It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Muslims promote Sharia law. Why do Christians not promote their law?

page: 1
1
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jul, 30 2013 @ 07:07 PM
link   
Muslims promote Sharia law. Why do Christians not promote their law?

Some Muslim communities run with Sharia law. Other nations with a high Muslim population promote Sharia. It would seem from this phenomenon that Muslim law can be used to run a society as it does so in a few countries.

I know of no country that uses Christian or biblical law and have not heard of any Christian effort to have their law accepted in their nation.

This indicates that either Muslims are more religious than Christians, or Christians know that their laws would never be accepted as the law of the land.

Meanwhile, the vast majority of nations have rejected both sets of religious laws for a more secular approach to law and governance.

Briefly ---

Which of these three sets of laws do you think are superior and why?

Regards
DL




posted on Jul, 30 2013 @ 07:12 PM
link   
You don't think they do?

Anti-abortion movements often see their inception with Evangelical movements.

ETA

Hell for a long time that was the republican go to, Christian values.
edit on 30-7-2013 by benrl because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 30 2013 @ 07:17 PM
link   
reply to post by Greatest I am
 


Western laws are based on the values from Christian (and Jewish) beliefs.
edit on 30-7-2013 by abeverage because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 30 2013 @ 07:19 PM
link   
reply to post by Greatest I am
 



This indicates that either Muslims are more religious than Christians, or Christians know that their laws would never be accepted as the law of the land.

Meanwhile, the vast majority of nations have rejected both sets of religious laws for a more secular approach to law and governance.


With all respect, I think this indicates a need to look more into your topic for whats different in the two pictures here. Islam and Christianity.

Among other things, Christianity is a system formed in opposition from it's literal first day, to organized and standing Governments. Meanwhile, always working to find a comfortable spot to co-exist along side one's of all flavors, all over the world

Islam, on the other hand, is a system formed by what came TO form the Government/Caliphate and has always been a near inseparable mixture of Political, Cultural and Religious with hardly a line to speak of between them in many examples.

To assume one acts as the State while the other just the influence or inspiration behind it by some deliberate choosing of place just doesn't make sense to the two different systems of Religion, IMO.



posted on Jul, 31 2013 @ 12:41 AM
link   
reply to post by Greatest I am
 


The simple truth is that the laws of this nation are based on Biblical truths. Many don't want to accept that, but it's a fact. These days, too, when Christians even express their views in the political arena, they are treated as though they have no right to do so. Not passing "Christian" laws, but simply operating under moral values, etc. Laws against murder, and stealing are Biblical.



posted on Jul, 31 2013 @ 09:27 AM
link   
Catholics executed more people that have been killed by all Islamic terrorists put together.
But, time marches on. Catholics reformed their religion. No more beheading infidels and heretics. Good for them.

New Testament protestants also killed people regularly and unjustly in the American colonies. They were more mellow on murder in the name of the invisible dude in the sky.

A Religious clone won't recognize this, but the problem with religious law is it's always a cruel and oppressive apparatus invented by elites and used to gain power over other people, assets and lots of sex.

I have no use for wannabe Gods and their clones.



posted on Jul, 31 2013 @ 10:55 AM
link   
reply to post by InverseLookingGlass
 


Catholics executed more people that have been killed by all Islamic terrorists put together.
But, time marches on. Catholics reformed their religion. No more beheading infidels and heretics. Good for them.

That's quite a statement. Have anything aside from pure personal opinion to support such sweeping generalizations? It sounds pretty far fetched from where I sit. However, you're pretty specific and very confident, so I imagine you have material ready to back it....right?

It's kinda hard to debate Muslims and Christians for difference in religions to live under if we're not supporting major defining points like that, IMO. (Particularly ones that would so casually condemn a primary world Faith)



posted on Jul, 31 2013 @ 11:49 AM
link   

Muslims promote Sharia law. Why do Christians not promote their law?

Most Christians are kept under control by SECULAR RULE OF LAW.

