The Language of Vampyr

a reply to: boozo

right now they're taking a VAC.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
It's interesting that PKD explored the
occult and was plagued by apparently
ED critters. There is always a price to
pay to burn so bright.

Yep, know that one, they only burn for half as long. There are exceptions that prove that rule and given the magnitude of PKD's brightness, he did well to hold it together for as long as he did.

I personally wouldn't put down his insights to ED, trans-dimensional interference maybe, but that'd've worked both ways. If that'd been the case, that is.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
Now the people who claim free will
when it's convenient are still like
ants on a log flowing down a river;
what their actual opinion is about
'free will' doesn't much matter.

Free will is a largely theological argument arising from the counter reformation and particularly finding momentum with the Exercises of Ignatius Loyola. Certainly you do get so far along the path and you are confronted with elements of destiny, that sense of always having been here, even if was just as an idea, but I don't necessarily feel that that indicates determinism on the level that was taken up by the predestination movements reactively to Loyola. I was raised on the phrase, where there is a will there is a way, but agree that sometimes there is necessity in giving yourself over to the whole, or God, if you prefer that moniker. No will, no giving over, no discussion, no way.

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
Seems very similar to LCD or polarized light. I guess really what's the difference here? Very, very interesting.

If on a quantum level everything is already oscillating but once observed by the observer attaches itself to a solid state, how would one get it to oscillate. Meaning how would you remove the observence without removing the observer.

This is obviously thinking out loud. Not expecting a return.

But wouldn't the science behind LCD's be the same function you would create to walk through a wall?

What I proposed (vaguely) in terms of a Temporal Snicket Maker (TM) required not simply oscillation but excitation and was a complex process, one though that could feasibly be caused by naturally occuring conditions but most definately could be exacerbated or intensified by manufacturing those same conditions. You'd have to explain more, and in a way that I can understand, about LCD and polarized light for me to know whether the two processes were comparable.

It is my understanding that the observer is integral, no way of getting around that one.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear

originally posted by: LAkadian
Isn't it fitting that a project (FL) aimed at finding the perfect language, would inspire discussions
about the nature of reality?

It's right in the programming code. It's self referential.

The first languages were created to help us describe reality so we could share ideas.
Now those ideas have changed the very reality they were invented to describe.

The universe is digital, and the real wall is made of words.

Perhaps I'm wrong, as I've certainly not studied this thread in detail..
but aren't the FL folks trying to discover how to read and manipulate
the state that comes before spoken language?

But your point is valid.

Kev

If i remember correctly that is what Direne was first talking about. If you could transmit the thought before it was verbalised then potentially anybody could talk to anybody.
This I think, they think, would be the basis of a universal translator.
Based from this I think that would work pretty well for humanity as we have roughly the same frames of reference but a being from off world could have any sort of bizarre frames of reference (compared to us) so there are probably a lot of unforseen problems in this approach.
However I'd be surprised if there are not other groups trying this - neuroscience, parapsychology.......

If you want to communicate with beings from other worlds, dimensions then maybe you should try and communicating with the animals on this planet as a starter

There was a woman back in the 60's/70's who co lived with a dolphin in a flooded house for weeks(might have been months) in an attempt to 'nurture' it from a young age like a human being and teach it to talk/communicate.
They even made a documentary about it.

originally posted by: Anaana

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
Seems very similar to LCD or polarized light. I guess really what's the difference here? Very, very interesting.

If on a quantum level everything is already oscillating but once observed by the observer attaches itself to a solid state, how would one get it to oscillate. Meaning how would you remove the observence without removing the observer.

This is obviously thinking out loud. Not expecting a return.

But wouldn't the science behind LCD's be the same function you would create to walk through a wall?

What I proposed (vaguely) in terms of a Temporal Snicket Maker (TM) required not simply oscillation but excitation and was a complex process, one though that could feasibly be caused by naturally occuring conditions but most definately could be exacerbated or intensified by manufacturing those same conditions. You'd have to explain more, and in a way that I can understand, about LCD and polarized light for me to know whether the two processes were comparable.

It is my understanding that the observer is integral, no way of getting around that one.

Well I'm probably the least likely in this thread to effectively explain it but I did bring it up after all.

LCD's work by using two polarizing lenses at 90 degree angles opposite each other. Similar to a picket fence where light can shine through in between the spokes. Well here's a pic:



We can bend, refract light because it's a wave. So on a quantum level what if we treated the medium (the wall) as a wave.

