Darwinism; What a Fake

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posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 03:49 AM
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reply to post by Phoenix267
 


Ok, 1. a lot of people here, just very overlooked this, I referred to a book, but seeing that people are caught by flashy things I better make my point some what clearer.

The Forbidden Secret

This is where I began to question what holding does evolution have in the world.

2. I didn't provide enough information purposefully. Like bait. Do you expect to throw every bit of information out there and overload people's minds or give them a little bit then go from there? I give a little bit.

3. Your standing is that your skeptic on how creationist are. But to be truthful, I do have a standing on that line between Evolutionist and Creationist. I just believe we JUST appeared more on the creationist side do to our complex build.

Exibit A: THE DNA STRAND. Then, saw what it really is, A Song

But when I read part of the book and some other books related to it, it shows how we came here in a different light.

and

4. There are 12 questions that we can starts with. But first, I'm not as much as debunking as much as exposing. Meaning, I'm more for truth. Those aren't, criticize.



1. What scientific laws support the theory of evolution?

2. How did life originate?

3. How did energy originate?

4. How did mass originate?

5. How did DNA information code originate?

6. How did the code to translate it originate?

7. MAN SINCE THE BEGINNING OF LIFE?: If man
evolved from earlier life forms, then why are human remains
consistently found in all ages of strata, even with the “first and
earliest” fossil life forms?

8. COMPLEX LIFE SINCE THE BEGINNING?: Why do
complex fossils appear in the “earliest” strata, with no evidence
of ancestors?


9. REQUIRED LINKS NOT FOUND: Why are there
persistent gaps between major types of organisms – with no
evidence of transition from one type to another?

10. STRATA RAPIDLY FORMED?: Why does a single fossil
commonly penetrate through multiple “ages” of strata?

11. UNCHANGED OVER THE AGES: Why are today’s basic
types unchanged from their first fossil ancestors?

12. EVOLVING OF INFORMATION: How does new
information evolve?

fossils and DNA kill evolution stone dead.
(a) DNA tells of evolution couldn’t even get started.
(b) Fossils tell that whatever we started with has not
evolved since then.



Alright, now the Big Bang Theory, it's false because do you expect a printing press to explode and give you a dictionary? I don't think so, same with the BBT.

I do believe in God, he is the mastermind behind creation. Never seen him, but I see his work all around me. That is enough to disprove evolution on a personal scale.
edit on 17-7-2013 by FreedomCommander because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 04:09 AM
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Originally posted by FreedomCommander
the Big Bang Theory, it's false because do you expect a printing press to explode and give you a dictionary?


Not only do you have no clue at all about the Laws of Thermodynamics, you have no clue at all about the Big Bang Theory!



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 04:25 AM
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reply to post by FreedomCommander
 


No problem! We can't make every post accurate. Respect is a two-way street. I browsed the ebook and then checked out his website. It's all very confusing and interesting, but I'm still skeptical. I think I saw something about aliens which caught my eyes.

I cannot answer every question from the 12 because I still need to refresh my understanding of evolution. I'm not a professional scientist! But I'll do my best!




How did life originate?


Evolution explains how life has changed. In science abiogenesis is the study of life's origins from organic compounds. While evolution is a solid theory in science; abiogenesis seems to be more of a hypotheses. Which is more of an educational guess and when evidence can be tested will become a theory in science. So you can see why science does have a lot of answers. It doesn't have every answer and there is a lot more to understand.

You're other questions are intriguing and confusing. However, I do believe I have answered similar questions before. Like the fossil record and transitional life forms. Months ago I started a thread about evolution with everything able to explain evolution, criticism, etc. So instead of posting a wall of text and links I'll just post my thread for you to read what you like. There are also videos about evolution too. Hopefully that will help you out.

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 04:37 AM
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reply to post by Phoenix267
 


I did see some of these. But the mysterious thing is that there is a back-up. A DNA back-up in everything, in which it reverts back to the normal stage.

Mutation: In a code sense, it's a setback in a copying procedure. But it always goes back to the normal DNA structure. You may focus on the Mutation of the now, but in the end, it always goes back. Page 71



All point mutations that have been studied on the molecular
level turn out to reduce the genetic information and not to
increase it. (Lee Spetner, Not by Chance. Brooklyn, NY.: The
Judaica Press Inc., 1997, p. 138)

Information cannot be built up by mutations that lose it. A
business can’t make money by losing a little at a time. (Ibid.,
p. 143. Emphasis added)


Humans, in the orthodox sense, were savages.

Humans, in a unorthodox sense, were highly civilized people. I always have a tendency to side with this.

