Henrico police shoot pet as they notify family of sons' homicide

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

Speaking of pit-bulls and their 'trainers.' The dogs mentioned in the article (below) were NOT shot, but today they surely would have been in my opinion. This happened in 2006 PRIOR to the BHO decision (extended from the Bush admin) to turn American into a police state.

The mother of the drug dealer son mentioned in the (partial) story had been a one time friend of mine. Sometime after the raid she was eventually attacked while washing dishes (out of no where and for no reason) by one the the "7 pitbulls" that she had raised from a puppy, and was her favorite of the litter. She came close to being killed. She lost one arm and almost lost the use of her other arm.

Of course they were trained by her dealer son to guard the house, but please don't ever think they can be trustworthy pets - they cannot.

January 13, 2006 (WPVI) -- Their luck ran out on Friday the 13th. The cops took them by surprise. They showed up just before 6:30 Friday morning and kicked in the front door. Once they got inside they found much more than they bargained for.

The cops were confronted by seven snarling pit bulls. And the people inside were armed to the teeth. They had enough firepower for a small army, including a machine gun. Police found one of the suspects in his bed with two loaded guns. But, no shots were fired during the raid. etc etc etc...........

BTW - I am not anti-cop...........I am anti Police State! There's a difference.

RedParrotHead
Thank you for the very informative post - it helped me to assess the situation in a much better way -

reply to post by F4guy

Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2012 1:00 am | Updated: 5:28 pm, Thu Jan 17, 2013.

This was updated just a few days ago, and this is the first time I've seen it. Is there a reason you can't read an article fully before being a douche?

Anyhow; I've worked with animals for most of my life in one way or another, dogs in particular. I've been attacked by more labs, setters, yorkies, chihuahuas, etc than I have any 'pit bull' - even the ones that were brought into shelters from fighting rings.

In the 70s it was german shepard dogs, in the 80s it was rottweillers or dobermans, now it's pitbulls.

When are people going to figure out that it's not the dog- it's the people and how they behave?

reply to post by Hushabye


The completely #ed up part is if one of their rabid K-9 units rushed at us for no reason, and we shot and killed him, we would spend the rest of our lives in a federal prison for killing a police officer....

This is total bull# >.>

How the hell can cops get away with being above the law? There is absolutely NO kind of recourse for situations like this....They do whatever the hell they want, whenever, to whoever; and they just get away with it......It's wrong! When are the American's who boast themselves on "Liberty or Death", gonna turn off American Idol, get off their fat, lazy, asses, and fix this country?

Originally posted by Hushabye
Anyhow; I've worked with animals for most of my life in one way or another, dogs in particular. I've been attacked by more labs, setters, yorkies, chihuahuas, etc than I have any 'pit bull' - even the ones that were brought into shelters from fighting rings.

In the 70s it was german shepard dogs, in the 80s it was rottweillers or dobermans, now it's pitbulls.

When are people going to figure out that it's not the dog- it's the people and how they behave?

Anyone who actually has a lot of experience working with various dogs in "worst case scenarios" will say the same thing. Experience trumps random personal anecdotes of "one time this thing happened." Most people are all too willing to let their bias be confirmed though. People love that, for better or worse, and are not willing to look into actual solutions for problems at hand. Most would rather bicker over things they know nothing about (we see it all the time on ATS).

People have little to no idea what they are talking about with canines, and 99% of trainers are just lucky that dogs are as smart as they are.

Sad story, "new" or not. I think that there should be training courses in how to handle dogs for police. They are incredibly easy to handle even in territorial situations. I think that it would eventually come to this reasonable solution if many cops were not above the law. The issue is that violence is their first response in many different situations, and dog or human, that is a serious problem that just seems to continue.

Saying all cops are pigs and are all pieces of sh%& is as stupid as saying all black people are criminals. There are plenty of police officers that genuinely good people, actually the VAST majority are.

Each instance needs to be evaluated on the facts of that particular case. I have seen plenty of cases posted here on police violence where anger at the police is more than justified. And the police involved clearly overstepped the legal authority and need to be prosecuted for their crimes.