Matter as wave:

We started our journey into quantum physics by studying the random behavior of matter in radioactive decay, and then asked how randomness could be linked to the basic laws of nature governing light. The probability interpretation of wave-particle duality was strange and hard to accept, but it provided such a link. It is now natural to ask whether the same explanation could be applied to matter. If the fundamental building block of light, the photon, is a particle as well as a wave, is it possible that the basic units of matter, such as electrons, are waves as well as particles?

lightandmatter.com...

a reply to: Anaana

I do like reading your responses.. please keep that in mind.
I find a certain value in them.

But as to 'free will'.

The thing that most people miss about 'free will' are these
facts:

1) Our brains are highly modular and have many proto
personalities in them -- in fact each neuron 'fights to be
heard'. 'We' don't even have 'free will' in our own brains..
our brains are a collective group creature in a manner
of speaking (do you see how I skipped the 2 word
Latin Phrase there?).

2) Therein is defined the problem with 'free will';
if EVERYTHING has 'free will', then functionally
NOTHING has free will. It's the very reason that
Christianity say, is logically null and void on it's
face.

Now 3) which is optional but more 'down to earth'
is this:

3) It would seem that 'free will' developed neurologically
in our brains, as a way to sort out conflicting social
conflicts, so that we can maximize our social status
as social animals. As social status is of maximum
importance for survival status in social creatures
such as us, THAT is what we use much of our
capacity for (such as arguing for 'social status'
on ATS, to release dopamine and reward ourselves
with the dopmaine reward loop in the brain).

Now of course some people don't have any social
status on ATS and are just wired to be confrontational
and stubborn, but that is another topic entirely.

This topic used to drive me crazy so I've put
decades into it.

Kev

a reply to: johnb

Well I know that what I'm about to mention might seem
'off topic', but I think personally it may be the entire
point of FL and other groups.

The 'sentient plasma creatures' or 'plasma symbiotes'
that I go on about, as the dominant life form of all
reality, is obviously not very good at communicating
with us.

It's just as prone to try and pants us, swirlie us, and
destroy our textbooks on the way to class.

'We' organic creatures, even if we are their 'gods'
ultimately (they evolved from us after all), aren't
respected, as we are considered the birthing
womb and not actually sentient as such.

So perhaps if we can learn to communicate, either
directly or via a machine (more likely) in a more
sentient manner with our 'dark plasma overlords
of the universe' (a Howard the Duck Reference),
then perhaps we humans can learn to live in
peace finally, with the 'big picture'.

Though I think it likely that the 'scum' (our political
and letter agency and other such types) want
to communicate with the truly sentient species
(the plasma ones) in our universe, in order
to solidify power not any noble goal at all.

Ok, I'll leave this post in the bottom of the
Rabbit Hole for now.

Kev

originally posted by: Rosinitiate

originally posted by: Anaana

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
Seems very similar to LCD or polarized light. I guess really what's the difference here? Very, very interesting.

If on a quantum level everything is already oscillating but once observed by the observer attaches itself to a solid state, how would one get it to oscillate. Meaning how would you remove the observence without removing the observer.

This is obviously thinking out loud. Not expecting a return.

But wouldn't the science behind LCD's be the same function you would create to walk through a wall?

What I proposed (vaguely) in terms of a Temporal Snicket Maker (TM) required not simply oscillation but excitation and was a complex process, one though that could feasibly be caused by naturally occuring conditions but most definately could be exacerbated or intensified by manufacturing those same conditions. You'd have to explain more, and in a way that I can understand, about LCD and polarized light for me to know whether the two processes were comparable.

It is my understanding that the observer is integral, no way of getting around that one.

Well I'm probably the least likely in this thread to effectively explain it but I did bring it up after all.

LCD's work by using two polarizing lenses at 90 degree angles opposite each other. Similar to a picket fence where light can shine through in between the spokes. Well here's a pic:

We can bend, refract light because it's a wave. So on a quantum level what if we treated the medium (the wall) as a wave.

Matter as wave:

We started our journey into quantum physics by studying the random behavior of matter in radioactive decay, and then asked how randomness could be linked to the basic laws of nature governing light. The probability interpretation of wave-particle duality was strange and hard to accept, but it provided such a link. It is now natural to ask whether the same explanation could be applied to matter. If the fundamental building block of light, the photon, is a particle as well as a wave, is it possible that the basic units of matter, such as electrons, are waves as well as particles?

lightandmatter.com...

