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America's dawn

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posted on Jul, 12 2013 @ 09:57 PM
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Originally posted by EternalSolace
So long as there is Xbox, Playstation, Nintendo, Internet, Movie Theaters, 60" Televisions, Cable TV, Satellite TV, iPads, iPhones, computers, Netflix, DVD players, and the likes of which take attention away from what's going on in the world, there will never be a revolution of the kind the United States had in 1775. As long as all this type of entertainment is in place, there will never be a revolution of the kind that is taking place in Egypt and Syria today.



Well don't forget other dumb stuff like a job, paying a mortgage, portfolios ect.




posted on Jul, 12 2013 @ 10:04 PM
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Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by EternalSolace
So long as there is Xbox, Playstation, Nintendo, Internet, Movie Theaters, 60" Televisions, Cable TV, Satellite TV, iPads, iPhones, computers, Netflix, DVD players, and the likes of which take attention away from what's going on in the world, there will never be a revolution of the kind the United States had in 1775. As long as all this type of entertainment is in place, there will never be a revolution of the kind that is taking place in Egypt and Syria today.



Well don't forget other dumb stuff like a job, paying a mortgage, portfolios ect.


Meh! You can work a job, pay a mortgage, play Xbox and go to a baseball game and still have enough mental fortitude left to understand what freedom means and demand that public servants uphold their oath under God to the Constitution of the United States.

It's not like TV makes people stupid or apathetic. Indifference does and some people properly medicated by the shallow pleasures that are afforded within our society rob people of their desire to care when it does not affect them directly. This fact unfortunately is predominant in America but at the rate that the federal government is directly attacking the middle class and small business owner, I suspect, that could change in the near future.

Honestly, in my best effort, I wouldn't ask anyone to do anything other than just inform themselves on the general state of affairs in the country. I think once any person did that, the evidence and facts speak to themselves. I feel strange arguing things that are already common knowledge and on record as fact, it's as if nobody wan't to point out the emperor has no clothes!



posted on Jul, 12 2013 @ 10:29 PM
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Originally posted by ipsedixit
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People complain about the dangers of the erosion of the 2nd Amendment right of Americans to bear arms but are for the most part unaware of the almost complete erasure of the 1st Amendment right to free speech as reflected by the virtually complete subversion and control of the mainstream press in America.



Generally a good post but I need to comment on this section.

Freedom of speech in this country, under the constitution, has much more to do with the right of the people to redress the government without retaliation, or meet in public, to assemble on their own outside of congress, form organizations ect than it does with the free press. The "press" may be subverted but one can still go down to the printer and have pamphlets or flyers printed by the thousands. When this sort of thing is attacked by the government using various means then you know we have a real serious constitutional problem. Right now the subversion of the "press" is a problem of commercialization and being owned by interests that have one point of view or another. Joe Blow cant do anything about that as these are really commercial and private interests free to "print" what they like. Granted we probably pay to much attention but its certainly not all bad. We have a good deal of solid political commentary available 24/7 on the TV and the airwaves.

This recent IRS pressure on small political groups is the sort of thing that represents a real undermining of freedom of speech and creating venues to speak, organized redress, assembly ect. That's the real measure.

And the 2nd amendment defenders are generally a lot more astute constitutionally than the bigots would portray them and many more are at least getting that way.



posted on Jul, 12 2013 @ 11:45 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 


I feel the same way, and maybe Obama's narcissism could work to our advantage. He is so desperate to be liked, that I thought if he felt he was definitely going down as the worst president ever, he may just try to redeem himself by being the president that actually gave us back the Constitution. So I started this petition.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 12:13 AM
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Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by ipsedixit
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People complain about the dangers of the erosion of the 2nd Amendment right of Americans to bear arms but are for the most part unaware of the almost complete erasure of the 1st Amendment right to free speech as reflected by the virtually complete subversion and control of the mainstream press in America.



Generally a good post but I need to comment on this section.

Freedom of speech in this country, under the constitution, has much more to do with the right of the people to redress the government without retaliation, or meet in public, to assemble on their own outside of congress, form organizations ect than it does with the free press. The "press" may be subverted but one can still go down to the printer and have pamphlets or flyers printed by the thousands. When this sort of thing is attacked by the government using various means then you know we have a real serious constitutional problem. Right now the subversion of the "press" is a problem of commercialization and being owned by interests that have one point of view or another. Joe Blow cant do anything about that as these are really commercial and private interests free to "print" what they like. Granted we probably pay to much attention but its certainly not all bad. We have a good deal of solid political commentary available 24/7 on the TV and the airwaves.

