The woman in the article at the top of the post is an idiot. She hates "Americans". If she had half a brain she would have said that she more properly hates the Bush administration.

Me? I live in the UK and have travelled to the US about 20 times. I don't find the people there much different from the people here. We share the same ideals, almost the same culture, the same language, there are more similarities than differences. So basically following her logic, this woman hates the UK too. She should think before she opens her mouth or puts her fingers on a keyboard.

As for WW2, I've made my feelings clear in another thread. There are good reasons why the British feel annoyed at the US for WW2. We fought alone against the mightiest army on Earth for 3 years whilst America protected her own interests. And believe it or not that still smarts.
It's silly to say that the only reason the US joined WW2 was to liberate Europe. There was self interest at heart here. The US government knew that if they didn't act they would only have to deal with Hitler later down the years. There is seldom (if ever) a noble reason for war and WW2 was no exception. Freedom and the defeat of an oppressive regime was a by product - just as it is in Iraq. But these by products benefited the whole of Europe, including the UK, and without US intervention we would have been goners- whatever the misguided patriots say.
So it's damn stupid for Brits to keep harping on about how the US was late in WW2. The fact is that the Yanks pulled our irons out of the fire. We don't owe them for that, because they were looking after themselves. Nor do they owe us as it wasn't their war to start with and we kept our freedom because of them.

As for the US today? I see it's role as the policemen. The trouble is that the policeman in any community has to be whiter than white and America just doesn't manage that at the moment. Maybe in the future, but it's not quite there yet. America has never had to learn humbleness or humility so it's very hard for it to communicate with other nations without coming across as brash and naive. But it's just as brash and naive for any non-American to label a whole country as evil when they don't understand the things that make it tick.
The US is a relatively new world leader. The Greeks, Egyptians, the Roman Empire, the British Empire ruled most of the world for hundreds of years in their eras.
It took them time to get things right in the beginning too.

Originally posted by Gazrok
"But for other people who have problems with bits of America, why should they be forced to leave the country because they don't like those bits? Don't you think that's just a bit authoritarian?"

Thing is, most of the Americans who dislike those bits...don't even vote for what they want!

My invitation to leave was for those who hate America, not for those who hate some of the things we've done. Heck, I don't agree with a lot of our current foreign policy (Bush Sr. was a master at this-despite the Japan dinner incident, hehe...), as Bush Jr. doesn't even know basic world geography, let alone world politics (amazing that a Harvard grad could be that dumb, isn't it? Not when your degree is paid for I guess...)

You see? This is how I get pulled into stupid political conflicts, people say stupid crap.

Gaz, your hate for the shrub is showing by your baseless and assumptive statements about his education.

As far his geography knowledge, you'd better go back and research that whole geography thing again. And when you do, ask yourself a couple questions. Would Gore have known them? Your answer should be "no" if you want to play the odds. The next question is would the liberal media establishment ewven attempt to trip Gore. Again, the answer is a resounding "NO"!

Originally posted by dom
I tell you guys, this is the whole problem with American right now.

"You don't like us? Well F*ck you. We're saved your asses back in 1943, you do what we tell you to do. You're only alive because of us. How dare you say that we can't do what we want."

Really TC, this article is "opinion", opinion is based on facts. The lady is telling you how she feels about your country. It's a feeling that is increasingly common in the UK, and across the world. Doesn't this frighten you at all?

This woman is saying that your entire culture is becoming obsessed with violence and war, but that you don't understand what that implys, hence your disney aircraft dropping bombs that kill people. US soldiers shooting civilians, and none of you care, because they're not American civilians, just foreigners. As a good Christian would put it; God Help You.

I also agree that the U.S. helped Brittain during the second world war, though this is a different matter completely.
Hitler oppenly expressed his desire to aquire "Libersrum" or Living space for Germany. He needed to be stopped. It was in the U.S.'s best interest to stop him.
This is a War against Terrorism. It is in all our best interests to stop this from happening to inocent people.

"Gaz, your hate for the shrub is showing by your baseless and assumptive statements about his education.
As far his geography knowledge, you'd better go back and research that whole geography thing again. And when you do, ask yourself a couple questions. Would Gore have known them? Your answer should be "no" if you want to play the odds. The next question is would the liberal media establishment ewven attempt to trip Gore. Again, the answer is a resounding "NO"!"


