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Navalny verdict: LIVE UPDATES

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posted on Jul, 19 2013 @ 11:08 AM
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I am a supporter of Putin but i am also a realist. As boncho mention above, no man reaches the top clean , its impossible in the world of politics nowdays, where money, corruption, power and greed is. You have to be naive to think any leader of a big country is clean. But as things stand i would pick Putin over and over again , a man who started from the poor and reached the top , molded by the world of secret services and 90s collapse.He understands better than anyone else what best for Russia. Sure i do not agree on all of his actions but this is Russia we talking about , there is been corruption since Russia existed. But Navalni is and the rest 500 NGOs that operate on Russian soil is sponsored from the West to influence the public and distabize Russia combined with the powerfull wester media machine.




posted on Jul, 19 2013 @ 10:38 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
Do people really not know that Putin and his 'administration' are the biggest mobsters in Russia?

www.guardian.co.uk...

www.worldaffairsjournal.org...


Putin brought Russia back from abyss.

He could not have done it without heavy hand tactics. Russia has such implacable foes within and without.

We are not going to admire drunkards and sloths and denigrate hard workers and determined?

The opposition to Putin is not only political but also against Russian State.



posted on Jul, 20 2013 @ 12:17 AM
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reply to post by GargIndia
 


However, Putin did not do one thing most crucial to the revival of Russian society i.e. outlawed or toughed up the alcohol related regulations. In mid 80s, Gorbachov implemented such rules and Russian population growth exceeded that of several decades in the past. Vodka is a major drawback on the Russian culture and prospects.

Putin has somewhat rode on the energy prices which have filled the Russian treasury for now. No certain diversification has been sought or found for economy to thrive when energy prices are low.

Russia has more to fear from enemies within like defense minister involved in $100M scam. These people are looting and sending funds overseas.



posted on Jul, 20 2013 @ 07:34 AM
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reply to post by victor7
 


Russian industry is seeing a revival under Putin.

We can see that in quality if not quantity yet.

Russia had to catch up with the world. It takes time.

I can give you the following indicators:

1. Aircraft building industry saved from collapse and is now regaining its strength.
2. Automobile industry gradually shifting from imports to domestic models.
3. Defence production stabilized at a sustainable rate. Export status regained at #2 in the world.
4. Farm production stabilized along with farm inputs.
5. Constant investment in infrastructure like transport which is critical to Russia.
6. Significant increase in per capita income and living standards.
7. Russia is now #3 in software services export. Microelectronics has seen a revival.

There is no doubt that oil has played a very significant role. However Russia would have bled to death if it continued with leaders like Yeltsin.

If Russia continues on this path of pragmatism, I see a day when Ukraine would want to rejoin Russian Federation. And maybe other former USSR countries too.

Beware of the "West". Nothing to gain from following the West. I would rather like Russia to settle its dispute with Japan and work more on prosperity of Russia.

Alcoholism is a big problem. Russia should make vodka expensive by putting more taxes. All alcohol drinks should be made expensive.



posted on Jul, 20 2013 @ 11:50 AM
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reply to post by GargIndia
 


All the points that you have listed have direct relation to the energy and commodity prices. Three vices of the Russian society: Vodka, Corruption and Crime have not been solved even by 20%. Some say Russia is more corrupt now then anytime before. Out in out mafia crimes have been curbed but regular criminal behavior is still prominent in Russian mindset. These three vices give rise to another problem, that of Emigration. Common Russian would leave at the drop of a hat. Russia is still very Tsarist with few kings and millions of slaves. Other than copying or aping the west, there has been little change to the common Russian mindset.
edit on 20-7-2013 by victor7 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2013 @ 07:53 PM
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reply to post by victor7
 


Russia has gone through a lot of turmoil in its history which has disturbed the psyche of people.

However I am very positive about Russia. The people will change too slowly.

Russia will become a great power again.



posted on Jul, 21 2013 @ 12:49 AM
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reply to post by GargIndia
 


There is bigger threat growing to both Russia and Europe as a whole. That of Islamic immigration and hence Islamicisation of the Europe. Countries like France, Spain will have huge numbers of Islamic populations. In 20 years more than half of the Russian army will comprise of the Islamic soldiers.

While movement of peoples is a historical representation of the human race but accumulation of folks who's believes in high fervor go back to 500 years and their fanatic desires to implement and enforce such beliefs on other populations is a strong reason for concern. Islam is the fastest rising religion in US alone. I shudder in my boots at the prospect of US leaving Afghan in 2014. Talibian will be back and in two years all the efforts and funds thrown in by the West will prove to be useless.



posted on Jul, 21 2013 @ 03:09 AM
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reply to post by victor7
 


Muslim population growth is far outstripping other religions, so it is likely what you say.

I am afraid Christianity does not have a bright future as a religion. Most Christians have already become atheists.

Muslims have been able to keep their flock together. So they have better chance.

Russia's large land area, its natural resources and its educated people (along with military industries) have become relevant again as the world prepares for another major war. In fact Russia will get so many orders that it will have to tap the entire former USSR and beyond to fill the orders.

I see real industrial and economic growth in Russia for many years.

Do not believe Western propaganda. Russia does have a good future.



posted on Jul, 21 2013 @ 05:48 PM
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reply to post by GargIndia
 




www.dailymail.co.uk...

Muslim protesters clash with police in Paris



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 12:16 AM
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The problem with Mr Navalny is that criticism of the ruler alone cannot solve any country's problems.

What positive is offered by Mr Navalny except his anti-corruption drive?

A successful politician must take the military and scientific base into confidence. The India style anti-corruption crusades only result in inaction and inefficiency.

