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Japan's Blunt Stance Riles China, S. Korea

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posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 08:15 PM
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Japan


www.defensenews.com

TOKYO — For the first time, Japan has criticized China over its military buildup in a move that has garnered swift reaction from regional powers and continued Tokyo’s march toward a more assertive posture.

Japan’s move, codified in a white paper released last week, also raises questions about Tokyo’s alliance with Washington amid tense relations with China, experts said.

Fast and furious was the regional response to last week’s document, in which Japan openly sounded the alarm about China’s military buildup and motives. Japan argues that by providing such a blunt assessment,
(visit the link for the full news article)


edit on Sun Jul 14 2013 by DontTreadOnMe because: source title




posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 08:15 PM
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It may just seem like good timing in their minds but is Japan changing their attitudes. I personally think Japan feels that they have a lot of support through the UN to pull off a stunt like this. This is just another way of someone stepping up to Chinas over-sized military. Its time to take car of their citizens and use some of that money to help the poor and sick.
If they keep it up they will be only a military state like North Korea with all other citizens starving of hunger and disease.

www.defensenews.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 08:20 PM
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reply to post by chisisiCoptos
 


So they should just give up the islands full of the resources they need, to countries that have no legal claim to them? And then go back to how things were just before World War II right?



posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 09:04 PM
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NM

edit on 14-7-2013 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 09:34 PM
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Originally posted by chisisiCoptos


It may just seem like good timing in their minds but is Japan changing their attitudes. I personally think Japan feels that they have a lot of support through the UN to pull off a stunt like this. This is just another way of someone stepping up to Chinas over-sized military. Its time to take car of their citizens and use some of that money to help the poor and sick.
If they keep it up they will be only a military state like North Korea with all other citizens starving of hunger and disease.

www.defensenews.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

you mean people like this?


US Homelessness at Record Highs
Glass houses are a horrible thing
edit on 14-7-2013 by munkey66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 09:40 PM
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Japan is right in its assessment.

Question is what it can do about it?

Japan's options are very limited.

I see it more like an internal consensus building exercise.

Japan needs to increase the size of its military and invest in equipment. However an increase would require resources that have to come from somewhere.

Japan has already utilized public savings for government expenditure.

All it has is foreign currency reserves mostly in the shape of US bonds. It will have to use that money.

Bad news for US bonds.



posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 10:20 PM
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Originally posted by GargIndia
Japan is right in its assessment.

Question is what it can do about it?

Japan's options are very limited.

I see it more like an internal consensus building exercise.

Japan needs to increase the size of its military and invest in equipment. However an increase would require resources that have to come from somewhere.

Japan has already utilized public savings for government expenditure.

All it has is foreign currency reserves mostly in the shape of US bonds. It will have to use that money.

Bad news for US bonds.

part of the agreement and surrender after WWII, Japan was only allowed a defence force and not allowed to have an attacking force, so the only building up they could do is for defence pourposes only



posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 10:23 PM
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reply to post by munkey66
 


They have slightly changed their constitution to allow their forces to be used in support of humanitarian missions (ie rebuilding Iraqi villages). There was talk of changing it more, to allow for offensive forces on a small scale.



posted on Jul, 14 2013 @ 11:58 PM
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reply to post by munkey66
 


A defensive force can still mean a lot.

A fighter aircraft can attack as well as defend. I think Japan needs more fighters (probably 2-3 times more) than it has now.

Japan also needs much greater anti-missile capability; as well as medium range ballistic missiles; if it needs to counter China.

It will need greater number of soldiers and increase equipment levels of army.

Japan may also need greater number of artillery units to defend shore installations.

If Japan wants to increase military power to that a "normal" nation requires, it will have to embark on a serious expansion of forces.



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 12:03 AM
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I think Japan travels a very dangerous road here. As the US is downsizing ..by planning or by willy nilly bad leadership, it's ability or even willingness to come to the full aid of Japan if they get themselves into it with China is in question, IMO and in ways it never has been before during my lifetime. We still have critical bases in Japan which commit us ..but to be 100% honest? After Benghazi? I simply don't know how far to believe Uncle Sam will go for commitments or obligations. Traditional or legal.
edit on 15-7-2013 by Wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 12:24 AM
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Will, article 5 seems to answer the question for us, sequestering is a big issue right now.
Lifting some of these limitations on japan would mean we can create a true Asian iron shield, one of not only defensive but offensive capabilities.
I think a military buildup by japan would be a instrumental, I am happy that at least somebody has seen what we all have seen but too damn scared to admit it that china is a huge threat for the region, there are sooooo many nations bundled up in that region is scary and with china only getting bigger and increasing its navy, its all too easy to see where this will lead up too.
If japan can pull this off, the other nations will follow its lead in this endeavor and remind china of its place and follow international law. All these little incursions that china has been doing to japan is really a test to see what it will do and by god japan is fed up with it.
I'm all for it. Rise of the red dragon? how about, Rise of the red sun.



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 05:01 AM
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Originally posted by Arnie123
Will, article 5 seems to answer the question for us, sequestering is a big issue right now.
Lifting some of these limitations on japan would mean we can create a true Asian iron shield, one of not only defensive but offensive capabilities.
I think a military buildup by japan would be a instrumental, I am happy that at least somebody has seen what we all have seen but too damn scared to admit it that china is a huge threat for the region, there are sooooo many nations bundled up in that region is scary and with china only getting bigger and increasing its navy, its all too easy to see where this will lead up too.
If japan can pull this off, the other nations will follow its lead in this endeavor and remind china of its place and follow international law. All these little incursions that china has been doing to japan is really a test to see what it will do and by god japan is fed up with it.
I'm all for it. Rise of the red dragon? how about, Rise of the red sun.


