The new "Normal" in America

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by beezzer

 

Why don't we just try to get a common definition of Liberty instead?

A country where the people tell government to 'sit down and shut up'.

Liberty ! !.

Liberty : a Government is the servant not the master of it's people.

Liberty : Where a person ends up in life is what they make of it themselves, and thank no other for the privilege.

Liberty : A country where the government doesn't get to spy on it's citizens, where it doesn't rob from peter to pay paul, and it is not the duty or responsibliity to pay for the citizens existence, save only the people who are not able body or mind, anyone else they are on there own.

Liberty Don't like crap done to oneself don't do crap to someone else.

My definitions.

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by beezzer

 

On or off or paying/not paying into the 'dole' is your only definition of liberty?

Not at all.

But I'm trying to tie it into what you were saying that you wanted.

Look, we pay taxes already. Keep the programs.

What we can both agree on is NDAA, NSA, DHS intrusions. The freedoms that we are losing due in part to legislation and the creation of these programs.

This is the "big tamale'" here.

With our freedoms lost;
My independence is lost.
Your freedoms to do what you want are lost.

Why spend time debating the arrangement of the deck chairs when the Titanic is taking on water?

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by beezzer

 

On or off or paying/not paying into the 'dole' is your only definition of liberty?

Not at all.

But I'm trying to tie it into what you were saying that you wanted.

Look, we pay taxes already. Keep the programs.

What we can both agree on is NDAA, NSA, DHS intrusions. The freedoms that we are losing due in part to legislation and the creation of these programs.

This is the "big tamale'" here.

With our freedoms lost;
My independence is lost.
Your freedoms to do what you want are lost.

Why spend time debating the arrangement of the deck chairs when the Titanic is taking on water?

I don't want government dependence just to be clear, I'd rather not have a need for a social safety net but in this current system where the boss takes 45% and the shareholders take 45% leaving 5% to employees out of profits, isn't working. It's not working when jobs are being shipped over seas either. This creates the need for government dependence.

Freedom and Liberty can also be defined by there being a means to support yourself. Being able to choose your own path in life without having to justify yourself to the government or to other voters.

When you wise up to the reality that the banks, and all the other giant corporations and institutions more responsible to the destruction of the U.S. than the government, then you will start to figure it all out.

When greed is touted as a virtue, this is what you get.

When the rich are allowed to live by a different set of rules, then this is what you get.

When the market system of the exchange of goods and services is replaced by gambling, this is what you get.

If you strip away the "wedge issues" from politics then what's left it essentially a collection of political sociopaths building a State-Corporate oligarchy. This is what the older people called Fascism.

The struggle in America is not Democrats VS Republicans, it is the Political Class VS the Citizen.

Once you stop thinking in terms of the fake chess game and Kabuki theater of partisan politics then you start seeing the truth.

The Political Class NEEDS the "wedge issues" to mask their collusion and keep the Citizens fooled.

Every political position is seemingly parceled among the Parties out to keep America always at a 50/50 split or to favor the Political Class.

For example, if 60% of the People want reductions in spending (lean conservative) this will always be cancelled by the 60% of the People that want NO abortion restrictions at all (lean liberal). The end result is that nothing gets done about spending.

****

Everything our leaders say you can find them taking the opposite position in the past because it's all a game.

The goal of the Political Class is always institutionalized corruption, massive public debt, unrestrained spending, and destruction of the Constitution. Those that stand in the way of the goals of the Political Class are to be ridiculed or destroyed.

It's interesting that when people start becoming really vocal about the NSA all of a sudden we have this worldwide global terror threat to scare us back into supporting the NSA and it's illegal domestic spying. The brilliant solution to the "threat" is to just close embassies for few days because we all know terrorists work on a tight schedule and they'll have to reschedule for next year's Ramadan holiday instead.

Originally posted by neo96

Liberty : A country where the government doesn't get to spy on it's citizens, where it doesn't rob from peter to pay paul, and it is not the duty or responsibliity to pay for the citizens existence, save only the people who are not able body or mind, anyone else they are on there own.

This idiom is thrown around without an understanding of what it means. Peter and Paul were relatively equal in status and condition. Thus taking money from one to give to the other offered no change in situation for either party involved - no net gain.

Morally speaking using this particular idiom as a means of decrying charitable behavior is very contrary as both Peter and Paul were proponents of helping the needy and feeding the hungry.

Realistically if anyone is robbing Peter to pay Paul it's the banksters and corporate pirates who make careers out of gaming the bloated system for personal gain.

reply to post by poet1b

When you wise up to the reality that the banks, and all the other giant corporations and institutions more responsible to the destruction of the U.S.

BS

Keep recycling that progressive liberal machination rooted in the same freaking ideology that's killing this country doesn't make it any more true than the past 100 years of the same talking point heard over and over by Americans,.

That right there is part of the problem now back to arguing over fiat currency and corporate products.

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by poet1b

 

When you wise up to the reality that the banks, and all the other giant corporations and institutions more responsible to the destruction of the U.S.

BS

Keep recycling that progressive liberal machination rooted in the same freaking ideology in this country doesn't make it any more than than for that past 100 years of the same talking point heard over and over by Americans,.

That right there is part of the problem now back to arguing over fiat currency and corporate products.

And here, we shall sadly remain.

reply to post by Hefficide

This idiom is thrown around without an understanding of what it means.