This recent IRS pressure on small political groups is the sort of thing that represents a real undermining of freedom of speech and creating venues to speak, organized redress, assembly ect. That's the real measure.

And the 2nd amendment defenders are generally a lot more astute constitutionally than the bigots would portray them and many more are at least getting that way.





Uh, Hate to break it to ya but the attacks on pamphlet printing and zines began Years ago. Feds harassed, put publishers of press (zines, etc) on terrorist lists or spy files, busted down Several printing shops, harassed and even jailed several zine and Book publishers, harassed small grass roots independent media outlets, etc. in Several key cities, sent moles to spy and break up printing Groups or have them harassed on other petty things, such as a Bike Shop, in one area I know of. Several small printing presses were forced out, arrests when the zines were handed out, etc., forced out by buy outs to silence radical voices (radical in that they were of no party affiliation and were strictly For the people or issue they represented) and then year or two later the original paper or zines were not even recognize able. I know of Several independent homeless/poor people's activism and printing, or anti war efforts that were shut down this way. One homeless paper was an independent collective of poets, artists, writers who had a press/shop donated (time share type thing) so they could get their story out and heard etc as well as raise money to assist in job training, etc., it was hijacked, harassed and taken over to Silence Political Dissent. That's just one example,

Several independent media folks were harassed, jailed, censored. This has been going on for quite some time...maybe no one pays much attention because these were grass roots groups, with little power. If any...but what Truths they had to say we're deemed a "threat" ...so much for freedom of the press. Which really is Ironic in that Now that these programs are more widespread and targeting the Mainstream NOW people are upset,

But hey, they were doing this YEARS ago, spying, false arrests, even some "mysterious" murders here and there. Beleive me when I say, what you see now is simply an Escalation of policies of authoritarianism theyve been practicing on the marginalized for Years and they've mastered the craft quite well.

They Know how the Populus will react, and how, how to pacify, how to divide, and how to rid of. they didnt call it Friendly Fascism for nothing...



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 02:50 AM
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reply to post by Helious
 


I understand where youre coming from. Up until recently I was defending the same ideas. Until i started noticing the anti-government rhetoric surfacing in almost every country for the past two years. Its always the same sentences: we have a semi-tyrant leader, our rights are being taken away, we must fight, must resist, etc etc. then I started questioning the whole thing. As if in my own state of fury over what governments have been doing over the years, i became a part of a movement thats calling on breaking down of the system, masked by the pursuit of justice.

And it irked me. It irked me bad.

Because this is the kind of sheeple behaviour ive been against all my life.

Then i noticed something. None of the countries who have had revolutions in the middle east are doing well. Infavt, the breaking down of their system has left their countries in a state of bigger confusion, sectarian violence, misinformation from the media and last but not least, chaos.

This all started with Iraq mind you. Iraq is and always has been a melting pot that refuses to 'melt'. Meaning, Saddam knew that bringing order to sectarianism meant scaring them into getting along with each other. Once Saddam was down, they had nothing to fear, and this gave way to freedom to do with each other whatever they pleased. Notice i use the words ' freedom to hate'? And i see the very thing happening here in the US.

Your anger, your disbelief is a weakness that can be easily used to have you get up, ask for a revolution, then once youve got one, burden you with the chaos thats left. And at that point, even if the devil himself came and promised stability to you, youd buy into it.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 03:22 AM
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reply to post by Logarock
 



reply to post by Helious
 



With respect, don't take my post out of context.

My point is that there was nothing to distract the colonists from current events. Political happenings were the only thing there was to focus on outside of their work; Just like in Egypt and Syria. The public doesn't generally have the luxuries that we have in the States. Therefore with less distraction, like in 1775, attention turns to outside world.

If I have my facts correctly, only 58% of eligible voters turned out for the 2012 presidential election. In 2008, it was 62%. In 2004, it was 61%. In 2000, it was 55%. If my assertion that the general public is distracted is incorrect, why is there a poor turnout for voting? Granted, if you average the numbers from all the elections it averages out to around 55% since the records started. However, you'd think in this day and age with readily available information, the voting turnout would be higher than ever.