Natural selection: Some how that doesn't fit, I mean a Dinosaur into a bird? A reptile into a fowl? Different chromosomes at work in that area. Basically, you can't add. Page 79

Those pages are referring to the link I gave. Thought provoking, yes. Worth it, definitely.
edit on 17-7-2013 by FreedomCommander because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 04:46 AM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

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posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 04:51 AM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

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posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 04:58 AM
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The true problem with evolution, is it is a direct reflection of a never beginning and never ending idea. No-one can fully comprehend such a big idea.


It is like putting the idea of God into a book.Or someone saying they understand what an omnipotent being would think or do..

Impossible and futile.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 05:11 AM
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We have seen evolution happen in as little time as 30 years, It does happen all the time.
I think that people just can't accept what we were before we became us...small minds can't accept the great time scales and the fact that we were not designed.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 05:38 AM
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reply to post by thedeadtruth
 


wow, seem like Australian atheist Philip Adams would be your role model.

He said the following.



any who believe in a Creator “have bats in their belfry”. They are “gullible”, “a growing multitude of dimwits”
in need of “psychiatric help,” and that it’s a “looney proposition.”



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 05:49 AM
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Originally posted by FreedomCommander
reply to post by thedeadtruth
 


wow, seem like Australian atheist Philip Adams would be your role model.

He said the following.



any who believe in a Creator “have bats in their belfry”. They are “gullible”, “a growing multitude of dimwits”
in need of “psychiatric help,” and that it’s a “looney proposition.”


Would you consider having Mr. Adams as a role model as a bad decision?
Okay, there were several questions, and many of them didn't have evolution as the topic. I think you should read some more books, preferably from scientists, I guess.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 05:54 AM
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reply to post by FreedomCommander
 


It seems the reason you're confused about evolution is because you have been listing to misinformation. No problem. It's understandable many people will be confused and at times against evolution for whatever reason. Look at the various post promoting pseudoscience.

A good example is Lee Spetner who is a Jewish creationist and even though a lot of creationist have quoted him he seems to promote pseudoscience that is not fair criticism and only offers confusion.
Lee Spetner
The website seems to like that Lee Spetner is a renowned physics. However, he is not knowledgeable when it comes to biology. Popular scientist Michio Kaku is a very intelligent person, but a lot of times he cranks out "woo!" ideas regardless if there is anything to support his claims. I understand it's difficult to express years of studies into one comment but there has to be a simpler to sow the seed.

I know mutations and natural selection play a role in evolution and there are other factors. Again I ask to look into my link for the information already posted.

To me I don't know if by nature humans are savages. Because we have evolved and changed a lot for generations. It's difficult to create a picture how our human ancestors lived in the past. I do think we're irrational by nature because a lot of people are gullible and what not.

I was reading your post and how you'd believe in God. I was thinking you could both accept evolution and believe in creation. There a lot of people who believe in theistic evolution.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 07:31 AM
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reply to post by FreedomCommander
 


The only lies in this thread are coming from you.

Evolution explains how life evolved from single cell organisms to the variety of life we see today. Evolution never once talks about how the universe began, or what sparked life to start in the first place.

your argument is flawed and based on things the theory of evolution never once speaks about.

If you want to try to disprove a verified scientific fact, maybe at least learn what the fact is first? Please?



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 07:44 AM
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reply to post by Phoenix267
 





I was reading your post and how you'd believe in God. I was thinking you could both accept evolution and believe in creation. There a lot of people who believe in theistic evolution.


I've never got my head around why people who believe in God wouldn't believe in evolution, even if we couldn't prove it, which we can, it just makes sense, how else would God ensure a biologically diverse planet?

This poster clearly has fallen for the BS being passed around by "intelligent design" believers. He's attacking things that have nothing to do with evolution. It's sad really, because they simply ignore the reality of the situation, ignore the things evolution does explain, so they attack things that have nothing to do with evolution.

the theory of evolution explains how, through random mutation and adaptation, life evolved into more and more complex organisms. That's it. It doesn't even try to explain why it started, or how. It has nothing to do with how the universe came into being, and has absolutely nothing to do with the big bang theory. This crap actually makes me mad, really mad, because people like that guy are the ones ensuring the next generation of americans are going to be idiots.

if you want to live in fantasy land find, do it, that's great, stop poisoning children with your religious mumbojumbo. If the human race is to survive, we need science, and if you stop teaching it, which many us states have, you've doomed us all.

But, even though some of the things the OP talked about aren't related to evolution, he's still wrong.

nothing from nothing? Well, in relation to the universe, that's the simplest way to put it, our weak little human brains can't actually comprehend another reality, we can't grasp the concept, so we can't begin to explain what came before. Nothing from nothing doesn't mean there was nothing, it means this reality wasn't there, there might have been another, we don't know.

what we do know is the universe wasn't always here. It's "expanding" as such as things millions of lightyears away are just getting light to us now, as it takes light time to travel those distances. It's expanding as the light reaches us, this doesn't mean it's still expanding, it could be a done deal at this point.