I do not Hate the Shrub, I just find him amusing, and I'm a bit embarrased he's our president. As for the geography bit, I'm sorry, but anybody in politics (Gore included) should have known some of the things he's gotten wrong (hell, I know, and it's not my job to). I would have slammed Gore equally.

Look, Shrub is so known for making assanine comments, that they were able to put together a whole calendar with one saying a day that cracks you up. And this was only after being in office for a couple years! I will not apologize for cracking on Bush's intelligence.

We usually see eye-to-eye on a lot of things TC, but Dubya is not one of them.

TC - You almost did it. You almost viewed the world from a different perspective, you allowed yourself to think that perhaps this woman is annoyed with America because of... some... reason...

But you really haven't followed through with that, and instead just picked the silly excuse that she must love Saddam Hussein.

This intensely arrogant view that anything the US does must be right, and can only be good, is dangerous. It's the kind of thing that allowed the Nazi's to exterminate the Jews, or Stalin to rule Russia with an iron fist, or the US to go to war with Vietnam and kill millions of people. Sometimes the US doesn't do the right thing, sometimes the wrong people are making the decisions, sometimes the US pisses a lot of people off and things like 9/11 happen, sometimes Americans recognise that, sometimes they simply can't entertain the idea that bad things might happen to the US because the US does bad things...

The reason that this thread is very important, is because the whole war on terrorism is a result of people who feel like this lady (in a roundabout way). You're all lead to believe that only extremists hate America, but it's not ture. Lots of people hate America (or at least it's foreign policy) because of the horrendous hypocisy of it all. Ignoring the UN doesn't help to dispel the myth that the US just does what it wants for it's own reasons. And finding no WMD's in Iraq after using them for public justification doesn't help much either.

certainly holds no monopoly on hypocracy when it comes to foreign policy....that's for sure....

Not a monopoly, but to be totally honest I've been sitting here racking my brains trying to think of a country with a more hypocritic foreign policy and I can't come up with any.

All the "evil" states admit the evil-doing...

Personally I like the artwork that I've seen on fighters and bombers. I had the impression that forces have done that for years not just GW2?
OIL OIL OIL OIL OIL

"trying to think of a country with a more hypocritic foreign policy and I can't come up with any"

Uhmm.....France?

Liberated Iraq?
The largest oil drilling site in Iraq is expected yo be at full 140,000 barrels per day capacity by May 27. It remains heavily guarded by American "peace-keeping" troops on shoot-first status order. This is while Iraqi families are being slapped in the face with 40$ a month. And, of course, the interim Iraqi government is being pushed back yet again by our wonderful Administration.

America will remain in power in Iraq until the oil is consumed and only then will we withdraw.

Remember Afganistan? Well, America does not. The rebuilding of Iraq will no more take place than the rebuilding of Afganistan.

I live in an America consumed with consumers who consume.

Z

Originally posted by Zodiak
Liberated Iraq?
The largest oil drilling site in Iraq is expected yo be at full 140,000 barrels per day capacity by May 27. It remains heavily guarded by American "peace-keeping" troops on shoot-first status order. This is while Iraqi families are being slapped in the face with 40$ a month. And, of course, the interim Iraqi government is being pushed back yet again by our wonderful Administration.

America will remain in power in Iraq until the oil is consumed and only then will we withdraw.

Remember Afganistan? Well, America does not. The rebuilding of Iraq will no more take place than the rebuilding of Afganistan.

I live in an America consumed with consumers who consume.

Z

Mate you deserve your mood!!!
Somebody from america that really is keeping an eye to this, i wish more people thought like you in this matter, good to know that americans are resisting the biased media, and the manipulation systems of the elites....

Wow, we are being assaulted by liberal wimps, haven't you guys set in the corner and questioned every decision in the world for about the last ,oh, 2000 years?

S-h-i-t or get off the pot buddy!

Thankyou for your valuable contribution

Originally posted by Zodiak
Liberated Iraq?
The largest oil drilling site in Iraq is expected yo be at full 140,000 barrels per day capacity by May 27. It remains heavily guarded by American "peace-keeping" troops on shoot-first status order. This is while Iraqi families are being slapped in the face with 40$ a month. And, of course, the interim Iraqi government is being pushed back yet again by our wonderful Administration.


America will remain in power in Iraq until the oil is consumed and only then will we withdraw.

