Two girls, 11 and 16, sexually assaulted off Brighton beach - UK

Originally posted by SuicideBankers
I am American and when I hear the word Asian I think China and such not Indians or Arabs.

Oh for crying out loud! I said in the OP (specifically for Americans) that Asian in the UK means someone from the Indian subcontinent, not Oriental or even Arab! Jesus wept....

Originally posted by SuicideBankers
Are there not laws in your country that address these types of crimes?

Of course we do, that isn't the discussion. We're not talking punishment, but prevention!!

Seriously, I am going to have a frigging aneurysm in a minute trying to explain such extraordinarily simple concepts to Americans...

Originally posted by SuicideBankers
These men committed a sexual offense and your country has laws that protect its people. Their race,religion, or creed is irrelevant. If law enforcement is failing to enforce the laws for what ever reason then please by all means blame the perpetrators.

Actually, if there is a culture of denial or ignorance within a specific community that fosters such behaviour, then it does have a lot to do with race, religion or creed, just like the Catholic Church and the problems they had. Until that specific community deals with the issue, all we can do is pick up the pieces afterwards.

Originally posted by Szarekh
reply to post by davesmart

 

While I know you'll get your comment removed,And I disapprove of whatever "action" you've hinted at it, I do agree that your spot on,on several things.Now, little tidbits of your racism aside,I think it is High time for action!
I say every Working,well law abiding U.K Citizen,AND working,and dreaming Legal Immigrant (Race and Religion be damned!) March on the streets and put ropes around the necks of the "people" who agree and commit these things,and throw them into the ocean!

I can assure you that any color,every religion,and all the political categories would join in on this once they grow up,and grow past the PC blanket over their eyes.

P.S. For the more PC inclined,This isn't an immigrant,nor a Muslim bashing comment.
Born and raised Citizens should be subject this treatment aswell,and be regarded the same as any other animal.

edit on 8-7-2013 by Szarekh because: (no reason given)

Quite agreed

and that bit of action i took was legal in a way
and you was right, the post was removed.

I have just got back from the bank (needed money before loan sharks took it.)
I see so much here, pedos are ripe in this little town.

All the guv cares about is fricking london, none of us peeps from the rest of the good ol uk.

At least in my heart i know what im doing and its right in my eyes and the rest of the British born populace

Mods, sorry that you felt my post had to be removed, I shall try and think next time before posting crap,
even though it may save your life or your childrens life one day

Originally posted by stumason
Evidently, you have cherry picked

Speaking of cherry picking (again)... how about those Muslims, huh?

Clearly your OP is not about the general issue of sexual assault and crime committed against women. This is about the Muslim and Asian immigrant community in Britain, this is point of your OP. No cherry picking here.

This is a genuine issue in the UK - there have been at least half a dozen of these gangs broken up and convicted in the past 2-3 years - every one of them being a group of Asian Muslims

How about you address the topic instead of attacking the poster?

I am addressing your post and I'm addressing your personal issues with the muslim community. I asked you earlier as to what you believed should be done to this community specifically that you feel are causing most of the problem. Nothing off topic about that although I can understand why you'd like to argue it's off topic. It puts you in an awkward position to have to explain away what you believe should actually be done as opposed to just spending your time complaining about Muslims specifically.

I want to bash Muslims? I went out of my way

You went out of your way to cover up the fact that this is yet another thread about those horrible Muslims, I'll agree with that. Unfortunately you're not the first one to try this and you certainly will not be the last.

I have said that every time this happens, the Authorities insist there is no problem

And? Clearly you believe that the culture of Islam, in particular as you claim, those of Indian and Pakistani Muslims, are the core problem here, and you feel the authorities aren't addressing this. You're not explaining to us in what way you mean by this, as to what you want the authorities to do to this specific 'problem' group.

What is wrong with education in general? Why should people of Pakistani/Indian islamic origin have special education? Why not educate the community in general about the issues facing your nation instead of giving a group specific education? 'Opening' channels you say? Are you saying that these communities are closed off to the law? Why not enforce the law in general so that ALL communities recognize this issue? Oh no no no, this is a Muslim issue right? Specifically? More police in their communities, more 'special' education on them, more profiling. That's what you want.

To me sexual assault is sexual assault. It's a crime. The fact that somebody committed it has little to do with their ethnicity and religion and a lot to do with people they choose to associate with and their own sick and twisted views. These men clearly know the law, they clearly know what they did was wrong and like wise they should have the full force of the law upon them. Targeting their communities because of their actions will not solve this issue, but solving this issue clearly isn't your concern in reality. You're just interested in targeting this community specifically, and you'll use these horrific crimes to justify your attacks on these communities whom for the most part consist of tax paying law abiding citizens.

Yep.

reply to post by Southern Guardian



Bloody thank you

You said what i could not in my drunken stupididy

cheers, I need say no more
dave

I think its important to understand the muslim mindset with regards to women (girls). Local muslim clerics preach that "non muslim women can be treated differently, like raw meat to a cat".

reply to post by stumason



stu

Dont sweat it

Even myself is using yanky/american quotations

Wer'e all in the same boat.

My country is turning into a nationalist socialist country.
Sorry i mean corporate.
Do something now.

What do we do dave?
OPEN your bloody mouths and shout it from the hills so people hear it

reply to post by Southern Guardian

It's another excuse to make a thread bashing muslims and immigrants, as if we don't have enough of them already?

Pointing out this growing problem isn’t BASHING Muslims. I thought the OP approached the issue very respectfully.

Sorry you’re sensitive about your Muslim buddies but….if the shoe fits! Sometimes reality is a hard pill to swallow. All the pandering in the world isn’t going to make it go down easier. Maybe it's time to face the facts.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
Speaking of cherry picking (again)... how about those Muslims, huh?

