dogs that i have had for 9 yrs + eat better then me and so they should ..

And yes on estates theres single mums with 5+ kids loving life on the dole ..smackheads claiming bad backs and what not .. i don't love it it and don't have a choice .. should i do the state a favour and kill myself (seems a trend under this government) so i'm not that less of a burden to GB?

15 quid? you make it sound like nothing .. 15 quid is the difference between electric and no electric .. food and no food .. keeping the house warm or cold the difference between a shower or no shower .. the difference of using my electric cooker or not using it ... In my reality i'm in the gutter .. there is no luxuries here!!

reply to post by Ta1ntedJustice


If you get ESA in either the work related activity group or the support group, you will get a minimum of £100.15 per week (sometimes more in the support group) minus £15 is £85 per week. Gas and electricity in my 2 bed flat is about £20 per week, leaving £65 per week for food and other household items. I have been seriously ill and have managed to live on that, whilst also helping support my daughter who is a student and only receives the basic young persons bursary.

So yes, I do know what I am talking about and I can manage to live on that

reply to post by Ta1ntedJustice


And I see plenty of people in the real world with their fags, booze, tattoos, flat screen tv's and sky subscriptions, whilst on benefits...though often these people are either working on the side or dealing drugs (as my neighbour does and he has a tv that is so big it almost covers one full wall of his sitting room...)

reply to post by Ta1ntedJustice

edit on 9-8-2013 by Ta1ntedJustice because: its a spare room Tax .. that spare room money goes where?

It is not a spare room tax...and the spare room money as you put it, is money that as a private tenant I have never received, if I had been renting a property that had more bedrooms than my circumstances required, so it is about making a fairer system for all people in receipt of housing benefit. Furthermore, it is part of a number of necessary austerity measures introduced by the current govt in order to reduce our massive public spending debt caused by 13 years of horrific mis-management by the previous Labour govt.

When I started this thread i done so with the intention of simply asking a question or questions pertaining to the bedroom tax.

I did not start the thread with the intention of discussing the pros and cons of said tax all through this being ATS I should have released the implications of doing so would bring about debate.

I am happy to announce that just this morning i received an offer in the post too view a 2 bedroom property that I have been assured does indeed have adequate bedroom space for both me, my partner and kids. It even has a massive kitchen and living room measured by our current standards.

Wont be able to view the property until September(Wonders in horror what the previous tennents have done to the place) but i'm still calling this a win!

I would like to thank all the people that helped with advice and offered positive reassurance.

To the rest of you lot out there claiming low income families or families with disabled members should somehow cope on their own without help from the state I will simply say this.

Don't hate the player, hate the game!

Originally posted by destination now
reply to post by Ta1ntedJustice

 

And I see plenty of people in the real world with their fags, booze, tattoos, flat screen tv's and sky subscriptions, whilst on benefits...though often these people are either working on the side or dealing drugs (as my neighbour does and he has a tv that is so big it almost covers one full wall of his sitting room...)

Wow, you've just said almost verbatim what the Daily Mail and other tabloids keep saying, that is what i call manipulated by the media. Just because you know a few people who know a few people, doesn't mean that everyone on benefits is the same. Stop generalising and stop lapping up the media drivel which is designed specifically to divide the Country.

One thing that is a kicker in this new under occupancy rule is that there are very little one bed flats available for people who are under occupying to downsize to. There are many of 2-3 bedroom flats and houses in various areas, but very little one bed flats in social housing. A few new builds are popping up every now and again, but not nearly enough to supply the demand this will have.

So, a lot of these people will end up being forced to go private, which means housing benefits will be paying more rent, which defeats the object of saving any money.

This was not well planned at all.

This website man

Somebody asks a question and it ends up sparking a war of morals . OP , you`re in a dodgy situation and it`s going to get much harder mate , everyone else in here talking big about people who are unemployed needs to stop talking and start thinking , one payslip , one bad day at work and you`re in the queue behind them .