Then again I have seen others where after reading the linked stories their actions are warranted.

Just ask yourself this before you start calling all police officers murderous pig bastards, if you were walking up to someone's house and a pit bull was charging you what would you do?

I'm not saying they all are bad- I know there are good ones, but they've alloted themselves with the #heads and I will no longer give them the benefit of the doubt. Too much 'shoot first, make excuses later.' They won't be prosecuted. They never are.

If a pitbull or any dog were charging at me, I'd use the experience I've built up over the years to deal with the situation- first and foremost- you don't just saunter up to a home where there's a good chance there's a dog loose.

Originally posted by bphi1908
Saying all cops are pigs and are all pieces of sh%& is as stupid as saying all black people are criminals. There are plenty of police officers that genuinely good people, actually the VAST majority are.

Each instance needs to be evaluated on the facts of that particular case. I have seen plenty of cases posted here on police violence where anger at the police is more than justified. And the police involved clearly overstepped the legal authority and need to be prosecuted for their crimes.

Then again I have seen others where after reading the linked stories their actions are warranted.

Just ask yourself this before you start calling all police officers murderous pig bastards, if you were walking up to someone's house and a pit bull was charging you what would you do?

Originally posted by bphi1908
if you were walking up to someone's house and a pit bull was charging you what would you do?

Companies that scoop dog poop do this day in and day out with zero issues. In fact, "pit bulls" (not an actual breed, as I am sure you know), are one of the least concerning.

Not all cops are bad, of course, and the good ones are in a really difficult position. The LEO's that are higher up in the system tend to be extremely happy with where they sit, corruption-wise, and attempting to rock the boat can lead to great difficulties. I think it is perceived that these "good cops" are just letting the "bad ones" do their thing, but if they attempt to really speak up about it, they are at great risk for losing their job. I know of some that feel they can make a difference in their own responses to incidents, but if they speak up about corruption and lose their job, then they cant make any difference whatsoever. I would think that being in such a position forces them to make some really difficult choices.

reply to post by Hushabye

I'm not saying they all are bad- I know there are good ones, but they've alloted themselves with the #heads and I will no longer give them the benefit of the doubt. Too much 'shoot first, make excuses later.' They won't be prosecuted. They never are.

You weren't who I was directing that at. And I agree with you. Cops caught doing something wrong are only prosecuted if there is video of an incident coupled with too much negative coverage.

If a pitbull or any dog were charging at me, I'd use the experience I've built up over the years to deal with the situation- first and foremost- you don't just saunter up to a home where there's a good chance there's a dog loose.

This I don't agree with, you personally may be better equipped to handle such a situation but the average person probably isn't. If you haven't been around dogs you don't know how to read a dog's body language. You add in a dog that has gained a reputation, deserved or not, of being a vicious breed and you have just created enough fear in a person to make poor judgements. If I was put in this same situation I can't say I wouldn't have done the same thing...I just don't know.

Not to mention the owner should have that dog on a leash or fenced in, that goes for all dogs not just pits. You can end up being liable for it if it bites a kid no matter what the situation was.

I think people use forums like this to misrepresent some situations and bash away, in this case I think a bit unfairly.

reply to post by Hushabye

If a pitbull or any dog were charging at me, I'd use the experience I've built up over the years to deal with the situation- first and foremost- you don't just saunter up to a home where there's a good chance there's a dog loose.

I am sincere in saying I mean no challenge in asking here, despite a somewhat energetic topic we're on here. Your statement left me really wondering though for two things.

First, if you're facing a dog on full charge and realize YOU are the target, and it sees you as an immediate an active threat to it's owners? What do you do? You said you have years of experience, so this is an honest to God serious question. No sarcasm. Not even a pinch.

On 2? The cops were there on a mercy call, so to speak, to break the news of a tragic death to the family. I'm not sure..was the dog even visible or was it lounging in the back somewhere when they first arrived? If they could see it...did they know it had a free running path straight into them if it chose? If all the above is affirmative and they DID see and know the dog could go wild on them, if it misinterpreted things..? What were they to do?

