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The Language of Vampyr

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posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 03:10 PM
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originally posted by: Annmouse
a reply to: The GUT


The software itself (basically) finds patterns in words and languages. The software can be used to analyze the whole internet, from social media to scientific papers. The software can also, given a certain set of instructions, deconstruct that information and present conclusions in an essay format.


nice, thanks annmouse, that is extremely helpful. in an earlier post i pointed out that fl's contributions here could function as a text-based thematic apperception test. maybe i wasn't so far off. the software described above has a favorite food, and it is essay-form writing.

ats in abundant with the food their nlp software likes best.

that's a little deeper than simulated annealing.

it would also explain why their content was shifted to be congruent with the subject matter posted about here. they're running the software off us, and steering the thread to manipulate variables. i don't have a problem with that per se, but the option of informed consent would make me feel a little less tender in the hindquarters.




posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 06:47 PM
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a reply to: ATODASO

Personally, I think they are talking to us in person and trying to communicate the data they have collected.

The various posts they have on their website, that are written in Forgotten Languages or New ones, are created by running the various articles they reference underneath their posts, through their software. The software then analyses that information and forms its own conclusions based on the information received and the results come out in a nicely written essay format. FL then run those results through another program to test various languages.

"Simulated annealing" is the process they use to evolve their languages.

The interesting thing is The Cassini Diskus.


edit on 10-6-2015 by Annmouse because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 07:50 PM
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a reply to: Annmouse

here's the thing, though, a lot of the articles that are supposedly used to kick out these conlang summaries (put online for general viewership, but decipherable only by those who have access to the software) aren't real as far as i can tell. they're not on google scholar, they're not on jstor. once again, we have to figure that a private group could have stayed that way by not putting the results of their beta testing out wholesale onto the internet.

in fact, to me it looks like the article titles are generated off content, and not the other way around.

why would they do that? and why would the content of those summaries change after first contact with ats to more closely coincide with the interests of this community? can similar changes in their content which coincide with participation on other forums be noticed?

we start to talk about this and direne throws an oopart bomb and vanishes. even discussing cassini in that context (although i enjoy doing so) just might be more grist for us to feed to their nlp mill.


edit on 10-6-2015 by ATODASO because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 08:56 PM
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a reply to: ATODASO

I agree...I feel stupid for not seeing it sooner...

I just scrolled through their archives and in 5 years before this thread was started, there were two maybe three (if I missed one) posts on UFO/aliens.

In the two years since the thread started, there are about 20 posts on the subject...

And I noticed a sort of 'regularity' in the timing of some of the other bits of 'ATS enticing' subject matter, which gives the impression of freshly baited hooks being dropped at intervals in hopes of a bite.



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 11:21 PM
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Hello,

Add me to the ranks of those who have been enticed to join ATS for the labyrinthine curiosity that is this thread.

I have spent the last week or so crawling through the last 140 odd pages developing my own thoughts on what this might all be about. When I have a little more time I want to go back through from the start an collate what seems to be the most pertinent information now that I have a feel for what is wheat and what is chaff. I'll report back once I have what, if is not the facts, is the most credible conjectures.

However, to kick things off I'd like to bring this to the table...

Running on a hunch, I used this site to extract the audio from here:

I then made a spectrogram using this piece of free software and this is what I got:



I tried a similar approach with some of their other audio (_Untold Incidents_ by XViS, mars supressed 156672C, MOV 0009, and Overcoming the Great Silence 1) but found nothing that remarkable.

Yeah, so I may be a little bit late to the party but I'm here as some fresh blood (so to speak). If there's any heat left in the embers of this bonfire I have some gasoline to pour on it.

Nice to meet y'all.



posted on Jun, 11 2015 @ 01:46 PM
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a reply to: ATODASO


I have been able to find many of the referenced articles on their website. Direne did say that they buy information from certain companies that the public are not privy too, so you won't be able to find those any where on the internet.