As for having kids and expecting the government to provide for them .... where do these people come up with this crap ? We`re living in a country where you need to do as your told or die on the streets , it`s been like this for decades ... long before many of you were born , the whole point of having a benefit system in place is to make sure the people of England are not dying in your front street . If it were gone , as many would like , this country would completely collapse in a matter of months . Your neighbours are trying to make sure their kids are healthy and happy , whilst worrying about where the next meal is coming from , so jumping all over them and absorbing the hate being stirred up by the toffs in power is not helping them or their children is it ?

You`ll find that the same people who hate the benefit system and everybody in it (but not the draconian staff of course ) are the same people who want to demolish the NHS , privatise public schools and generally p*** off as many people as possible before they die . In short , ignorant , irrational , selfish bar-stewards .

Anyways , OP , good luck sorting out a new gaff and make sure them kids are well fed

reply to post by AthiestJesus


Thanks for the support!

Got an offer this morning so i'm pleased as punch.

No need to worry about my kids nutritional requirements I think I have that covered. LoL

I was watching the programme "How to get a Council House" on CH4 last night.

There was one guy who lived in a high rise flat, 8th floor i think, can't remember. It was a two bedroom. He was on benefits and was trying his best to find a a 1 bedroom place before the "Bedroom Tax" affected him.

There were none available in a 7 mile radius. He even considered moving back to his parents to a box room that is not even fit for a small child. If he did that he would lose any housing security he had and would never be able to get another social housing home again because there is so much demand.

Luckilly he managed to get moved into a one bed in another high rise before the under occupancy rule came in in April.

But the kicker was, his high rise two bedroomed flat is considered too dangerous to house children in because of how high up it was, so the flat ended up going to another single male, who was only allowed to be housed there because he was working.

So now you have a working single male under occupying a council home, just because he's working. If he loses his job, ends up on JSA and can't afford to pay for the extra bedroom, which in this current climate is highly likley, the whole process starts again.

The same thing will apply if it happens. They will move another single tenant or couple in there because the flat is deemed unfit for children. So you will continously have a bunch of flats in our many high rises across the Country above ground and possibly first floor that will always be under occupied regardless of how you look at it.

As i said before, this has not been planned well at all.

The whole thing is a farce.

reply to post by andy06shake


Im happy for you dude, glad things have taken a turn for the better

reply to post by SearchLightsInc


Im putting this one down to the law of attraction.

Thanks SearchLightsInc for your support!

All the best to you and yours!

reply to post by skitzspiricy


Did you not read the post where I mentioned that I have been on ESA myself due to having had a serious illness after having worked for 25 years and having paid huge amounts of tax, but I'm subject to the same rules as everyone else. I don't read the Daily Mail so I have no idea what they say..I've been in my neighbour's house though, and I've seen the telly, complete with Sky box, Xbox, 100 cigs sitting on the table and he's on jobseekers allowance, and he is not the only one

Jeez some people only read what they want to read

reply to post by AthiestJesus

the people of England

??? but the people of Scotland, Ireland and Wales, clearly don't mean much to you! So before you start moralising at other people check yourself first!

Originally posted by destination now
reply to post by skitzspiricy

 

Did you not read the post where I mentioned that I have been on ESA myself due to having had a serious illness after having worked for 25 years and having paid huge amounts of tax, but I'm subject to the same rules as everyone else. I don't read the Daily Mail so I have no idea what they say..I've been in my neighbour's house though, and I've seen the telly, complete with Sky box, Xbox, 100 cigs sitting on the table and he's on jobseekers allowance, and he is not the only one

Jeez some people only read what they want to read

Yes i did actually, and the majority of people on benefits have worked hard and paid into the system just like you. But by default they are all getting treated like your "neighbour", who is actually in the minority contrary to what the Government and Media would like you to believe.

Now, if you were a good honest hard working tax paying person, and you know for absolute certainty that your neighbour is commiting fraud by working cash in hand or dealing drugs on the side for extra cash whilst on JSA, and didn't aquire their stuff through honest means such as working before they found themselves on benefits, then you are just as bad as they are for not reporting them.