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Snowden confirms NSA created Stuxnet with Israeli aid

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posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:11 PM
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Originally posted by citizenx1

Originally posted by seabag

I for one could care less about...


"Couldn't" - you "couldn't" care less.

Saying you "could" care less indicates you care about it and that is clearly not your intent.

We gave you a language, kindly use it.


No need for personal attacks, professor. This isn't a grammar course.

Resorting to petty grammar corrections is a sure sign your argument is failing.


Try to stay on topic.




posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:14 PM
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reply to post by citizenx1
 



Until the current nuclear nations relinquish their weapons then Iran has every right to arm itself.

There are winners and losers in life. US is at the top of the food chain. European nations are at the top of the food chain. We don’t take orders to disarm from any country, especially a country that hasn’t even left the stone ages.




To act against that is an act of war and the aggressors will get no sympathy from me if they suffer consequences for their actions.

Well that’s too bad, huh?



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:32 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by citizenx1
 


By that logic, the fact the Nuclear Club cannot un-invent what most would love to un-invent means all 200+ nations on Earth have equal rights to demand the same Nuclear warheads be a part of their inventory right?


Absolutely. What's good for the Goose is good for the Gander.


We ought to just throw out all ideas of non-proliferation or not seeing these spread until they eventually get into hands eager to use them?


No, just lead by example not by dictating to other nations.


Personally, I've never bought the idea Iran is making warheads anyway. They most certainly DO have a Military nuclear research complex. It's called Parchin and the Iranians actually use the fact it IS a military nuclear facility to argue against inspections, since the agreements only allow for civilian facility inspections. What are they making with nuclear technology under Military efforts? Well.... I've always figured EMP/Neutron or even propulsion tech in an entirely new direction from everyone else. They are a budding space power with solid accomplishments in that area, after all.

Stuxnet was just kicking a hornets nest, IMO


I'm fairly undecided as to whether they are or are not but I'd be more than happy for them to have them. It is probably about time there was a rebalancing in global power dynamics. The west has had it their way for too long and look what's happened.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:35 PM
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Originally posted by seabag
reply to post by citizenx1
 



Until the current nuclear nations relinquish their weapons then Iran has every right to arm itself.

There are winners and losers in life. US is at the top of the food chain. European nations are at the top of the food chain. We don’t take orders to disarm from any country, especially a country that hasn’t even left the stone ages.


Not for much longer - in every sense the US is entering a period of massive decline whilst countries of the east are going to become the predominant economic and military force.

It is only hubris which prevents some from seeing this.




To act against that is an act of war and the aggressors will get no sympathy from me if they suffer consequences for their actions.

Well that’s too bad, huh?


Wonder if that will be the prevailing view if countries like Iran take up arms against their aggressors.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:37 PM
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Originally posted by seabag

Originally posted by citizenx1

Originally posted by seabag

I for one could care less about...


"Couldn't" - you "couldn't" care less.

Saying you "could" care less indicates you care about it and that is clearly not your intent.

We gave you a language, kindly use it.


No need for personal attacks, professor. This isn't a grammar course.

Resorting to petty grammar corrections is a sure sign your argument is failing.


Try to stay on topic.



There was no personal attack. Highlighting that your point of view wasn't clearly articulated was a simple observation.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:43 PM
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Illegal sanction and embargo alone is an act of war for itself, stuxnet Trojan is simply just a child play, everyone knew that it was works of israhellis and NSA in the first place.

Give us something new Mr snowden please.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:43 PM
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reply to post by citizenx1
 


Your disregard and complete lack of concern for the spread of nuclear weapons through the world's leaders, both large and small is something I find disturbing to an extreme.

The US is the only nation to have used them in anger. That is also the first and only time in the records of Human History that a weapon of great power HAS NOT been used by others, since. Every weapon, without exception in history, gets used at some point. However horrible or however brutal. They all get used.

Spreading more OF them simply increases the number of people we need to hope have level heads and systems of check/balance to prevent one madman from killing millions of people in a nano-second.

There really ARE some things that don't need to be spread to every corner of the planet and the "fair play" logic is basically a suicide pact in the way you present it. We have them (and wish we didn't) so everyone else MUST have the same right ...however horrible a mistake the world has realized the invention has become.

hell.... We have VX Gas Warheads at Umatilla Oregon too, the last I knew inventory stuff there. Just a glass of the that in the right form would kill everyone across a major metropolitan city, anywhere on Earth. Using your logic, it shouldn't matter that we're destroying the garbage as quick as possible and is safe. We DID make it so others MUST have the right to it as well....right?