How I understand it-

Andryls first website was a language website where he/she translated many different types of books. Andryl has also co authored a book, (off the top of my head I think it was an Iranian to English translation book)

We also know they/he/she are interested in history, archaeology, etc etc.

So a bunch of linguists acquiring some language software is understandable, especially ones who have a passion in translating ancient texts and languages. I do not think they expected to find what they did when they deciphered 'The Cassini Diskus', or when they managed to (in their own words) "Crack" Magnus Sahlgren's "Word Space Model" or as we know it "Nodespace". (eg- Predicting the future and alien? messages) Or so the story seems to be unfolding.

Or you could be right and its all one big experiment. They have given us a date to look out for so we will see.

Hello HerbertAshe, I will be interested to hear what you come up with.
edit on 11-6-2015 by Annmouse because: (no reason given)

edit on 11-6-2015 by Annmouse because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2015 @ 04:40 PM
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a reply to: HerbertAshe

Very well done, I have been curious how long it might take to perform such analysis.

Almost looks like it curves, like a 3d object in a 2d image.



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 12:08 AM
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a reply to: Annmouse

What date was that? Was there a context? Sorry, I'm behind and my catch up is on limited time. Thank you.



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 04:59 AM
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originally posted by: HyphenSt1
Ultimately I'm saying that it seems like rhythm and harmony/melody are two sides of the same spectrum and perhaps knowing this could help people make more potent and meaningful music.


I agree, yes but I don't think that there is a shortage of people already capable of making "potent and meaningful music", what I believe that there is a shortage of is opportunity and investment in creativity, combined with either a low value given to emergent creativity in our society or an elitist overvaluing of their own outpourings of self-indulgent dross.


originally posted by: HyphenSt1
I know what you mean when you say

I think that there are better ways of communicating certain forms of information but not without first understanding the process, getting too formulaic and the message is lost I believe.
but the problem is the audience needing to be indoctrinated into that style of communication.. because that means that it's difficult to communicate a new foreign idea to the audience who hasn't already thought of it on some level.. I agree that especially with music and art, being formulaic will not improve the quality of the art or communication either.. but perhaps if the artist knows the language of his art inside-and-out, and knows when to use what (and how), then the audience's grasp of the message (and the medium) might increase exponentially like a feedback loop...


I am really torn on this one. My brain keeps doing back flips. For the symbology to be meaningful it has to be experienced subjectively, and I can envisage ways in which that could be integrated into educational systems, but, much like Hesse and The Glass Bead Game, I see the danger of sterility upon creativity. We have a Steiner School near where we live, as an option, I think that that should be considered, and taken, more seriously. There are all kinds of touchy areas in terms of profiling, streaming and personality testing to help guide children (and adults) into activities and professions that they are suited to that start to impinge upon fairness and equality. As much as we want our society's talents to be recognised and nurtured, we are equally cautious of entering into A Brave New World whereby we are pigeon holed for life.

The other difficulty is symbology as a living language as well as an archaic one. Meanings evolve over time. How relevant is it to understand that evolution in terms of understanding it's current context?


originally posted by: HyphenSt1
perhaps this knowledge is what gave the potency to certain sacred music and hymns which have lasted 1000+ years..? and also why the music of most modern musicians lasts... BARELY 100 years tops..?


Most music is throwaway much like anything else in Western culture, I would argue that some will persist but only if it has a greater relevance beyond a base objective to entertain and make money. Sacred music and hymns, and epic poetry arose from a verbal tradition, problems arise when written language standardises those forms. As soon as that happens it dies. Stuck in time unable to evolve and retain it's relevance. So, in those terms, sacred music and hymns are like trying to stick a vinyl LP into a USB port. You have to go back in time, before it was written down, to even begin to imagine what effect that music or those words had on their intended audience. Then, as today, I should imagine it was just as much about creating the right atmosphere and utilising music and lighting to synchronise the emotions of the audience. And even better, dance. That combo, that's where the power is, get that right and you can pretty much tell 'em anything you want to and they'll agree (see the Nuremberg Rallies).


originally posted by: HyphenSt1
as for the K(!!!) sound, i too have been fascinated by the inclusion of percussive sounds in supposedly "primitive languages". I think that beat-boxing is a good way to try to expand your command of mouth-sounds, but again, there's no meaning in those sounds (besides providing a background for rap or other beatboxers..)

think it's crazy how "primitive people" have a much more expanded and descriptive/imaginative command of language than we English-speakers.. meaning has been lost from our language it seems, and we don't even know what our own names mean anymore.. perhaps this fact alone will eventually be what wakes a lot of people up and stop taking language for granted.