So, chinese are a threat because they are building up their militery?
USA has the most advanced militery in the world. Does that also make
them a threat?

China have got to where they are today without war. Why would
they ruin all that? The only way china will go to war, is if they are
pushed.



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 08:08 AM
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reply to post by Jay-morris
 


China is a threat because they are building up militarily and laying claim to anything they want to, and bullying their neighbors. They need the resources more than anyone, and are claiming places that they have no right to.



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 08:29 AM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I think Japan travels a very dangerous road here. As the US is downsizing ..by planning or by willy nilly bad leadership, it's ability or even willingness to come to the full aid of Japan if they get themselves into it with China is in question, IMO and in ways it never has been before during my lifetime. We still have critical bases in Japan which commit us ..but to be 100% honest? After Benghazi? I simply don't know how far to believe Uncle Sam will go for commitments or obligations. Traditional or legal.
edit on 15-7-2013 by Wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)


Even if the USA downsizes by half it could stilll take on China (at them moment) well as long as they stop meddling in middle easten affairs.



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 08:33 AM
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Originally posted by Zaphod58


China is a threat because they are building up militarily and laying claim to anything they want to, and bullying their neighbors.


Well thats seems no diffrent to the USA (and some of its allies).

We cant really condem China for building up a millitary when the USA has at them moment to crush every country on the earth.....well in theroy.....



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 09:33 AM
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Originally posted by crazyewok

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I think Japan travels a very dangerous road here. As the US is downsizing ..by planning or by willy nilly bad leadership, it's ability or even willingness to come to the full aid of Japan if they get themselves into it with China is in question, IMO and in ways it never has been before during my lifetime. We still have critical bases in Japan which commit us ..but to be 100% honest? After Benghazi? I simply don't know how far to believe Uncle Sam will go for commitments or obligations. Traditional or legal.
edit on 15-7-2013 by Wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)


Even if the USA downsizes by half it could stilll take on China (at them moment) well as long as they stop meddling in middle easten affairs.


Even if the USA downsizes by half it could stilll take on China (at them moment) well as long as they stop meddling in middle easten affairs.


Here, I couldn't disagree more. We can't "take" China head to head. They can't "take" us. They are a nation with almost the very same landmass as the United States (Surprising..but true as I looked up one day) with 400% the population we have in that very same living space. Their migrant worker force alone was estimated at 300 million people. That's the WHOLE U.S. Population ...as just their migrating labor element.

Now...If China comes across the Pacific? We'll send them home crying like a baby. If WE cross the Pacific and tangle with China on Chinese soil? We'll likely get our asses kicked hard. Of course ALL bets are off if nukes come into it and both nations have the full package and range of weapons in that area ....but no one wins and the whole planet loses if two world powers go nuclear in conflict.

All in all..I'd say China and the US ought to learn to respect and co-exist with one another. We're both far far too large to ever 'go away' or be put down. We're both far too proud a nation to just roll over (despite Obama right now) and so...We'll either find a way to get along ..or our nations will eventually be devastated by a war neither side will feel like they won in the end, no matter how it plays out, IMO.



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 09:40 AM
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reply to post by crazyewok
 


The problem here is China as pointed out has recently been trying to grab islands that it does not own citing dubious maps allegedly made many centuries ago. Does that even make sense if anyone can produce a map of the world, he already owns the world?



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 11:23 AM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000


Here, I couldn't disagree more. We can't "take" China head to head. They can't "take" us. They are a nation with almost the very same landmass as the United States (Surprising..but true as I looked up one day) with 400% the population we have in that very same living space. Their migrant worker force alone was estimated at 300 million people. That's the WHOLE U.S. Population ...as just their migrating labor element.

Now...If China comes across the Pacific? We'll send them home crying like a baby. If WE cross the Pacific and tangle with China on Chinese soil? We'll likely get our asses kicked hard. Of course ALL bets are off if nukes come into it and both nations have the full package and range of weapons in that area ....but no one wins and the whole planet loses if two world powers go nuclear in conflict.

All in all..I'd say China and the US ought to learn to respect and co-exist with one another. We're both far far too large to ever 'go away' or be put down. We're both far too proud a nation to just roll over (despite Obama right now) and so...We'll either find a way to get along ..or our nations will eventually be devastated by a war neither side will feel like they won in the end, no matter how it plays out, IMO.



My mistake I should have been clearer as it take them on I meant as in a pacific defence like situation you described. Invading the chinese or US mainland would be as you said out of the queation.
edit on 15-7-2013 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 11:25 AM
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Originally posted by marhaba
reply to post by crazyewok
 


The problem here is China as pointed out has recently been trying to grab islands that it does not own citing dubious maps allegedly made many centuries ago. Does that even make sense if anyone can produce a map of the world, he already owns the world?



I agree China is wrong on this. But we cant pretend almost every other country is not guilty of this too.
edit on 15-7-2013 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 15 2013 @ 11:28 AM
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reply to post by crazyewok
 


Ahh.. Yes.. My bad for misunderstanding your focus as much as anything else.


You're right about that, I'd say. China has the ability to field 3 or 4:1 against our national population as a whole ...but ...they do have a major shortcoming huh? They can't get it there and we can. So, you make a good point about Pacific conflicts. We can literally lift and ship our whole military around the world in a matter of weeks or months if the urgency was great enough. They don't have the physical means to do it.

Good point on that. Of course...If China has an Ace in the hole to negate our technology as our greatest advantage? We're in a bad spot, eh?



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