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I'm not sure which threads you are referring to, as I stay out of debates on homosexuality. If you can find me a single thread on homosexuality that I have commented on in all of ATS land, I'd be interested to see it.
Originally posted by Darth_Prime
The one thing i want to point out is the hypocrisy of people saying 'Don't throw your gay in my face' and you can be gay but 'keep it in your home'
well, why do Christians need to go around with signs? you can be Christian but do it in your own home, don't throw your religion in my face
see how that sounds?
it should never have resulted in violence, and i am not condoning that behavior, i just wanted to point out the hypocrisy
Originally posted by Rodinus
I'm not sure which threads you are referring to, as I stay out of debates on homosexuality. If you can find me a single thread on homosexuality that I have commented on in all of ATS land, I'd be interested to see it.
Are you not commenting on one now?
Kindest respects
Rodinus
Originally posted by DeadSeraph
Does that give me the right to assault you? No. Quit white washing the issue. Either you agree with the law or you do not. If you don't, fine. Subject yourself to the same standards. If you do, Quit making excuses for what is clearly a gross violation of the law (and a hate crime by all accounts).
Originally posted by Metallicus
I am not a Christian or gay, but I would be really happy if both of these groups would take their views elsewhere. However I do agree with the right of either group to free speech and to not be assaulted while exercising their rights.
Bottom line is if someone is annoying me with their pet agenda I have a right to ignore them, not assault them. Why can't people just agree to disagree?edit on 2013/7/12 by Metallicus because: eta
Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by DeadSeraph
If you don't understand how the two are not incompatible I'm not sure if can paraphrase it to make more sense to you.
I will try though...
I do not condone the violent actions at all. Zip. Zero. Zilch.
The sign holders should be more responsible for their own safety.
Originally posted by arpgme
Imagine, protesters being INSIDE the church, or WestBoro Baptist Church Prootesters being AT the funeral.
If this was West Boro Baptist Church, they will know that is harassment they would be forced to stay at a distance but when it's gay people, they are allowed to be followed around and harassed AT the event.
Now, they were at fault for physically attacking someone over an expression of opinion/belief, but the Christian preachers were at fault for harassing.
Originally posted by DeadSeraph
Originally posted by Rodinus
I'm not sure which threads you are referring to, as I stay out of debates on homosexuality. If you can find me a single thread on homosexuality that I have commented on in all of ATS land, I'd be interested to see it.
Are you not commenting on one now?
Kindest respects
Rodinus
This has nothing to do with homosexuality. It's an issue of civil liberties, which you will find I am quite vocal about.edit on 12-7-2013 by DeadSeraph because: (no reason given)edit on 12-7-2013 by DeadSeraph because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by markosity1973
Originally posted by Superhans
Just because the constitution does not say that it was a hate crime, it does not mean that that was not the intention of the christian group however.
Their intention was to express their opinion, when you attack someone because of their religion that is a hate crime just as if the christian man attacked the gay men for being gay. You are conflating law and morality.
Twisting my words much?
Of course it is the same in reverse. But we are now heading into one of those chicken and the egg arguments, i.e who started it.
So, let me make my view VERY clear so that it cannot be twisted any more.
If a Christian attacks a homosexual for being gay; It's a hate crime
If a homosexual attacks a Christian for being a Christian, it's still a hate crime
If a person who just happens to be Christian attacks a person who happens to be gay and steals their wallet, that is an assault and a theft.
Have I made my point clear yet?
Read the above, and see if you can spot your error. People should be responsible for their behavior, and not attack those that don't agree with them.
Someone dressed in a too-small speedo or some such, with a feather boa and a megaphone, now, would be different. I have seen pics, sadly for me, of some literally obscene outfits and behavior at "gay pride" events. Stuff you can't even link to. Stuff that makes that appallingly NOT Christian bunch, the WBC, look tame.
Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by LadyGreenEyes
Read the above, and see if you can spot your error. People should be responsible for their behavior, and not attack those that don't agree with them.
I don't spot an error in what I said. I spot an error in reading comprehension.
Not going to continue this dance over and over again ad nauseum. My feelings on the violence has been made clear enough. If talking about the responsibility of both sides is too much to handle in a discussion that's on you.
Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by LadyGreenEyes
Someone dressed in a too-small speedo or some such, with a feather boa and a megaphone, now, would be different. I have seen pics, sadly for me, of some literally obscene outfits and behavior at "gay pride" events. Stuff you can't even link to. Stuff that makes that appallingly NOT Christian bunch, the WBC, look tame.
Wait what?....
Obscene outfits make the WBC look tame?!?
Wow. Alright then. Apparently we see things differently.
"I don't approve of the attack, BUT..." isn't very convincing, and that's what you and others have done here. No one should be attacked for holding a sign in a public place, no matter what it says.
When behavior at a "gay pride" event is so bad that anyone else would be arrested for public indecency, exposure, etc, then yes, it makes the WBC idiots look tame.
Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by LadyGreenEyes
"I don't approve of the attack, BUT..." isn't very convincing, and that's what you and others have done here. No one should be attacked for holding a sign in a public place, no matter what it says.
There was never a BUT from me. Again, they are not mutually exclusive. I am NOT condoning the violence. It was wrong. I said stated many times. The fact that discussing the accountability of the "protester" somehow negates my position towards the violence is unfounded and silly.
However I do agree with some of the members here. Throwing a sign in someones face that says 'you're sinning and you're gonna burn for it' is a sure good way to start a fight. I would say all parties involved made wrong choices.
However, in the spirit of accountability one should know the risk involved in protesting in this "peaceful" way. If you bring a sign that essentially says "you should die" to an event you clearly have no business being at, a friendly response shouldn't be expected. That's what I meant by saying they all made wrong choices. That is not me condoning a "lynching".
The sign holders should be more responsible for their own safety.
So standing there with a sign is provocation now? And amounts to "pushing peoples buttons"?
Umm.....yeah. Duh. Potentially. This is situational. Depends on what's written on the sign and the people involved. Of course it can push buttons....
If I showed up to a sports game. A real big game. Went to the other side with the opposing fans and started blurting out how much their team sucked (or held a sign saying this) there is a good chance it could escalate and I could get smacked around.
Yes, we all should be careful, and take precautions, because it's a crazy, violent world. However, that doesn't excuse the attacks.
If a homosexual went to a park where some large group didn't agree with his choices, waving signs at them, and they attacked him, would you say he was partly to blame? That he should have been more responsible for his safety?