And life can't spring from non life?

Well, yes and no. We can't pinpoint the exactly "spark" that changed it, but we can get pretty damn close.

In the early universe, earths atmosphere was mostly hydrogen, oxygen didn't exist as the main atmosphere until life evolved and started spitting it out from plants.

An experiment that has been done as far back as the 60s or 70s, and repeated, shows you something amazing.

A closed system, a giant glass globe. the only things placed into it are the gasses and elements that would have been present on earth back then, the same stuff that you find in abundance all over the universe. Completely inert, no life to it at all. You mix that up in the closed system and apply current, and a few weaks later, what do you have? Basic amino acids. The building blocks of dna and life. something from nothing, no, life from no life? no, but again, evolution doesn't try to address how life started initially, only how it got to what we see here.

And next, OP will tell me, if we evolved from monkeys, why are there still monkeys? Again, because that's what he was told to think. We didn't evolve from monkeys, we share a common ancestor way back down the line.

The only fake in this thread is the OP and his spoon fed opinion, baseless and fact-less as it is.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 08:00 AM
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reply to post by FreedomCommander
 





1. What scientific laws support the theory of evolution?


All of biology. How's that for starters?



2. How did life originate?


We don't know, evolution doesn't approach this, as you'd know if you actually spent 2 minutes learning about it.



3. How did energy originate?


We don't know, evolution doesn't approach this, as you'd know if you actually spent 2 minutes learning about it.



4. How did mass originate?


We don't know, it has nothing to do with evolution, but if you want an explanation, mass originates as quantum particles move through the higgs field, a field permeating all of space, the resistance offered as things pass through this creates what we refer to as Mass. It is also believed that gravity functions in some way related to this field or the particles that create said field.



5. How did DNA information code originate?


Mutations of amino-acids. Did you even go to school?



6. How did the code to translate it originate?


Translate what? DNA into english? That question doesn't make any sense.




7. MAN SINCE THE BEGINNING OF LIFE?: If man evolved from earlier life forms, then why are human remains consistently found in all ages of strata, even with the “first and earliest” fossil life forms?


Easy, because you just made that the hell up, man isn't found with the first and earliest fossils, man is found to be a recent new comer to this planet, our ancestors go back a little further but we, as of yet, do not have the entire tree, we're missing a branch or two.



8. COMPLEX LIFE SINCE THE BEGINNING?: Why do complex fossils appear in the “earliest” strata, with no evidence of ancestors?


Again, just making stuff up works in religion, not in reality. Just because we can't find fossil records of ancestors of EVERYTHING doesn't give you the right to ignore the simple fossil records we do have.




9. REQUIRED LINKS NOT FOUND: Why are there persistent gaps between major types of organisms – with no evidence of transition from one type to another?


Stop lying. You are beyond being misinformed, you are just flat out lying now.



10. STRATA RAPIDLY FORMED?: Why does a single fossil commonly penetrate through multiple “ages” of strata?


Sorry, gonna need a source on that.



11. UNCHANGED OVER THE AGES: Why are today’s basic types unchanged from their first fossil ancestors?


Types of what, life? They aren't unchanged, they are entirely changed, as well, a lot of the fossils we have are those of the branches of evolution that didn't survive, that's kinda the whole point of evolution, there is a randomness to it, but it's also about adaptation, those whose mutations are beneficial mostly survive. It takes millions of years to see big changes in organisms due to evolution. A fact you'd know if you gave two craps about actually discussing this.



12. EVOLVING OF INFORMATION: How does new information evolve?


what information? Why do you continually throw out esoteric terms instead of being direct? What exactly are you referring to by "information" ?



fossils and DNA kill evolution stone dead.
(a) DNA tells of evolution couldn’t even get started.
(b) Fossils tell that whatever we started with has not evolved since then.


a) no, it doesn't, because evolution doesn't give a crap how it started, only how it changed into what we see now.
b) no, they certainly don't, they show various mutations and offshoots of organisms that evolved and changed over time

I could go on, but it's pretty clear what you are doing here. I really don't get it. If you want a hope in hell of disproving a fact, learn the fact first, then attack it. But you clearly aren't even talking out of your ass, you are just repeating the same crap over and over, dis-proven many times.

Now why don't you tell me how god designed the banana to be a perfect fit for the human hand. Please, tell me this, so I can show you photos of what a banana in nature looks like, and explain to you that, through selective breeding we've EVOLVED a new banana, and that's just over the amount of time we've been using agriculture. Not that long at all.

