Why do you care about Martin or Zimmerman?

From the perspective of an outsider it perplexes me. There were 9000+ gun homicides in the USA last year and it wasn't an atypical year.

Why on earth does one matter more than the other 9000.

Americans shooting each other to death is not rare.

You can only conclude this is a manufactured frenzy for the purposes of ratings or political distraction.

The short answer is I don't care.

The long answer is I don't care because it is a distraction from things that really matter.

Humans kill each other all the time. It's sad, but life moves on.

I really dont care but i think most people are interested in this because TV tells them they should be. I dont own a TV.

reply to post by TKDRL


You know, that's a really good question.

This is a case of a hispanic man killing a black man. I'm white, why the hell should I care?

Thanks for putting that in perspective.

This case reinforces my resolve to never again visit the USA. We don't have the gun culture of the US in the UK (but we do have guns) and the very idea that one of my sons could be shot and killed when he himself was unarmed and carrying iced tea and skittles, after being followed by a stranger in his own neighbourhood - even if he had confronted that stranger physically - strikes fear into the core of my being.

The fact that so many in the US appear to believe that this is acceptable terrifies me. Enjoy your version of 'freedom' citizens of the US....maybe one day you'll get out of the trees and see the wood.

I had no dog in this race. But it served as a reminder how potent media manipulation can be. This case would of slid under the pile of thousands of similar ones but it didn't. MSM saw the story that a black boy was shot and the suspect had a european name, so they pounced on it. That in itself isn't surprising, it was when obama joined in that things went haywire.

Immediately the country split into two seperate camps of frothing cheerleaders. It quickly became a battle of black vs. white, with a sprinkling of gun rights thrown in. Though it turned out that george was in fact hispanic, you couldn't tell supporters otherwise. He was a white racist out for black blood and nothing was gonna change that in their minds. They also were misled by the portrayal of trayvon. They blasted pics of a young little boy with candy and iced tea soo much, the public took any other discription as a blatant racial stereotyping. People didn't want to know he was a drug dealing thug, or that he was planning to use those skittles and tea with codeine to make a drink called 'lean".

Once they saw the case was going the other way, the media then turned it's racial crap on the black side, delivering an image of blacks ready to riot like a pack of savages. This whole thing showed how stupid the general public is, and how close the MSM and government got to inciting a race war.

Originally posted by christina-66
This case reinforces my resolve to never again visit the USA. [color=gold] We don't have the gun culture of the US in the UK (but we do have guns) and the very idea that one of my sons could be shot and killed when he himself was unarmed and carrying iced tea and skittles, after being followed by a stranger in his own neighbourhood - even if he had confronted that stranger physically - strikes fear into the core of my being.

The fact that so many in the US appear to believe that this is acceptable terrifies me. Enjoy your version of 'freedom' citizens of the US....maybe one day you'll get out of the trees and see the wood.

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel
-Mark Twain

Yeah, you go ahead and hoist that Union Jack.
Wave it all around, and wrap yourself in it.


Mike

reply to post by mikegrouchy


Now tell me - HOW MANY WERE KILLED DURING THAT INCIDENT? You are comparing apples and pears.

The fact that we don't all habitually carry guns means that we DO protest without fear - and sometimes those protests become violent - but they don't turn into blood baths.

ETA - Declaring where I live is NOT patriotism. This event is just another reason (among many) for me never wanting to visit the States again. Have you ever been to Europe? My ex was a US citizen living here and he informed me that most of you guys would be furious if you ever visited BECAUSE THE LIES YOU HAVE BEEN FED ABOUT BEING THE ENVY OF THE WORLD WOULD BE EXPOSED TO YOU IN AN INSTANT.

All I care about is how people respond to the case because it was so heavily covered in the media. The media has a massive influence on the populous and their perceptions. They can take something which, in relation to the totality of the world, is the equivalent of a pebble and toss it into the pool of society where it could gain momentum enough to turn into a tsunami. That's the part I care about.

Easy, self defense. That's why i cared about this case.

I want to be able to defend myself without the fear of the state locking me up in a cage for 30 years because i thought my life was threatened.

if he was found guilty, it would've been a poke in the eye to everyone who cherishes their right to self defense. just imagine if you were being car jacked, or mugged and you wound up killing or severely injuring that person through no choice of your own. you were the target.... I just don't want to become the states target because some low life decided he would infringe on my right to life.