This is one of the major kick up the arse lessons that we in the West have had to learn. The amount of environmental (botanical and medical particularly) knowledge that has been lost as a consequence of our treatment, over the centuries, of indigenous cultures. I am not a huge believer in the notion of evil, I believe that the majority of modern history has actually just been driven by gross stupidity on the part of in-bred white upper class twits.



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 05:49 AM
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a reply to: Anaana

The major problem lies in consuming rather than participating, the very idea that there should ever be an audience or commercial product. In traditional society the year was broken down into a sequence of religious festivals which led one into the other and in which everyone was expected to participate, whether in terms of singing or dancing or helping with costume and decor and food provisions, the all important framework being very well organized religion.

Problems only arise when people feel they are not being included, that their viewpoint is not being listened to and their input appreciated, which leads to an elite doing their own vacuous thing and the rest doing their best to ignore it, that doesn't just hold for religion the progressive Left are also notorious for meaningless so called inclusivity festivals.

It's not the quality that counts it's the quantity...




posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 06:03 AM
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a reply to: Kantzveldt

I think that you have misunderstood the conversation, it was about artistic expression and understanding, not religious practice. I realise that high art and spirituality are often entwined but that is quite different to the expression of ritual for social and economic functions such as you raise, both are of course important but the former is frequently at the expense or worse, in servitude, to the latter.

Can art exist without an audience?



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 06:28 AM
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a reply to: Anaana

All artistic expression and understanding comes from that which you bind yourself to, the definition of religion, a love song is only ever a dedication to the spiritual principle however that is personified. art and spirituality aren't often intertwined but always, whatever the particular spiritual quality, and requires only a participant.

You could even take that further, if one considers that ATS is worth participating in and contributing toward then to whatever extent you have bound yourself to the principle it is a form of religious practise according to the literal definition and requires some belief in the forum and media and of course the people involved, the participants, a combination of theatre and drama, shared literary, visual and musical experience, though such association products such as Twitter and Facebook can be considered new religions.


edit on Kam630162vAmerica/ChicagoFriday1230 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 06:43 AM
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a reply to: Anaana

22 letter alphabet.root of most written languages today.
22 letter

why does the English language have 26 letters..either the FL group existed a very long time ago
or there are some unnecessary inclusions into the language.

language is a very important part in the construct of human consciousness and social programming.if some group feels that one language for the world is a bad thing .then maybe they should give us an alternative means of global communication preferably Telepathy..its possible that the N400 component is a trigger--component in such a complex system of communication.



Communication is also speed-bounded. The N400 is key: The N400 is a component of time-locked EEG signals known as event-related potentials (ERP). It is a negative-going deflection that peaks around 400 milliseconds post-stimulus onset, although it can extend from 250-500 ms, and is typically maximal over centro-parietal electrode sites. The N400 is part of the normal brain response to words and other meaningful (or potentially meaningful) stimuli, including visual and auditory words, sign language signs, pictures, faces, environmental sounds, and smells Also: There is still much debate as to exactly what kind of neural and comprehension processes the N400 indexes. Some researchers believe that the underlying processes reflected in the N400 occur after a stimulus has been recognized.

i think human beings were engineered to become telepathic.

language is KEY to understanding Causality of events in the reality matrix..i think.