Thanks Rosinitiate, I'm still not clear but that is sufficient information for me to find a way to explain it to myself in a way that I can understand...failing that, I know someone with the requisite patience to take me through it very, very slowly. I will report back in due course.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
The thing that most people miss about 'free will' are these
facts:

1) Our brains are highly modular and have many proto
personalities in them -- in fact each neuron 'fights to be
heard'. 'We' don't even have 'free will' in our own brains..
our brains are a collective group creature in a manner
of speaking (do you see how I skipped the 2 word
Latin Phrase there?).

You and I may have a different definition of what a "fact" is. While the brain is certainly a modular structure I disagree, from my own singular perspective, that there are "many proto-personalities" in the brain, although I accept that from your perspective that may be the case. I don't see it as an either or, merely as a choice in how you have resolved yourself within yourself, relational to how I have done the same.

"Free Will", as I explained, to me is a theological construct traced from the Exercises of Loyola. If you have read the Exercises you would perhaps have seen where I was going with that, the methodology developed by the Jesuits and put into application through their systems of education and subsequently emerging in the late 19th century as the fields of psychology and the neurosciences. It is a much older argument of course, Hippocrates' assertion that it is better to learn the means by which man can better themselves than to learn the laws which control men, is nascent to the emergence of the free will movements in Mediaeval Europe, but the manifestations of that, seen throughout France from the 12th century, moving on through Europe before being introduced to Loyola who, by his reckoning, created a means by which to initiate the realisation and giving over of free will. Now, those would be facts. More tenuously I assume the position that there is a fundamental difference between the spontaneous mysticism of Loyola and the subsequent one he taught. Not only that, but it erroneously assumes that to be an end position because it was for Loyola (again it is worth reading his works, as it is with all the mystics, to comprehend his intentions in relation to outcome).

a reply to: Anaana

Different opinions are interesting.

I suppose I should dig out my references on this, there are
numerous neurologists who have an opinion similar to mine.
I suppose this is one of those subjects that may never truly
be 'done deal'.

I do know from personal experience in dealing with mystical
people and other 'experiencers' that they can whip up a
'possession' or a 'overshadowing' in a second and create
multiple personalities just like that.

I've also had as friends 'multiples' as such people often
like to call themselves, and I gained a lot of interesting
information from those friends.

Now, most might say that 'multiples' are unique, but that's
the entire point of my POV; the neurologists who say that
we ALL have tendencies like 'multiples'.

But all this aside, brain discussions aside, this entire
Universe is a container that we have formed in.. and
it's filled with trillions of inputs per second that hit
each one of us.

If one wants to say that we have 'free will' - fine, but
we are just one 'vote' among a near infinite number..
so our EFFECTIVE free will approaches zero, while we
retain the ILLUSION of free will.

I suppose I will add your reference to my reading list.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I think you may have misunderstood your friends and references. Multiple Personality Disorder or rather, Dissociative Identity Disorder while belonging to a spectrum, does not emerge from a store of personalities waiting to be called up but rather from our ability to day-dream or zone out and create using our imaginations.

At one end of the spectrum, Normal Dissociation (daydreaming), and at the other extreme, Poly-fragmented DID, where there are identities in the 100s, representing each and every emotional, or emotionally reactive, state. The latter is extremely rare and associated with extreme, repeated trauma and abuse from conception. Between those two extremes, in descending order, DID, Non-specific Dissociation Disorders, PTSD and Dissociative Fugues (more sustained trance states, possibly including lost time). The common denominator in all cases is the ability to switch off from the immediate physical reality while retaining an unconscious and reactive presence in the conscious (physical) reality. It is not that we can simply pull a spare personality out of storage, but rather that we can create such functions in response to committing acts, or having acts committed upon us, against our will.

Sooo, again, I stipulate the importance of "will" but consider it unrelated to the notion of "free will".

The indications from FL with regards to their recent experiment seem to be along the lines that they were playing with their Queltron Machine , that's an earlier article but is along the lines of most recent "It was exciting to design an experimental analysis that enabled us to observe, directly and unambiguously, the asymmetrical nature of time"

Kaons and Time Reversability

You do not travel in time, you do travel in space-time, and this understanding is key for the working of the queltron machine

That Earth-3100 visitors to Earth-1964 could be detected, measured, and seen, simply means those visitors from the future belong to a specific type of systems: those systems in which the functioning of the queltron machine has been learned"

What the Queltron Machine is supposed to do is as ever engimatic from these snippets;

The Queltron Machine · Storage and Transfer of Consciousness - XViS Brain Function Modulation during induced NDE

The Queltron Machine · Blindsight Enhancement: The unconscious processing of visual information · Brain wave optimisation technologies