Mr Putin must continue to act against flight of capital but in measured steps. Russia stills needs technology from other countries.

The day Israel or USA strikes Iran, I see a queue in Moscow to buy Russian arms. The whole Muslim world, Africa and South America will scramble for Russian arms. Russia does not have capacity for the kind of orders that can flow in. So Russia will need supplies from overseas. These will come from China, France, even India.

Russia can get a lot of stuff from India's private industry. Russians have to broaden their horizon.



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 01:54 AM
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reply to post by GargIndia
 


If Russia had the balls then they would have given S-300s to Syria and Iran by now or even long time ago. While a nuclear Iran is not in Russia's best interest, but Syria well defended always bodes well for Moscow.

India has nothing to offer to Russians and Moscow knows it well. Indian army is an illprepared joke. Only thing in abundance in India is population and poverty.

If US wants it can attack Iran with F-22s at any time and time and again. Iranians would not know what is hitting them.

I do not see any war coming to the theaters near the global politics. No under Obama who is more of a pacifist than a provocateur. He has said openly that Iran will not be allowed to have nukes and from the revelations of Mr. Snowden, it seems US knows a lot more about Iranian nukes than it was thought before.



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 02:18 AM
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reply to post by victor7
 


Both of you need to read albert pike's WW3 predictions - obama, putin, and the rest of the "civilized world" are working to bring in the NWO - which will be godless communism to a war-weary world.

It's sickening when you realize what these supposedly "warring" factions of the world are working towards -



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 02:29 AM
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reply to post by victor7
 


It is not only S300 that Russia can sell.

Russia cannot act alone against the West. Your point is valid. However Russia can grow the balls if things start turning in its favor.

I did not say anything about Indian army. I said India's private industry. USA benefited heavily by tapping India's educated for its software development needs. The problem with Russia has always been a lack of vision.

India's industrial capability in private sector is quite good. The problems are in India's public sector which is highly politicized and inefficient. Russia has largely dealt with India's public sector. So your opinion does have some credibility. However Russia should try the private sector, specially large industrial groups.

Russia should try sourcing of sub-assemblies of aircrafts and vehicles from India's private sector. I am sure Russians will be surprised.



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 02:32 AM
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Originally posted by Happy1
reply to post by victor7
 


Both of you need to read albert pike's WW3 predictions - obama, putin, and the rest of the "civilized world" are working to bring in the NWO - which will be godless communism to a war-weary world.

It's sickening when you realize what these supposedly "warring" factions of the world are working towards -


Why do you think Albert Pike is right or telling you the truth?



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 04:05 AM
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Originally posted by victor7
reply to post by GargIndia
 


If Russia had the balls then they would have given S-300s to Syria and Iran by now or even long time ago. While a nuclear Iran is not in Russia's best interest, but Syria well defended always bodes well for Moscow.

India has nothing to offer to Russians and Moscow knows it well. Indian army is an illprepared joke. Only thing in abundance in India is population and poverty.

If US wants it can attack Iran with F-22s at any time and time and again. Iranians would not know what is hitting them.

I do not see any war coming to the theaters near the global politics. No under Obama who is more of a pacifist than a provocateur. He has said openly that Iran will not be allowed to have nukes and from the revelations of Mr. Snowden, it seems US knows a lot more about Iranian nukes than it was thought before.


India now exports 75 billion USD of software and services per year. India also exports automobile parts to the big three US auto companies. India is a bigger exporter of cars and bikes compared to Russia. Lest you forget, India's GDP is higher than Russia despite not having advantage of natural resources.

Russia has missed on India's potential by yielding to stereotypes. Russia needs to change.

Russia can follow the West blindly and West can suck its blood blindly. This may go on forever, or until Russia still has blood left. It is Russia's choice.



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 04:31 AM
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reply to post by GargIndia
 


It's all a shell game - a manipulation - they are all working on the same side.

Have you read albert pike and the satanist? he's not saying the "truth", just the game plan of the "lie".

It certainly seems to be falling into place.



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 04:58 AM
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reply to post by Happy1
 


It is not true.

Russia has been taken advantage of by NWO types.

Russia is a victim, not an accomplice.

Some Russians may be with the enemy but we cannot characterize the whole population as such.

The communist experiment was imposed on Russia - through agents of the British empire. It just did not work the way they hoped.

Russia is very lucky to survive the communist experiment.

The democracy is not very suited to the Russian temperament, which calls for strong leaders. Gorbachev failed despite his best intentions.

Russia works best under a King or a dictator.



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 08:19 AM
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reply to post by victor7
 


Victor, what should be done to Putin in your view?

Politics remains chaotic in Russia. Mafia and crime are a big problem. I just read a few reports which say that law enforcement and judiciary are top of the corruption pyramid.

Does Mr Navalny have enough political base to rule Russia?

As I said already, bringing down somebody is a solution only if a better alternative is offered.

Putin does seem to get things done. This is a change from a country which was almost written off by the world.



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 10:51 AM
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reply to post by GargIndia
 


There is no alternative to Putin, but he can be more tough in bringing people to line. One fine morning 500 worst criminals and corrupts taken to jail and keys thrown away. No questions asked and No answers given. Russians do not understand soft language and abuse it when talked in one.



posted on Jul, 22 2013 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by Happy1
reply to post by victor7
 


Both of you need to read albert pike's WW3 predictions - obama, putin, and the rest of the "civilized world" are working to bring in the NWO - which will be godless communism to a war-weary world.

It's sickening when you realize what these supposedly "warring" factions of the world are working towards -


Some sort of NWO based on more cohesion due to internet aided communication capabilities can be a possibility. Going back to godless communism is not happening at all. Everyone is entitled to make predictions. Taking them seriously is another thing.



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