Communication is also speed-bounded.

maybe there is a way to communicate without creating paradoxes and ambiguity across different races and tongues..

telepathy would definitely allow two people from diff cultures using diff languages to agree what a certain sequence of audio-visual data represents (objectsubject)...in fact it would allow the blind the deaf to communicate with 'normal' human being on the same level of fidelity--ease.
edit on 12-6-2015 by fr33coll3ct1v3 because: (no reason given)

edit on 12-6-2015 by fr33coll3ct1v3 because: for fun



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 06:49 AM
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I realise there is a lot of knicker twisting going on here, not to mention the foot stomping, hair pulling and temper tantrums. It is all, if nothing else, entertaining even if I don't quite understand it. One thing that has repeatedly cross my mind however is how insular the US are, many of you don't even seem to bring other nations perspectives into the equation. I find that really strange, but as I noticed that it made me aware of how I do it myself. I pretty much blame the boys and girls at Vauxhall for anything that smells a little bit fishy. That in itself speaks of complacency.

If there is evil there must be good. I can think of lots of reasons that FL do what they do, good and bad, but mostly somewhere in the gray areas in between. I do not have an issue with privacy and consider them entitled to theirs, expecting, in return, the same courtesy. We are talking about them, seems perfectly natural for them to hold a mirror back at us and excellent manners to actually come and meet us here, on our terms. I don't have a vast interest in their site, their music or their art. Not my cup of tea. I have no idea what they're doing, I have no idea what most people do I just take them at face value and on that scale I enjoyed having Direne around. I hope that they know that they are as welcome as anyone else is.

On another note, back to blaming our own governments for all the sins of the world (rightly so, but...), if we accept that those governments are corrupt or even evil, where is the good?

I can think of any number of ways in which FL could be used for nefarious purposes but I found it just as easy to find good things that they could be involved in. Also, how many of us, if we developed something truly brilliant wouldn't want that brilliance to be appreciated and valued? How many young developers etc have effectively sold out out of shear ignorance of being exploited or pressure to just take the highest offer?

There has got to be people however that do stay true to themselves and the ideals that they set out with, or who share what they learned from their mistakes or those who know that people need to be protected from their governments actions. People like Lance Cotterell who established the Kosovo Privacy Project and EFF.



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 07:10 AM
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a reply to: fr33coll3ct1v3

I have been considering telepathy myself a lot just recently due to a change in perspective, that wee paradigm shift that I mentioned a page or so back. I haven't fully settled into that yet but I don't think I'd use the term engineering or anything that it implies. I believe that it is an inherent ability but not one that is fully understood in the modern Western context to the extent that we aren't even aware of it perhaps.

I was thinking about the context that Paul applies to such abilities in 1 Corinthians, Chapter 12, verses 12-31, that there is a system made up of sets of abilities and skills that are mutually supportive of each other, that ALL are required and that as such it is the individual nurtured in relation to the whole that is significant, not the individual as the be-all-and-end-all. The "magic" occurs in the spaces between the individuals generated through interaction in awareness of the whole.


12 Just as a body, though one, has many parts, but all its many parts form one body, so it is with Christ. 13 For we were all baptized by[a] one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. 14 Even so the body is not made up of one part but of many.

15 Now if the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. 16 And if the ear should say, “Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18 But in fact God has placed the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19 If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many parts, but one body.

21 The eye cannot say to the hand, “I don’t need you!” And the head cannot say to the feet, “I don’t need you!” 22 On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, 24 while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has put the body together, giving greater honor to the parts that lacked it, 25 so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. 26 If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.

27 Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. 28 And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30 Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret? 31 Now eagerly desire the greater gifts.


www.biblegateway.com...:12-31



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 08:23 AM
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originally posted by: Kantzveldt
a reply to: Anaana

All artistic expression and understanding comes from that which you bind yourself to, the definition of religion, a love song is only ever a dedication to the spiritual principle however that is personified. art and spirituality aren't often intertwined but always, whatever the particular spiritual quality, and requires only a participant.