Granted, that type of evolution is driven, someone is actively making the choices instead of waiting for nature, adaptation, and random mutation, to take place.

Stop lying.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 08:07 AM
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reply to post by hellobruce
 





Not only do you have no clue at all about the Laws of Thermodynamics, you have no clue at all about the Big Bang Theory!


Don't make the same mistake I made, leave now and don't come back lest you feel your IQ dropping. The black hole of knowledge residing in this guys skull is actually sucking information out of my brain and compressing it into a quantum singularity. I feel ashamed to have even NEEDED to explain what I did.

I thought this was 2013.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 08:09 AM
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reply to post by phishyblankwaters
 


Let me guess, he combined Abiogenesis, Evolution and Big Bang Theory as one? seems like these used the Law of Thermodynamics, copied off a religious website?





posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 08:24 AM
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reply to post by FreedomCommander
 

I suppose your eagerness to testify for your faith does you some kind of credit.

The laws of thermodynamics are well known to anyone with the beginnings of a scientific education. You may be sure that every biologist knows them, just as do every physicist and chemist. If these laws were in contradiction to the theory of of evolution by natural selection, how is it that the overwhelming majority of scientists – not just biologists but physicists, chemists, mathematicians and everybody else – accept the theory? Are you saying scientists are too stupid to see something so obvious, when it is staring them in the face?

The theory of evolution does not contradict the laws of thermodynamics. I could explain to you why it does not – so could many other members here – but rather than tax you with difficult ideas, I ask you simply to consider whether so many scientists would accept a theory that is not thermodynamically sound. Do you think the vast majority of scientists are in a conspiracy to deceive the public?

As for the other two principles you mentioned, the first ('life comes from life') is not a law in the sense that gravity is a law. It is merely an observation. There is no reason why life should not emerge from non-life; there is no theoretical barrier to be leapt, no scientific facts that stand in the way. As for the second 'law', that of cause and effect, it is true in the macroscopic world we inhabit but does not hold true in quite the same way on the quantum-mechanical scale, where virtual particles are constantly emerging from (and returning to) nothing.

There are no scientific objections whatsoever to the theory of evolution. Neither are there any to the theory of cosmic origins, known as the Big Bang theory, which which you seem to have conflated it.

If you hope to debunk them, you will have to try much, much harder than this.

edit on 17/7/13 by Astyanax because: of an omission.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 08:29 AM
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reply to post by Astyanax
 





Are you saying scientists are too stupid to see something that obvious, when is staring them in the face?


What he, and those of his ilk, are saying, is that scientists are too stupid to understand it, and the rest are actively deceiving the world, for whatever purpose I couldn't fathom.

funny thing is......

A hell of a lot of evolutionary biologists and particle physicists believe in god.



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 08:36 AM
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reply to post by luciddream
 





Let me guess, he combined Abiogenesis, Evolution and Big Bang Theory as one?


Aha, I see you've played "lets make crap up and throw out some scientific terms for validity" before. Indeed. But he did a few steps better, he actually sat there and made stuff up, well, he quoted it from a book, but regardless, just made crap right up, out of thin air.

didn't you know? Man in his present form is apparently fossilized in every era we've ever discovered, right back to the very first amoebas. Every piece of life we have now, is fossilized, back to the dawn of the earth, exactly how it is, no changes at all.

I'd facepalm but I don't have enough faces, or hands, to do the facepalm this deserves any justice.

It's ok though, I've watched the same videos and lectures this guy has, I do so to make it easier to poo poo all over their idiocy, sadly, most watch to have their beliefs reinforced.

Humans are special, we are, we're the only life on earth aware of the fact that we're alive and on earth, we're the only life on earth actively trying to escape the grasp of this blue orb. We're the only life on this planet, and by extension, this solar system, actively searching for, and trying to make contact with, extraterrestrial life.

We don't need to pretend god made all of us this for us, and us, to be special. We're mightily special as is.

But if we ever want to get off this pale blue dot, if we ever want to unite us all as planet earth, the OP's line of thinking needs to be addressed. Far too long as religion been allowed to control our society. How many schools are teaching ID now? 1 is too many. How many textbook printers have started editing out science facts because of pressure from the coalition? 1 is too many.

I don't care if they come to terms with reality, I don't care if they'd rather believe a flying spaghetti monster farted out meatballs that became the planet, then grated Parmesan cheese ontop which created life.

I only care that those people are the ones who seem to have control over education.

edit on 17-7-2013 by phishyblankwaters because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 17 2013 @ 10:56 AM
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So far the score is...

Evolution 1

FreedomCommander 0





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