Again, honest and blunt question. They're sitting in front of the house in their patrol unit. They have news no one ever wants to deliver and they know it will destroy the people inside. They're not there to hurt anyone deliberately. Just deliver the unthinkable for news. They see the dog ...what now? Do they call dispatch to get a patch through to the residents inside and ask them to secure the dog before they get out? That *IS* a real option, I suppose ...but under those circumstances? Wouldn't that get exceptionally awkward before you could blink?

Companies that scoop dog poop do this day in and day out with zero issues. In fact, "pit bulls" (not an actual breed, as I am sure you know), are one of the least concerning.

Again you are dealing with people who are around dogs everyday and where the dog most likely recognizes the people in the yard. This cop may not have been and that dog most likely had no idea who he was.

I am aware there are different breeds but since the breed was not specified in the article I cannot say which. The article actually only say "dog" so I mistakenly got the breed from a responser to the OP and he was referring to a different incident so I shouldn't have even used that.

Not all cops are bad, of course, and the good ones are in a really difficult position. The LEO's that are higher up in the system tend to be extremely happy with where they sit, corruption-wise, and attempting to rock the boat can lead to great difficulties. I think it is perceived that these "good cops" are just letting the "bad ones" do their thing, but if they attempt to really speak up about it, they are at great risk for losing their job. I know of some that feel they can make a difference in their own responses to incidents, but if they speak up about corruption and lose their job, then they cant make any difference whatsoever. I would think that being in such a position forces them to make some really difficult choices.

We aren't speaking of police corruption, this involves a police officer who killed a dog and his decision to use deadly force rather than some other means of diffusing the situation.

Originally posted by bphi1908
Again you are dealing with people who are around dogs everyday and where the dog most likely recognizes the people in the yard. This cop may not have been and that dog most likely had no idea who he was.

As I said, cops should be trained to handle dogs when such a large percentage of the population has them in their homes. This solution would be a matter of course, if it was not a situation where many LEO's abide by a different set of rules than those they enforce (see:corruption).

Dogs get to know the people who do the scooping, but obviously not at first. That applies for both new hires and new clients. Its not a matter of individual familiarity, but with education and experience. Something which should be a "given" for law enforcement in a society where dogs are extremely commonplace.

We aren't speaking of police corruption, this involves a police officer who killed a dog and his decision to use deadly force rather than some other means of diffusing the situation.

You are missing my point entirely and I was only responding to what you said!

Sad very sad.. but as i usually look at things.

Do not put yourself, loved ones or personal belongings in a situation where some third party has to make a decision on their well being.

I have dogs, i keep them fenced and on a leash when they are not in my fenced yard..

some people may view a dog charging in many different manners. some may know how to deal with it, some may run, and some will attack the dog.

never put your dog in that situation.

I am not saying the actions of these police are justified but had the owners taken the proper precautions the dog would still be alive despite crappy cops visiting the home.

People really need to be vigilant about their business. Sure there are times that things are out of your hands but typically you can minimize those occasions by being responsible.

It could have very easily been some thug walking down the street that could have done that, or some man on a walk with his children..

why was the dog allowed to be in a situation where it could charge like that..

as usual stupid decisions on both sides end up with someone or in this case some pet dead.

reply to post by Hushabye

reply to post by Lysistrata


Yet another stalwart display of courage under fire by these two "police officers". I can only sympathize with them. The feeling of abject terror they must have experienced seeing a creature of such magnitude bearing down on them. I am surprised they were able to remain calm and slay the mighty beast.

Cowards....both of them.

These shootings wrench my gut. They are clearly without justification. After all, they do not wait until they are actually being physically assaulted. They simply assume that the animal is heading their direction on the attack. I could understand if the officers were in a hazardous situation --- such as attempting to arrest a violent resister or serving a dangerous warrant. There was no hazard in this incident. My god! Show some damn compassion. Think of someone other than yourself for a change oh high and mighty officer of the law(not to mention the view that officers consider themselves of irreplaceable importance). It does not surprise me that our increasingly tyrannic law absolves the perpetrators.