You could even take that further, if one considers that ATS is worth participating in and contributing toward then to whatever extent you have bound yourself to the principle it is a form of religious practise according to the literal definition and requires some belief in the forum and media and of course the people involved, the participants, a combination of theatre and drama, shared literary, visual and musical experience, though such association products such as Twitter and Facebook can be considered new religions.


By those definers then money and power are legitimate religions, as is, by extension, consumerism.

I do not categorise social interactions as a religious experience, or an act of worship, let alone in a belief in any supernatural being. I do not take anything that I read on line, or in person, on faith. My trust, like my respect, is earned but I have gained, from experience, a better ability to make judgements. You can tell a lot about people simply by watching and listening, sharing information, developing a learned impression, no faith required if you actually just pay attention to what people are and are not telling you, not abusing that trust. People are interesting, or not, that is being human, not being religious.

In my experience the people that I have met who are religious are not necessarily spiritual, many artists that I have met have been incredibly spiritual but feel oppressed by the morality of the church. I have also met a great many that are both religious and spiritual, but very seldom are they also capable of high art and for good reason...from their perspective.



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 10:20 AM
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a reply to: Anaana

Yes some bind themselves to such things in a religious sense which makes the point that not all forms of religious behaviour are good, but we will always engage in some form , your humanist perspective is one way of going about this but a somewhat limited one.

I think you make the mistake of assuming all spiritual qualities to be positive, many of them are dull and stupid, i've never observed one person to be more spiritual than the next, of course as it is widely recognized that being gentle and humble are positive spiritual qualities then some choose to be the very parody of this.

Artists aren't incredibly spiritual, not one of them, it's more the case that certain spirits lend themselves to creativity, a prevailing wind that can also blow over, of course creativity dislikes confinement and artists the moral.


edit on Kam630162vAmerica/ChicagoFriday1230 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 02:34 PM
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a reply to: The GUT

FL has predicted that there will be a "high level event" in the middle east on August 5th, which is when the countdown on their site goes to...

The post where Direne explains that it is top of page 114...

In another post later on (I don't know which page) I think she says it will be something nuclear (can't remember precisely).



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 09:55 PM
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a reply to: ATODASO



...for someone repping a group mining the ancient aliens vein for all its worth, you don't seem to think much of it.


'Perty much, right?

And shilling for the whole alien abduction thingy?

tetra50 had it right: they (by which I mean direne as the front of some group) are trying to preach to a choir that has outpaced them.

This is getting deeply silly.



edit on 12-6-2015 by Bybyots because: just so goddamned silly



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 02:08 PM
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a reply to: lostgirl

And finally, here at the bottom of the page:




lostgirl:

“I agree...I feel stupid for not seeing it sooner...

I just scrolled through their archives and in 5 years before this thread was started, there were two maybe three (if I missed one) posts on UFO/aliens.

In the two years since the thread started, there are about 20 posts on the subject...”


So, you can imagine my mild frustration, right lostgirl? Being as it is that I pointed that out to you very carefully, in a post just for you, that I put up a little more than a year ago, 42 pages in the past.




Me:

1

So to sum up: Yes, I do think that FL is being silly when they post that type of garbage. Also, yes, I think that they have one fan: This tiny group at ATS; this thread is more “famous” (or infamous) on the web than the website that it is based on. Finally, no, you are wrong, those are bad citations that lead to worse citations and no sign of the original author, Lester R. Brown.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

2

Maybe these posts ('papers') at FL look the way they do because they are supposed to because they are based on models that have been generated based on interactions between FL and ATS.

www.abovetopsecret.com...



And all that after this request from you:




lostgirl:

“...So, I for one, would appreciate it if you would desist all the nay-saying and stop treating us all as if we are a bunch of gullible, conspiracy 'mongering' yahoos!”



I’ve been accused of worse by you, as well. And who’s “us all”? You got a mouse in your pocket? Maybe mice?

I guess what I am really asking for is an apology, seeing as I have never “derailed” this thread or any other, as you have suggested, and in fact would have saved you a year had you been paying attention.

And now let’s hear from Mr. Ashe.




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