Like I said, today's world and political corruption is working as a type of sensory overload. Instead of facing the overwhelming facts that Americans are slowly losing their freedoms, and the constitution is being whittled away bit by bit, they ignore it and hide in their living rooms.

Helious, you're correct that it's indifference that is the problem. However, it's my assertion that mass entertainment facilitates that indifference.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 10:04 AM
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reply to post by EternalSolace
 


I disagree, I believe poor education/lower intelligence and personal priorities are more to blame than "entertainment". If someone chooses to watch dancing with an idiot and not read the voting record of their elected representatives, (and then proceed to vote for/against or not vote at all without any information) that is someone making a choice based on priorities on what is important to them. To blame the show they watch is like blaming a bullet for giving you an owie.

You can't make people care, period. But blaming entertainment is shuffling off the responsibility from where it belongs, squarely on the shoulders of full grown adults who should know better but don't because they are stupid and/or ignorant.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 11:03 AM
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reply to post by Carreau
 


What keeps people uninformed? What is blocking people from becoming informed? Simple fact is that it's easier to turn on the television than to study voting records or keep up with current events.. I'm not saying the movies and television are wrong. I'm saying that entertainment is a major distraction. I'm saying that if entertainment weren't such a big part of our society, more people would be inclined to become informed.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 11:10 AM
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reply to post by nusnus
 


I am glad that there are some who are aware of this.

The "problem," imo, lies much deeper than just a changing of the guards. History should make this abundantly clear, but it doesnt for various reasons.

If you want to do propaganda properly, you just need to have a predictable "positive" (believer) response and a predictable "negative" (anti-X) response. Then you control the mass majority of people who do no personal exploration, but allow others to do all the research for them. Organize society itself, through education, to encourage this response so that the source of "truth" is anywhere other than the individual themselves. Base a society on controlling the power of the people, and the people themselves will do all the work for you!

I still believe that it isnt the actual government systems, technology, science, entertainment, etc that we have in place, but how we collectively use them. As long as you can program that selective use to always result in control and conflict, then.. mission accomplished.

What do you think would happen if instead of basing it on controlling individuals, it was based on enabling them?
edit on 13-7-2013 by Serdgiam because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 11:13 AM
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reply to post by EternalSolace
 


Look you are playing semantics here or just refusing to acknowledge what I already posted.

You are blaming the choice instead of the person. Why is entertainment so popular? Because people CHOOSE it over substance. Booze, drugs, religion, stuff animals, video games, porn, I don't care WHAT people pick to occupy their time with, it still is the blame, fault, responsibility of the individual and not what they use to kill time with.

There are people if you take away every channel on TV except CSPAN, they will still refuse to learn and will instead stare at the wall and pick their nose.

So for the last time it is not HBO, ESPN, Transformers, or American idiot.....idol, the reason 50% or more don't vote or vote dumb is because they don't care regardless of what they have or don't have for entertainment. It doesn't matter to them and there's nothing anyone can do about it.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 11:44 AM
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reply to post by EternalSolace
 



My point is that there was nothing to distract the colonists from current events. Political happenings were the only thing there was to focus on outside of their work; Just like in Egypt and Syria. The public doesn't generally have the luxuries that we have in the States. Therefore with less distraction, like in 1775, attention turns to outside world.


In the beginning .....



The Adamant Patriot: Benjamin Franklin Bache (grandson of Benjamin Franklin) as Leader of the Opposition Press

Having started a newspaper in 1790 that covered a wide variety of subjects, he increasingly devoted that newspaper to politics. Bache condemned the Federalists who were in power in the 1790s, especially denouncing the first two presidents, George Washington and John Adams, for their Federalist policies.


Long story short ... www.libraries.psu.edu...


on 27 June 1798, the Aurora (Bache's newspaper) reported, “The Editor of the Aurora was yesterday arrested… on the charge of libeling the President & the Executive Government, in a manner tending to excite sedition and opposition to the laws, by sundry publication and re-publications.”(37)

Bache had been arrested before the Sedition Act even made it through the legal process, thus showing just how much the legislation was meant to target him even more so than other opposition press. On 29 June 1798, Bache was released on $4000 bail with a trial scheduled for October.