Yet, it sickens me. It sickens me because to look at this in a cold, calculating point of view these incidents are little more than intimidation and indoctrination. One day it will arise that an officer has shot a human running toward him. Shot a human running toward him because he felt his life was in danger; the intention of the victim not even being worth consideration any longer.

That kind of power is far too immense for peace officers to wield. Even the dogs deserve the benefit of the doubt. All the more so because, when you strip the badge of authority away from the shooter, that shooter would be facing one or several serious charges for acting in such reckless disregard of others.

reply to post by Hushabye


I live in this area, so this enrages me beyond belief. Especially since I have a 5 month old pitbull puppy who is THE biggest sweetheart dog I've ever had or met. I can't even imagine what I would do if a PIG did this to my pup. Actually, that's a lie... I'd break his legs, shoot his hands with his own gun, and then carve animal killer into his forehead Inglorious Basterds style. GOD I HATE NEWS LIKE THIS

Originally posted by gladtobehere
reply to post by Hushabye

 

Theres another thread about the French police who did something which seemed relatively tame (enforcing a law about facial coverings) and the people raised hell.

I agree with your post overall, but for the record "the people" didn't raise hell about it. Third world Muslim extremist immigrants did. They raise hell about anything.

Originally posted by XaqiStarchild
reply to post by Hushabye

 

I live in this area, so this enrages me beyond belief. Especially since I have a 5 month old pitbull puppy who is THE biggest sweetheart dog I've ever had or met. I can't even imagine what I would do if a PIG did this to my pup. Actually, that's a lie... I'd break his legs, shoot his hands with his own gun, and then carve animal killer into his forehead Inglorious Basterds style. GOD I HATE NEWS LIKE THIS

I don't understand your comparison.

That's like saying "I can't believe they shot and killed that man who was mentally and physically abused his entire life, trained to kill, and was attacking them! I have a 2 year old son that is so nice and loving. I can't image what I'd do if they did this to my child..."

That pitbull and your puppy are not the same animal and don't have the same temperament - not to mention that who knows how your puppy will behave when fully grown, stronger and feels it's territory is being threatened...those cute & playful "nips" will seem way different to the 9 year old kid chasing down a stray football that landed in your yard.

***BTW I'm not a pitbull hater. My niece has a very friendly (yet rambunctious) pit named Pebbles that seemingly wouldn't hurt a fly- but you better believe I watch her like a hawk when my 7 year old daughter plays with her, and when the play starts to get even a little rough I put a stop to it immediately.

Originally posted by Lysistrata
BTW - NOT excusing the cop brutality here but - This was not just a frisky little pup - it was the most dangerous breed there is - I despise the pitbull breed and feel that they should be outlawed and exterminated. They are no good and I know from personal experience. They are downright evil.

NO. THEY. ARE. NOT. Pitbulls are some of the friendliest dogs I've ever seen. The mean ones are mean because they had owners who abused them or trained them that way. I know and have been to many people's houses who own pits and not a single one has EVER been violent. All of them come up and either want to play, lick you, have you scratch behind their ears, or a combination of the three.

reply to post by Krazysh0t


Yes they are dangerous ... that has nothing to do with being friendly.

Take 2 equally friendly dogs, one a pitbull and one a weinerdog. Both raised in the same house by same owner, etc. Both are "sweethearts" and all that...difference is no matter how much you provoke the wienerdog it can not kill you, it just does't have the physicality to do so. A pitbull does, the power of it jaws and over all strength is indisputable - and perfect for latching on, ripping, tearing and suffocating whatever it attacks. That is just a fact.

reply to post by RedParrotHead


So because a dog has strong jaw muscles and can do some real damage to people it is suddenly too dangerous to own and should be put down? You know despite the fact that pits are some of the most loyal and friendly breeds of dogs?

Sure they may require a little extra attention when they are puppies so they know not to use their jaws to play with people (usually not the case anyways), but they certainly aren't evil like the person I originally quoted said.