Unfortunately, most Muslims have Islamic rule of law in their countries.
So they get to push their religions and aren't kept under control


That's the key .... keep religion out of government that way the different religions can't force their
ignorance on others and there aren't fights over which religion is running things.

If the entire world were run under secular rule of law, people would be a lot better off.



posted on Jul, 31 2013 @ 11:52 AM
link   

Originally posted by InverseLookingGlass
Catholics executed more people that have been killed by all Islamic terrorists put together.

That's simply not true.
Estimated numbers of people killed by Muslim aggression through the centuries



posted on Jul, 31 2013 @ 12:23 PM
link   
reply to post by Greatest I am
 



Matthew 22:36
“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’
40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”


Kinda hard to enforce.




edit on 31-7-2013 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 04:35 AM
link   
reply to post by Greatest I am
 


because Christians were sold the idea that they have gone past the need to have a Law as the Holy Spirit Itself guides them! and Jesus pbuh paid the price to set them free from the Law. Very convinient and appealing to buy.
In reality they have two options to follow, either the Law Moses pbuh got or the Sharia Muhammad pbuh got otherwise they cannot claim to be obedient to God.



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 04:53 AM
link   

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by Greatest I am
 



Matthew 22:36
“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’
40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”


Kinda hard to enforce.




He is affirming that there are other laws that are basically derived from the above two.
The laws about justice etc can be figured out easily but not all could be understood and so the need to obey all.



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 04:53 AM
link   

edit on 1-8-2013 by logical7 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 05:27 AM
link   

Originally posted by logical7
Christians were sold the idea that they have gone past the need to have a Law as the Holy Spirit Itself guides them!

What planet are you from? That's not even close to being true.

In reality they have two options to follow, either the Law Moses pbuh got or the Sharia Muhammad pbuh got otherwise they cannot claim to be obedient to God.

:shk: That's absurd. Jesus Himself said - (Matthew 22:37) Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?" 37And He said to him, "'YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.' 38"This is the great and foremost commandment.…

ETA ... also, Sharia isn't from God. It was made up by a person who claimed visions from God but he gave no proof of those so-called visions. And, since Islam contradicts what Jesus said, Christians rightly reject it as a poor fabrication.
edit on 8/1/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 06:06 AM
link   
reply to post by Greatest I am
 


What are you talking about many countries have adopted Christianity as there primary religion, all of north america for one. Most of the laws that form our society stem from Christianity. That's why in north america you have several christian churches in most neighborhoods. That's why we love our neighbors as ourselves, and we do unto others as we'd have others do unto us. And why we have a normal well structured civil society. Without any christian moral fiber in place the nation would be in chaos, and we've seen more and more as newer and newer generations are starting to stray from God and to all the endless secular humanism what that's brought to our society in so many negative and evil ways.



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 06:41 AM
link   
reply to post by FlyersFan
 





This is the great and foremost commandment.…

yes, its the 1st and the most important but not the only. Right?

Jesus pbuh did not come with a new religion he came with a reformation in Judaism. Not to destroy the Law but to complete it.

If majority Jews would have accepted him, would they change the name of their religion to christianity??
They would have just considered that the promised Messiah came as propheciesed and would have followed him and his teachings.

Paul canceled the Judaic laws like circumcision, dietry laws, praying and fasting etc that the Jews still practice and so do muslims as they got the same message that each prophet came with and some Prophets came with a well defined Law for daily conduct, worshipping, human interactions etc.
Moses and Muhammad peace be upon them came with it.
Jesus pbuh forbade from preaching to gentiles as he knew a prophet for them is coming.
He said about the Spirit of truth, the advocate coming and teaching them things he couldn't teach them that time. Tell me if he way talking about Holy Spirit, then what new things It has taught you that Jesus pbuh hadn't taught?

You think God would just leave people with command to Love Him and Love the neighbour and go figure out everything else by democracy and secular law!!!