You'd need to read the whole article for context but silencing speech is much older than the colonies, especially if the writer/speaker detracts from the status quo and the agenda.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 11:52 AM
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reply to post by Carreau
 



I don't care WHAT people pick to occupy their time with, it still is the blame, fault, responsibility of the individual and not what they use to kill time with.


The responsibility and blame rests on the shoulders of the department of education, which sterilizes history and numbs minds rather than opening them.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 12:09 PM
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reply to post by frazzle
 


I will refer you to the first line in my first post in this thread.

I disagree, I believe poor education/lower intelligence and personal priorities are more to blame than "entertainment".



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 12:25 PM
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reply to post by Carreau
 


You can blame ignorance and the person, but only if the individual is aware of what is happening and still chooses to ignore what's going on. How many people today know what the three branches of the government is? How many know how legislation is passed or how an amendment to the constitution works? How many people know off hand who their state representatives are? Entertainment has been established as a substitute for aquiring knowledge. It is a substitute to keep voters ignorent of the world around them. And it's working flawlessly.

I'm not saying that anyone who enjoys entertainment is wrong for doing so. But you can't blame individuals who don't know, what they don't know.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 12:28 PM
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Topics like these are all well and good but I see no reason to support any type of "revolution" because the truth is that people refuse to read, refuse to grow up, refuse to look at the fundamental reasons why history repeats itself over and over.

Until people refuse to create governments that control people with violence history will continue to repeat itself over and over. The revolutionaries call for rebellion yet fight against those that after their rebellion is successful do the same, like when George Washington squashed the whiskey rebels for doing exactly what he did in the revolutionary war.

A world full of hypocrites who yell for change yet never think about what that really entails. Change is a fundamental acceptance that a group of people have no right to be violent in the name of the greater good. Why should I give my life up for something that even if successful almost guarantees it will just happen again?

So you get rid of the federal reserve, the U.S. government...people would still support the existence of another government that would eventually grow into the monster all over again. Repetition of illogical thinking that results in history repeating itself. Why give my life up for a useless cause? Why slay a monster only to have a nest of monster eggs already ready hatch?

It is the day that people refuse to accept government, and stand on their own two feet in the name of true freedom that change will occur. That will take a huge change in the way children are raised up until the day they die. It won't even necessarily require the use of violence, but rather the non-acceptance of this masquerade known as the social contract and patriotism. Things that the individual didn't choose yet are somehow evil for abandoning.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 12:29 PM
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reply to post by EternalSolace
 





But you can't blame individuals who don't know, what they don't know.


YOU just made my point and didn't know it. The people you are referring to do know what they don't know. If you ask them if their State has representatives they will say yes, then ask them to name the politicians and they can't. THAT'S knowing what you don't know.

Now you find me a window licker who doesn't know we have elected officials and then I'll buy your argument, but stupid people KNOW what they don't know and they still don't care.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 12:42 PM
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reply to post by LadyofGlass
 



It is the day that people refuse to accept government, and stand on their own two feet in the name of true freedom that change will occur.


Exactly. Sometimes there is no alternative but to walk away mentally and spiritually, even if it can't be entirely done physically. I get a kick out of that "stand your ground" law, it definitely needs more refining and defining.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 12:50 PM
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reply to post by LadyofGlass
 


I actually think its all a very interesting topic.

History shows us exactly how it will all go if we continue to choose the same social paradigm. Systems of power will just be replaced by people who will, at least in due time, perpetrate exactly the same actions that they felt validated their "coup."

It would point to the idea that the creations of humans are not the issue. Perhaps we the humans are the ones who need to change and the rest will follow suit. Not many have any desire to do that, so we are likely to continue down the exact same path with random spots of so-called "revolution."

I think it will change when culture eventually clashes with a certain degree of technology. That, or we will just destroy ourselves. One or the other.



posted on Jul, 13 2013 @ 12:51 PM
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reply to post by Carreau
 



The people you are referring to do know what they don't know.


Let me rework that sentence a little: they don't CARE what they don't know. Its no fun knowing things ~ "give me the remote, honey, I want to watch reruns of Hogan's Heroes."



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