Overall these seem the concerns of the Giselian Realm, the transfer of consciousness through time and space, but they also seem interested in time travel involving hardware in the following snippet which presents a cartoon like sequennce of events relating to the Paintsville 2002 Ufo incident, were a Ufo chase from the year 2710 transfers to 2002 and the unfortunate Giselian probe chooses to hide on the rail tracks;

Consider the Paintsville UFO incident. The model explains how two Sol-3 crafts chasing a Giselian probe, in STO-2710, jump to Sol-3 STO-2002. Once the Giselian object jumps to STO-2002, it maneouvers to hide and avoid detection, landing on the train tracks. Local time is 2002 0114. Some seven minutes later, the two chasing Sol-3 crafts appear in the area, slow down, and start combing the nearby river searching for the Giselian craft. The second Sol-3 craft detects the presence of the Giselian object, hovering over the train tracks, and attempts a proximity operation, causing the Giselian object to speed up at low altitude along the tracks moving towards an incoming coal train from the opposite direction. The first Sol-3 craft quickly positions itself over the train to neutralize it and avoid a frontal collision with the Giselian object, which finally impacts against the coal train. Both Sol-3 crafts jump back to STO-2710."

There's a good account of the relevant incident here. so there we have it, place your advance orders for a Queltron Machine today...

originally posted by: Kantzveldt

"It was exciting to design an experimental analysis that enabled us to observe, directly and unambiguously, the asymmetrical nature of time"

Sorry to contradict, but actually, that quote doesn't refer to anything related to FL's experiment, it is from an article relating to reference materials for the second FL link in your post.

Here's the source of the quote: Live Science article

The quote is from Physicist Fernando Martinez-Vidal (University of Valencia, Spain) one of the collaborators on the 'BaBar Experiment' (read article for details).


Of course, the above info doesn't detract from the intriguing nature of the subject matter of the posts you linked, imo...

...I mean the sudden 'addition' of time travel to the capabilities of both the Giselians and humans from the year 3100.

The question I have - why would they bother adding in new 'elements' when they know that we are 'on to them' (so to speak), and ATS seems to be the only 'pool' they actively 'fish' in?

(Although, I suppose there are beginning to be other website forums delving into FL as a result of interest generated by ATS)

a reply to: lostgirl

Giselians and Humans 3100? That would make a good sci-fi movie. More questions than facts. Believing those would make you a lunatic.

a reply to: lostgirl

Are they delving into what they planted in the Curiosity Mars rover? Did they separate particles and left one on Mars? Hmm, this story sounds familiar. Be cautious....

a reply to: lostgirl

You're right it's a suggestive reference lifted from elsewhere in doing so of course you create further connections, the time travel factor isn't new though.

The overall context does suggest the question that Direne raised, if the Government was getting reports of aliens seemingly passing through walls and breaking the laws of space and time wouldn't they want someone to look into it...?

In such a scenario if research was undertaken by none Government group to avoid any potential embarrassment but handled through intelligence agencies then you could expect such a group to have access to whatever classified information the Government had on the paranormal and UFO cases, and they would be looking to understand what may have been behind certain incidents through hypothetical reconstructions, and then testing the feasibility of those, a licence to speculate.

a reply to: Kantzveldt

Ok im really interested in this now

google searched this from their latest posts

青ヶ島 31.918168, 139.869504 -

-18.836491, -170.513437

I put them both into google search and the first gave an island in japan
and the second the middle of the atlantic ocean , but also two of my own posts from youtube and google+
how can a longitude and latitude give a search result of my own youtube post ?


Ok thats really weird, apparently if you google this it will give the location plus your name
are they now harvesting user accounts for people who look for their map coordinates
if thats true then myself and my sister are on a list somewhere . WEIRD

a reply to: sapien82

It's only you. LOL

Ok I clicked on random post and it gave me a post from 31st dec 2012
I noticed this symbol the triskele and I noticed that odd looking langauge which Im not sure what it is .

Anyways so I know that the triskele was a pagan , neolithic symbol from the bronze / iron age
it has many meanings and it is not known what it represents to the people of this time.

It has many modern meanings .

Anyways the symbol is a pre indo european symbol

anyways the picts spoke a now dead language

"The Picts spoke an ancient language indigenous to area - a language that predated the Celtic languages of the Britons, the Scots and the Irish. This language did not have an Indo-European origin, but was instead a survival of the ancient language used by the Bronze Age people of the area."

Just wondering that maybe they are using one of those languages in this poem

and I know from previous posts in this thread that they are not fond of the indo europeans

a reply to: boozo

It happened to my sister as well though , I asked her to check it ?