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 06:58 AM
link   
reply to post by FlyersFan
 





since Islam contradicts what Jesus said,

Islam does not contradicts what Jesus pbuh said, Islam may contradict what Paul said and what the Church controlled and altered gospels may say.
Islam may contradict the Interpretations that Christians make from the gospels.

The greatest and foremost commandment is the same in Islam and also the command to be best to the neighbour.
Prophet Muhammad pbuh said, "one is not a believer if he/she sleeps full stomach and the neighbour sleeps hungry.
Jesus pbuh said that the God, our Lord is One and nobody upholds it more than Muslims and Jews.
Worshipping anyone/anything other that God is shirk.
Asking help from any created god, idol, dead saints even from Mary is shirk.
Only God deserves complete devotion, we should seek help and pray to the One God whom Jesus pbuh prayed to. Praying or worshipping Jesus pbuh is shirk and Jesus pbuh wouldn't be approving it.
It contradicts his greatest teaching to love God with all of heart, mind and strength.
How can you do that if you are dividing that towards the Father, son and Spirit? and ultimately just praying to Jesus pbuh?
Is this so difficult to understand?



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 08:05 AM
link   

Originally posted by logical7
Islam does not contradicts what Jesus pbuh said, Islam may contradict what Paul said and what the Church controlled and altered gospels may say. Islam may contradict the Interpretations that Christians make from the gospels.

Islam contradicts the first hand eyewitness gospels. Islam contradicts Jesus Himself. It's FICTION. I find it comical that you think the gospels were altered but somehow think that Muhammad, 600+ years after Jesus walked the Earth, somehow got the stories right.


One such example
Islam contradicts first hand eyewitness bible accounts of the life of Jesus


Qur'an 4:157. That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus The son of Mary, The apostle of Allah"; But they killed him not, Nor crucified him, But so it was made To appear to them, And those who differ Therein are full of doubts, With no (certain) knowledge, But only conjecture to follow, For of a surety, They killed him not.

The Bible clearly and plainly teaches that Jesus was crucified on the cross.

Matthew 27:35, 35 And they crucified him, and parted his garments, casting lots: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, They parted my garments among them, and upon my vesture did they cast lots.

1 Corinthians 1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumbling block, and unto the Greeks foolishness;


And as far as your continued 'Jesus isn't God' stuff ... :shk: EVEN THE ANGELS ADORE AND WORSHIP CHRIST. And they wouldn't be doing that if He wasn't God. Angels know adoration belongs to God alone. You've been shown that the Christian bible does indeed state that Jesus is God incarnate and that, according to the bible, Jesus Himself claimed the title. Obviously Islam would be shown to be irrelevant if Jesus is God incarnate, so the Muslims go out of their way to try to debunk that the bible says this. (Failing miserably as they try.)

"To the angel of the church in Smyrna write: These are the words of him who is the First and the Last, who died and came to life again." Revelation 2:8

more historical errors and contradictions in Islam

And according to the Qu'ran .. Jesus meets the requirements to be God Incarnate. READ HERE .

God alone can create out of nothing (i.e. the literal meaning of khalaqa).
Khalaqa is applied to Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus must be God according to Islam.


The Qu'ran contradicts original scripture. It cherry picks what it wants and doesn't want, making distortions along the way, from the original religious texts. It does this to try to validate itself because original scripture proves Islam wrong.

"Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made... He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him." John 1:3, 10

"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For BY HIM all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created BY HIM and FOR HIM. He is before all things, and IN HIM all things hold together. And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy." Colossians 1:15-18

"but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven... And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says, 'Let all God's angels worship him'... But about the Son he says... 'In the beginning, O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of your hands. They will perish, but you remain; they will all wear out like a garment. You will roll them up like a robe; like a garment they will be changed. But you remain the same, and your years will never end.'" Hebrews 1:2-3, 6, 8a, 10-12

The 'I AM' statements from Jesus - who is GOD

John 8:58 Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM."