When did the criminals become the victims and the victims become the criminals?

backwards world.

Originally posted by ugie1028
Easy, self defense. That's why i cared about this case.

I want to be able to defend myself without the fear of the state locking me up in a cage for 30 years because i thought my life was threatened.

if he was found guilty, it would've been a poke in the eye to everyone who cherishes their right to self defense. just imagine if you were being car jacked, or mugged and you wound up killing or severely injuring that person through no choice of your own. you were the target.... I just don't want to become the states target because some low life decided he would infringe on my right to life.

When did the criminals become the victims and the victims become the criminals?

backwards world.

UGIE! Sup dude. Good to see you on here still. In agreement with you on this one.
This case was abolut self defense.
Not murder.
The way this case was splashed all over the media and twisted in facts and details. is the reason I dont watch the medias stories on this case.Im one of those people who hate seeing peoples lives play out on TV destroying peoples chances of ever getting a fair trial in the first place.

Thast said- Im still glad that the Jury was smart enough to see it for what it was.

It wasnt about racism, or gun violence.

It was about self defense and nobody ever had evidence to prove otherwise. thats why they lost.

I don't care .At all. This stuff goes on in every city in the USA ,and this needs to be a media crap storm for months.
Go look up the Howard beach trials from about thirty years ago. That was real . Not a,well mmmaayybbbe he was a racist .
Those guys got off too,except they were from Howard beach mafia families. If anyone had rioted ,John Gotti would have taken care of it ,personally . No one rioted. Surprise surprise .
This is media abuse . Fail

The case is totally based on a situational mess. I care about both. Martin, because he was a 17-year-old kid just trying to be himself in a subdivision with an overbearing neighborhood watch program... Really, this speaks to a lot of us, I think, as it should.

Zimmerman, because he was trying to be a cautious guy and when he got in a fight and used his gun in self-defense... he was probably following the law... but then his trial got out of proportion and whether or not he followed the law became irrelevant as the trial became a symbol of white vs. black even though Zimmerman is Hispanic -

As Zimmerman, I would have just given up at this point. Trying to make the right decisions, and realizing that what happened and the law wasn't even relevant.

----------

This case actually seems to have a lot of similarities to our current situation in America that are surprisingly not race-based... but more like the common man vs. overbearing Big Brother.

I don't care about either of them...to be honest.

I follow the circus to see how the justice system plays out and how it affects future cases.

Originally posted by TXRabbit
It doesn't directly affect me. I don't give a # about it

Your the coolest person ever

I hate to think about the answers to your question. I am presently trying to extricate myself from people at present and thinking about this brings back painful memories. One reason would be for most intent and purposes I am Martin. I grew up like him, I was considered a thug like him, I hung out with various gangs like him. I guess you could say I had a mis-spent youth. So I understand where he was coming from. I believe at that age I would have acted, that I have indeed acted, like he did.

Then there is Zimmerman. I, too, have had my head smashed into a concrete sidewalk. For me it happened until I was unconcious. I did not wake for an hour which was when friends poured water over me. I had zero wounds to the back of my head because I had hair. Zimmerman was bald which allowed wounds to occur. So I was outraged at the obvious lies put forth by the prosecution and the so called experts. I might not be alive today if friends had not pulled that man off of me.

I have been charged by police and prosecutors because a black man was attacked by a gang. He could recognize only me as I came to his aid to see if he needed an ambulance and he stated so. What was wanted was FOR SOMEONE TO PAY for a racial incident. It did not matter who or even if they were involved. For political reasons the politicians wanted just to hang someone. My witness at the trial was the victim. It greatly upset the police and politicians.

As I got older I fought for this country and the rule of LAW not of the mob. I saw a mob on July 4th, 1975 leave 8 bikers not moving on the main street of West Yellowstone. The mob was going after anyone whose hair reached their ears and the state police just stood there and watched. The problem had been caused by out of town bikers. The local bikers threw them out of town for their actions but the townsmen attacked ANYONE who might be a biker, even those bikers who had protected the town. Again the LAW was not followed in the Zimmerman case, just mob rule.