I refute your points. It makes absolute sense to put armed troops on a shoot first order to protect Iraqi infrastructure. If Iraq has no means to pump oil, it has no future.

I doubt very, very much the US will bleed the Iraqi oil wells dry. It's totatally and utterly not in their interest to do so. They are far more likely to buy the oil at a cheaper price.

And finally - $40 a month? They're getting far more than they did under Saddam's regime.

To say that without America there would be no freedom is completely untrue. I'm sorry but there are some incredibly right wing insidious little morons on this site and a great proportion of these are exactly those who proclaim that America has the right to rule the world. It's one thing to love your country, but you have to recognise that it has faults. It's precisely those people who love their countrys who take the time to try and understand what's going wrong with them and have a social conscience. It's America and not Americans that we despise, the arrogance and hypocrisy that it inflicts upon the world and the fact that it's all going to hell because of ione nation destroying any chance of a better future for any of us.

It was the Moral Obligation of the United States to enter the Second World War, and to bring an end to fascism. Nobody "owes" anyone anything.

I despise American foreign policy, and the blind, mindless patriotism of those American citezens who are afraid to challenge their government post 9/11 ( the same government who allowed the attrocities to take place ). I believe that The Project For The New American Century ( look it up on google, it's an official organisation who's existence is widely publicised ) is now in full swing. The US are beginning to establish their influence in the middle east. That was the purpose of this war, not oil. The real profitiers of this conflict will be the American construction companies who secure reconstruction contracts in Iraq.

For as long as I can remember, my country has been invaded by American "culture" - their TV shows, their multinational fast food chains, their consumer products - to the extent that it has all but replaced the culture of my own nation.

In South America, the Coca - Cola company have introduced rainforest-dwelling tribes to their products. The native tribes love Coke, but they have absolutely no access to dental care. Nobody thought about their wellbeing in the long term, it was all about making money.

And this is all the Bush administration intend to do. They want to spread American culture and values acroos the globe, so that the elite of their country - those who hold all the real power - can profit even more from global capitalism. This is what we used to call "Imperialism".

Bush doesnt want Iraqi oil, nor is he interested in liberating the people of Iraq from Saddam Hussein. All he wants is his own "Mini-Me" state in the middle-east.

If he comes across some oil while building the American Empire, however, I'm sure the shrub won't hesitate to help himself.

For as long as I can remember, my country has been invaded by American "culture" - their TV shows, their multinational fast food chains, their consumer products - to the extent that it has all but replaced the culture of my own nation.

Yet you have no problem using the internet which is a result of the same American culture. Not to mention that the majority seem to enjoy these things you say you despise. If everyone in your nation weren't buying said items then american companies would not sell them there. Noone is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to eat a big mac.

Get a clue

Interestingly a lot of US companies try very hard to hide the fact that they're American, because indeed, it can hurt sales for a new brand (and old ones).

Examples : Woolworths, who'd have thought they were a US firm?

Macdonalds also tries hard to appear British even though it's a US firm (and everyone knows it). All the adverts are in true English and they do lots of food specifically for the UK market.

Basically, being American is only a selling point any more in entertainment. In most other industries American companies do better if they hide their roots. Doesn't change the fact that more and more American companies are buying up British companies, so sooner or later it's going to be pretty difficult to get certain products without sustaining the evil empire... oh well.

I'll just carry on with my current French wine drinking binge. Used to drink Blossom Hill, and a few other Californian whites, but they just don't taste the same anymore...

[Edited on 22-5-2003 by dom]

Originally posted by Fry2

For as long as I can remember, my country has been invaded by American "culture" - their TV shows, their multinational fast food chains, their consumer products - to the extent that it has all but replaced the culture of my own nation.

Yet you have no problem using the internet which is a result of the same American culture. Not to mention that the majority seem to enjoy these things you say you despise. If everyone in your nation weren't buying said items then american companies would not sell them there. Noone is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to eat a big mac.

Get a clue

The internet is based on telecommunications. The telephone was invented by Alexander Graham Bell, a Scotsman, not an American. And the internet was invented in Switzerland.

Also, I said I despise these things, not that everyone else in my country does.

Get a clue

[Edited on 22-5-2003 by CiderGood_HeadacheBad]

Yes, he was born in scotland but the idea came to him while in canada and the working model was developed in Boston.
As far as the internet goes...When did they move UCLA and MIT to Switzerland?