Oh?

Incur a new debt to pay off an old debt still creates debt from where I sit way to many pauls not enough peters.

That has the effect of 17 trillion in debt.

Morally speaking I don't know how anyone has so much contempt of their fellow citizen as they are being told 'they can't make it without someone else's 'benevolence'.

Sorry don't get my morality from other people. and i sure the hell don't get my morality from Government.

Originally posted by beezzer
The "New Normal".

The new "Normal" is high unemployment.

The new "Normal" is millions on food stamps.

The new "Normal" is millions on government aid.

The new "Normal" is redistributed wealth.

The new "Normal" is no more White House tours.

The new "Normal" is one set of rules for you and I, another set for "them".

The new "Normal" is NSA spying on you.

The new "Normal" is drones flying in American skies.

The new "Normal" is indiscriminate attacks on American citizens without due process.

The new "Normal" is gun control.

The new "Normal" is "Free Speech Zones".

The new "Normal" is treaties with our enemies and attacks against our allies.

The new Normal" is nanny care government.

The new "Normal" is victimhood.

The new "Normal" is being afraid all the time.

The new "Normal" is the government feeding that fear.

The new "Normal" is a divided country.

The new "Normal" is us fighting amongst ourselves.

The new "Normal" is blaming others for your own faults, and getting away with it.

The new "Normal" is reality shows on tv and no reality in the news.

The new "Normal" is ignoring the constituents and listening to the lobbyists.

The new "Normal" is crying over one death and ignoring the deaths of thousands.

The new "Normal" is the decay of the Constitution and the birth of See Something, Say Something.

The new "Normal" is the justification of hate, and the embrace of discord, and calling it "Justice".

The new "Normal" is calling whistleblowers traitors, and traitors, patriots.

The new "Normal".

Embrace the madness.

I don't know.
Quite honestly, to me, there's nothing new about any of those things you listed.
It's been worse.

Remember the Great Depression?
Or life before civil rights?
The World Wars. The Cold War? The Vietnam and Korean Wars? Those were fun times for sure.

I guess what I'm saying is I'd rather live under this so called "new normal" than any of the normals from back then...

But that's just me

reply to post by neo96


I'd suggest a trip to the ghetto to see how marvelous life on social programs is. Then, once you've seen that - pick up a copy of Fortune 500 and compare.

I think once you've done that you might understand just who is benefiting from this system. Clue: It's not the anonymous armies of welfare recipients you seem to detest so much.

Originally posted by Kali74

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by poet1b

 

When you wise up to the reality that the banks, and all the other giant corporations and institutions more responsible to the destruction of the U.S.

BS

Keep recycling that progressive liberal machination rooted in the same freaking ideology in this country doesn't make it any more than than for that past 100 years of the same talking point heard over and over by Americans,.

That right there is part of the problem now back to arguing over fiat currency and corporate products.

And here, we shall sadly remain.

Yeah the banks and corporations are the problem!!!

Are you GD kidding me ?

Fiat currency and corporate products same trash over and over again.

Originally posted by Hefficide
reply to post by neo96

 

I'd suggest a trip to the ghetto to see how marvelous life on social programs is. Then, once you've seen that - pick up a copy of Fortune 500 and compare.

I think once you've done that you might understand just who is benefiting from this system. Clue: It's not the anonymous armies of welfare recipients you seem to detest so much.

www.usdebtclock.org...

I see 17 trillion dollars in debt I clearly see who is benefiting here.

I See $2.2 trillion in current federal spending on social engineering programs alone

I see $125 trillion dollars in promiise's made that can never be paid for.

I see $75 trillion in household assets

I clearly see who is benefiting and hell that's not enough the greedy people want more.

In my opinion the biggest problems on this planet are governments, the msm, the current banking system and corporations. If these were properly run/regulated and transparent (president Obama "a more transparent government" lol) the rest of our problems could be tackled quickly and efficiently!

We have a problem with corporations influencing legislation. Influencing politicians.

That needs to change. But in order to do that, we need politicians that can negate the loopholes that allow this type of influence peddling.

reply to post by beezzer

Well said Bunny Wabbit!

Good thing I was never "normal".

Originally posted by beezzer
We have a problem with corporations influencing legislation. Influencing politicians.

That needs to change. But in order to do that, we need politicians that can negate the loopholes that allow this type of influence peddling.

BUT

Politicians know they get more cash every single time they write more powerful laws it will never end because they know they get lifetime campaign financing from it.

The only way to decrease that 'corporate' influence is to shrink the size and power of government.

THEY ONLY WAY.

reply to post by beezzer


I think they're stocking up on the snake oil.

The more I see, read and watch the news, the more and more concerned I've become for what's in store for the American people. This just didn't happen over night. This was carefully planned from the get go to destroy our way of life. I have a feeling it's way bigger than we could even imagine at this stage.

Originally posted by neo96

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by neo96

 

The problem is, too many are ALSO proud of it as well.

We shall defend our ATS , whatever the cost may be, we shall fight in the threads, we shall fight them in every post, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender.

Never give up, Never Surrender ! !

We simply lay down roll over play dead ?

They win.

All that will destroy evil is a greater evil. Evil wins.
All that bothers me about that is how I'm starting to act like
my ancestors... some of them pretty creative.