Is there any limit, anywhere at all for your "one has it, so ALL get to have it"? Anything at all which is too terrible in purpose and impact to apply that logic to? Scary... very disturbing indeed.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:45 PM
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Did anyone really doubt the US and Israel were behind the Stuxnet virus?

I thought it was pretty obvious even before Snowdens revelations.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:46 PM
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Originally posted by Senduko
reply to post by seabag
 


This is getting ridiculous, really please tell me, how can you stand and trust the years of information provided by YOUR corrupt government as truth?


I know right, it really is hard to understand when you see all the people blindly following and believing everything Snowden says.


At this point he could walk up to someone and shoot them because he claims they were an NSA agent and people here would turn a blind eye. That is pretty par for the course on ATS.
Govt presents info then its wrong or horrible or evil or makes them Illuminati.
Some guy does the exact same thing, presents info, and he is a hero.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by Senduko
 

Well, not that this is in any way new information to those of us who have followed the development and deployment of this vile piece of software, it is nice to hear about it from the horses mouth.

I remember back in March 2011, when it was first let slip that stuxnet had reaked havoc on the control systems of Fukushima dahini following the tsunami, and had contributed to the cascading colling system failures, people continued to deny its existence. The fifty never stood a chance. Many scientists and engineers were pointing to its presence as proof a premeditated attack on the people of Japan. That and the presence of Tritium in the subduction zone supported much of what later became just conspiracy theory. To the masses, the scientists who were piecing this mess together might as well have been saying the "Witchcraft", as the general puplic seemed content to think that nuclear reactions are only as dangerous as their initial blast.

Now here we are, going on three years. Most of those who complained are either dead or discredited, while we live in a highly irradiated atmosphere that is conveniently contributing to the massive depopulation of planet. In the days of tree mile island, common sense among any American and most of civilized world at that time would have dictated that an open nuclear reactor was a paramount concern to the longevity of mankind. With Fukushima, all it took was a simple word from the president to " not worry about it", and we all gave way to our ignorance. Already cavalier cold war acceptable exposure rates were raised around the world, and NWO compliant and complacent nations like Canada and Australia simply banned the practice of testing radioactivy in standing water reservoirs and milk supplies. Conservatively, over 15000 pre mature still born babies were the product of this mess in the USA alone, never mind the current estimates of 15 plus million people who have died globally as a result of this mess. That makes the act of using said virus the single most vile killing tool in the arsenal of "civilized nations". Good work. I hope the seven figure salaries these trolls gets is worth the eternity in hell they have created fro themselves.

Say what you will about the Russians, at least in the days of Chernobyl, efforts were made to stop the "fire". They recognized the importance of restoring clean air to humanity, and paid the ultimate price in sacrificing 10000 of thier finest soldiers, pilots, medical staff and engineers. Today, by comparison, Fukushima a now released over 150 million gallons of very nasty sump water into the pacific ocean. Out of sight, out of mind, unless you live in the sea of course.

This is the generation of destroy destroy destroy, lie lie lie, and never a thought to building and prosperity.

Shame on you NSA, this is no video game. May you will step from you computer screens and reap the rewards of your vilainry.

AX
FTNWO



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:50 PM
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reply to post by opethPA
 



I know right, it really is hard to understand when you see all the people blindly following and believing everything Snowden says.


Agreed here... I think actually laughed out loud at the thread suggesting Snowden blew the lid off the UFO issue.

Somehow...I totally missed where an outside contractor or even new CIA Employee as he was before being an NSA contractor...would even have access to data of that level of secrecy? People aren't even applying the logic test to some of this, as if men in Snowden's position just get handed the keys to the kingdom and all the secrets it holds because they can work a network administration screen.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 01:53 PM
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Originally posted by seabag " a measured response to Iran's refusal to be forthright."


yet we see no response at all, measured or not, to israel's consistent refusal to be forthright. hypocrisy in action.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 02:00 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


Thats kinda what I tried to hint out in this thread; the level of clearance this guy supposedly had. I mean what are the chances working at/with the spying agency and yet no one got wind of the mails he send to family members/press.

I'm sure what he says is true. but i find it hard to believe his a whistle-blower. In fact come to think of it, if this facility has only half of what he claims, this would be a massive good test to see how the system handles " uprising " sort of speak. I mean these past few days they would have a massive burst of information etc.

reply to post by RoScoLaz
 


Ah yes that's ATS right there, sad truth really is that most Americans love the fact that their government is doing this. IF news would have spread out that the USA was spying on its neighboring countries no one would have cared. Because mighty Americans rule the world. You know America is earth and the sun spins around it.