I and many of my friends were in the civil rights movement. We were fighting for equal rights for ALL, not special rights for some. What I saw in this trial was special rights for one group, usurping the law, and that was NOT what we fought for. What I saw with this trial, and many of my friends were feeling the same way, was beginning to turn me into a racist, making me ashamed of what I had fought for and espoused for so long.

Lastly a few years ago some things happened to my family. The police, to keep me from finding and protecting my daughter, threatened to kill me, when that did not work they filed BS charges against me and my wife. I and my wife fought back. We got a local TV station to do an investigation. They found out that I was telling the truth, that there were officers who backed my story, and they started to go on the air with it. They were shut down, the reporters were told to move, and a month later none of those involved were within 1k miles of here. The TV station scrubbed their records within one week. A politician called us and informed us supposedly where my daughter was being held by Los Zeta's in Mexico. I informed security I was going to Mexico in three days to get her back. On the third morning my daughter just happened to be on my door step. So I know how media, the police, and the law can be corrupted as well. By the way I and my wife were cleared of everything once the State and Feds got involved.

reply to post by Jerk_Idiot


Last night, as soon as I heard the verdict, I had multiple twitter tabs open to simply watch the various responses unfold. It didn't take long for the hashtag, "IfIEverSawZimmerman", to begin trending and tweets with Zimmerman's address and riot inciting comments such as beginning "the purge" to appear. Regardless of whether or not those who tweeted those particular sentiments would actually follow through, were just voicing their anger without intent to fulfill, or simply attempting to incite a riot, it doesn't matter because, in the end, what they were doing was acting as an angry mob armed with pitchforks and venom, even if only online but there is always the potentiality that some, fueled by the venom and hate of the mob, may take action and commit atrocities in defiance of the rule of law. Law has been an essential to the formation and preservation of civilization since 2050 BC when the Code of Ur-Nammu was written. When we chose to discard the rule of law, then that is the point in which we chose to lose all semblance of civilization and resort to irrational barbarianism. The mob can turn even the most well-meaning and gentle of citizens into hate-filled monsters such as the townfolk of West Yellowstone in your example.

reply to post by WhiteAlice

Originally posted by ugie1028
Tempers online are flaring. #IfIEverSeeZimmerman is trending on twitter.

Twitter trend of #IfISeeZimmerman

Reminds me of this...

I noticed the trends as well. Keyboard clicktavists think they're all big n bad.

reply to post by Jerk_Idiot


Wow, that was a very powerful post and I respect your sharing such personal experiences with us. I'm guessing you are black, correct me if I'm wrong. I was really hoping to hear from some of our black ATS members.

First, let me say I am so happy to hear you and your wife got your baby girl home safe and found some justice in the nightmare scenario you described, to deny the black community has dealt with police abuse and profiling would be to deny the facts. I completely understand why the black community is angry and has mistrust for the justice system.

I admire your work to fight for the rights of us all.......and as a white woman that has also experienced police brutality, I'm here to tell you it is not limited to black folks, although probably more prevalent until recent times.The jury heard the case, found him innocent and as I didn't watch the trial the facts seem to indicate this was self defense....Zimmerman got his punishment for perhaps engaging Martin in some way, but Martin jumped him......and the whole thing is tragic, Zimmerman has to live with this forever...and I hope Martin RIP.....very sad.

I am so pleased the majority of black Americans know what BS this is, and I see this as a "win" for all of us, cause we are all in this together, it is a group effort to demand justice......

reply to post by MountainLaurel


I am sorry to inform you I am white, not black. When I lived with my mother who was also white in Golden Gates on the South Side of Chicago next to Altgeld Gardens we were the only whites for miles around. I had not mentioned what color my skin was as it does not matter. Blacks are not the only race that grows up in slums or runs with gangs. It did however give me a different perspective then most whites have. I have been invited by the Latin Lords to go shooting wxxxxxs with them and agreed so long as we went shooting sxxxs afterwards Fair play so to speak. Vice Lords inducted me into their orgy club, I fought with and against all colors depending on their actions. I was never called a racist until I started hanging with whites and it was the whites who called me that. Of all those of any color I knew growing up maybe 10 of us lived to get out of there.