Jesus claims the ancient title of God ... I AM.

edit on 8/1/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 09:05 AM
link   

Originally posted by logical7
Jesus pbuh did not come with a new religion he came with a reformation in Judaism. Not to destroy the Law but to complete it.

Jesus Himself started a new church and put Peter in charge ..

Matthew 16:18-19 Jesus said - And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. 19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven


Jesus pbuh forbade from preaching to gentiles as he knew a prophet for them is coming.

Jesus told the apostles to preach to the Jews FIRST. He later told them to preach to all nations. This commission was especially given to PAUL.

...he is a chosen vessel unto Me, to bear My name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel..." (Acts 9:15).

Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations... (Matthew 28:19)

Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. (Mark 16:15)

Jesus here for the lost sheep of Israel

We should understand Jesus’ words here not as an outright rejection of the Gentiles—moments later, He heals the woman’s daughter (Matthew 15:28)—but as a fulfillment of prophecy, a setting of priorities, and a test of the woman’s faith.

In Jeremiah 50:6, God calls Israel His people and “lost sheep.” The Messiah, spoken of throughout the Old Testament, was seen as the one who would gather these “lost sheep” (Ezekiel 34:23-24; Micah 5:4-5). When Jesus presented Himself as a shepherd to Israel, He was claiming to be the fulfillment of Messianic prophecy (Mark 6:34, 14:27; John 10:11-16; see also Hebrews 13:20; 1 Peter 5:4; and Revelation 7:17).


Peter instructed by God to preach to all nations including gentiles -
Oh .. and this further confirms that Jesus died on the cross and rose from the dead.
Acts 10

Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: but in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him. The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all
that word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached; how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him. And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree: Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly; not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead. And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead. To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.



He said about the Spirit of truth, the advocate coming and teaching them things he couldn't teach them that time. Tell me if he way talking about Holy Spirit, then what new things It has taught you that Jesus pbuh hadn't taught?

Muhammad isn't prophecied as coming in the gospels. That's abusrd. The Holy Spirit is the Holy Spirit .. not Muhammad. The Holy Spirit is the SANCTIFIER. He teaches in the soul. DEEP things .. things that the mundane orgy-of-senses- based Islamic religion can't understand.

50 Things The Holy Spirit Does

1. He convicts the world of sin, righteousness, and judgment (John 16:8).
2. He guides us into all truth (John 16:13).
3. He regenerates us (John 3:5-8; Titus 3:5).
4. He glorifies and testifies of Christ (John 15:26; 16:14).
5. He reveals Christ to us and in us (John 16:14-15).
6. He leads us (Rom. 8:14; Gal. 5:18; Matt. 4:1; Luke 4:1).
7. He sanctifies us (2 Thess. 2:13; 1 Pet. 1:2; Rom. 5:16).
8. He empowers us (Luke 4:14; 24:49; Rom. 15:19; Acts 1:8).

etc etc etc etc
edit on 8/1/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2013 @ 11:34 AM
link   
reply to post by FlyersFan
 





Jesus Himself claimed the title.

Really?
show me that claim.

"To the angel of the church in Smyrna
write: These are the words of him who
is the First and the Last, who died and
came to life again." Revelation 2:8

who wrote it?
Hindus have texts much older than gospels where god incarnates many times over many ages and that incarnations are worshipped. Does it make it true?

And according to the Qu'ran .. Jesus
meets the requirements to be God
Incarnate.

really?
1st the site that you use for your arguement.
Secondly, that article picks up criteria for God from Qur'an and then finds verses in gospels that meet that requirement!!
Verses that are written by Paul or unidentified authors who already believed that Jesus is god.

Try better next time



Jesus claims the ancient title of God ... I
AM.

NO

Jesus pbuh was merely answering the jews how Abraham pbuh knew about him and his time and he said before Abraham was, i am.
Jesus pbuh is propheciesed in the OT, ofcourse the Prophets knew about the coming of later Prophets so he was in the plan and each soul that is to be born till the judgement day are already decided by God.



new topics

top topics



 
1
<<   2 >>

log in

join