Most Americans want to feel superior, just not when they find out that they are part of the fictional enemy's of the US.




edit on 9-7-2013 by Senduko because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 02:03 PM
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reply to post by Senduko
 


What's the big deal about Stuxnet? They broke in, turned some fans up and left. What they going to do next time Iran tells them to PO?, break in again and play with the lights for 10 mins?



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 02:05 PM
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reply to post by EA006
 


Lol yeah whats the big deal, messing around in a nuclear plant... Whats the worst possible thing that go bad? Some collateral damage at most right?



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 02:12 PM
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Originally posted by Armadall
I'm not very familiar with rt.com, how credible have they been in the past?


RT is a direct owned property of the Russian Federation by way of their main state broadcast agency. It's like saying a smaller channel owned by Voice of America isn't somehow owned by the U.S. Government. Of course it would be and so is RT by the Russians.

Having said that? RT seems no better or worse than any other media outlet. Keep in mind that RT and the Russian Federation by extension, have absolutely no interest on any level with making the U.S. look good or giving any form of a benefit of a doubt on anything. That's important for seeing the spin and bias RT carries ...but then China's state broadcast is China biased and Voice of America is America biased. The band plays on.... eh?



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 02:14 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


What he revealed from his new role in the NSA is what would be available to him on a daily basis. He wasn't working in a KFC and discovered the colonels secret recipe and blew the whistle. He wouldn't have had to dig at all i don't think.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 02:17 PM
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reply to post by Senduko
 


Messing around in there isn't good but what they going to do? blow it up?............



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 02:22 PM
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reply to post by citizenx1
 



Not for much longer - in every sense the US is entering a period of massive decline whilst countries of the east are going to become the predominant economic and military force.

It is only hubris which prevents some from seeing this.

That's wishful thinking on your part.

I know many of you hope and pray this happens but US will never devolve to third world status, nor will anyone attempt to take US on militarily. Come back and tell me this if US loses its reserve currency status then we'll reevaluate the situation.


Wonder if that will be the prevailing view if countries like Iran take up arms against their aggressors.
Would we even notice? Iran is a joke economically and militarily. A country with such a horrible record of human rights violations and exporting and funding of terrorism certainly should not be permitted to have nukes...and they won't.



posted on Jul, 9 2013 @ 02:25 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
The United States making Stuxnet is secondary, since US Authors or at least close help with Israeli programmers was already common knowledge and only missed someone who saw it directly to say so.

I'm far more interested in this "web of foreign partners" he refers to. He's already gone WAY past simply exposing wrongdoing by the US against the US, so why stop here and now? Lets hear all of it...and spit out the names of those 'foreign partners'.

The impression seems to be left that the U.S. is Pappa Smurf to the world wide intelligence system when I think it's far closer to the truth that the U.S. is the 'gizmo store' that supplies almost all the high tech toys and through the NSA, coordinates and directs much of what happens ....but as members of an international effort which so far? No one seems to be asking too hard for names on.

He finally eluded to the existence of this world wide club we're but members of...not the undisputed leader of. Now, details!

edit on 9-7-2013 by Wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)



-----


The foreign partners that are referred to are ALL part of the Echelon system:

See Wikipedia website:
en.wikipedia.org...

Canada, USA, Australia, New Zealand, Britain which ALL contribute "Dictionairies"
to all other parties. Dictionaires are lists (i.e. similar to Hash Tags) of any
partner-specified keywords, phrases, subject matter tags, headlines, names of people,
designated places and events, and designated times and places which MUST be contained
in any given email, snail mail, SMS, text message, fax or other communications from
ANY single or TARGETED series of persons, companies or places, which allows the database
systems that are in use by each member country (i.e. IBM's DB2 or Oracle) to use advanced
Fuzzy Logic-based datamining techniques to correlate and associate all those
"Dictionary" terms with specific people or subject matter.

What you do is MAP all those dictionairy terms into a graphically-oriented
link-display system which uses colour and size of common graphic shapes to
indicate on a large screen the WHAT, WHEN, WHERE, WHO, HOW and WHY of any
given search term. If I look for me (i.e. StargateSG7), all items related
to my online activites, specific articles I've written, my Facebook updates,
etc. would all be displayed on a screen filled with red, green, yellow, blue,
orange boxes, triangles, circles, and arrows indicating a link to a specific place,
time, person or event which I or anyone CLOSE TO ME is linked to in some fashion.

This allows intelligence agencies to PREDICT my future activities based
on my past or present activities. For example: If on every Saturday for
the last year, I go for a coffee at Starbucks at 10:00am, it would be
reasonable to assume I would do the SAME THING next Saturday.

CONTINUED BELOW ===>

edit on 2013/7/9 by StargateSG7 because: sp

edit on 2013/7/9 by StargateSG7 because: spelling fixes



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