Clearly your OP is not about the general issue of sexual assault and crime committed against women. This is about the Muslim and Asian immigrant community in Britain, this is point of your OP. No cherry picking here.

Clearly, my OP is about a very specific and unique problem we have in the UK.

Clearly, you know nothing about it and just want to sound off about how much better a human being you think you are than the rest of us.

My OP is specifically about the grooming of young white girls by gangs of Pakistani men - we do not have gangs of Black men grooming girls, we do not have gangs of white men grooming girls, we do not have gangs of Frenchmen grooming girls, nor do we have gangs of Chinese men grooming girls.

Yes, we have incidents where a single man from any one of those groups will commit such an act, but he will be a loner and if his mates found out they'd likely give him a kicking and drag him down the station - this does not appear to happen in the Pakistani community. In every one of the gang-grooming cases, a couple of the blokes would groom girls and then bring them back to see their mates, who would without question begin abusing them too. This is not a phenomenon we see in any other group in the UK.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
I am addressing your post and I'm addressing your personal issues with the muslim community. I asked you earlier as to what you believed should be done to this community specifically that you feel are causing most of the problem. Nothing off topic about that although I can understand why you'd like to argue it's off topic. It puts you in an awkward position to have to explain away what you believe should actually be done as opposed to just spending your time complaining about Muslims specifically.

And what personal issues do I have with the Muslim community then? You seem to know me so well!

My only issue is the prevalence that this type of behaviour seems to have in a certain section of the Muslim community - it is you who is trying to paint a picture of me disliking Muslims which is total bollocks. As I said, you're attacking the poster rather than the topic because you don't actually have anything to add, probably because you don't actually know what you're talking about.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
You went out of your way to cover up the fact that this is yet another thread about those horrible Muslims, I'll agree with that.

No, it isn't. That is the way you read it, but as established earlier, you would have difficulty in deciphering exactly what Roger did with his Red hat. I made it painfully clear I didn't want this to turn into a blanket "hate Muslims" thread and even made it quite clear I work with several who are sound guys - admittedly they are of Arab descent, not Pakistani.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
And? Clearly you believe that the culture of Islam, in particular as you claim, those of Indian and Pakistani Muslims, are the core problem here, and you feel the authorities aren't addressing this. You're not explaining to us in what way you mean by this, as to what you want the authorities to do to this specific 'problem' group.

I don't want the Authorities to do anything, I want the community in question to do something, just like the Catholics were forced to do when they faced their own, very similiar problems

Cont............

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
What is wrong with education in general? Why should people of Pakistani/Indian islamic origin have special education? Why not educate the community in general about the issues facing your nation instead of giving a group specific education? 'Opening' channels you say? Are you saying that these communities are closed off to the law? Why not enforce the law in general so that ALL communities recognize this issue? Oh no no no, this is a Muslim issue right? Specifically? More police in their communities, more 'special' education on them, more profiling. That's what you want.

You quite clearly have no idea how some communities in the UK are closed off. In fact, you clearly have no idea about anything relating to this topic.

Yes, some of these communities are closed off from the law. They won't engage with the Police when they know about crimes, they won't integrate into the wider community and are marginalised by society because of this, furthering the divide.

If you lived here, you would know. If not, then how the hell can you sit there are make such sweeping statements and assumptions?

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
To me sexual assault is sexual assault. It's a crime. The fact that somebody committed it has little to do with their ethnicity and religion and a lot to do with people they choose to associate with and their own sick and twisted views. These men clearly know the law, they clearly know what they did was wrong and like wise they should have the full force of the law upon them. Targeting their communities because of their actions will not solve this issue, but solving this issue clearly isn't your concern in reality. You're just interested in targeting this community specifically, and you'll use these horrific crimes to justify your attacks on these communities whom for the most part consist of tax paying law abiding citizens.

Jesus, you really are something special, aren't you? You evidentially don't actually have a clue what you're talking about, or even have an inkling as to what the specific problem is that we're discussing, which begs the question why you are posting in the manner you are.

There is clearly an issue within certain sections of the Muslim community, so much so that their own religious leaders have taken it upon themselves to address it, as pointed out by Freeborn. If there wasn't an issue, then why would they do that?

The issue isn't that the crimes are taking place, they happen across all walks of life, the issue is the wall of silence from the community when they know these things are happening, the issue is the fact that the offenders can easily recruit other members of their community into their gang without fear of being grassed up, the issue is that one ethnic group feels it is perfectly acceptable to specifically target another (white girls - no Black, Arab or Oriental)

Lets turn it about, what if there was a gang of White men who specifically targeting Black girls for abuse. That would (quite rightly) be hailed as a racially motivated crime, wouldn't it? Then why does it not work the other way?

Let's just clear this up:

I DO NOT CARE WHAT COLOUR YOUR SKIN IS, WHAT GOD YOU FOLLOW OR WHAT LANGUAGE YOU SPEAK - ALL I CARE ABOUT IS YOUR ACTIONS AS A HUMAN BEING

So do not try to paint me as some sort of racist or bigot, it won't fly. In fact, if you care to look through my posting history, you will find me defending Muslims and Islam against the actual bigots and racists, but you're not interested in that are you, you just want to try and score petty points.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian


Not sure what you mean by this. Sexual assault, rape, the mistreatment of woman, is recognized as a huge problem. Your beef appears to be with the fact that muslims, middle easterners and indians aren't being recognized as the specific problem to society. Apparently the rest of us must share your personal issues with people of these groups.

I believe we, as humanity, have become too Politically Correct when it comes to facing ANY problem.

You don't have to share in any of it. Just sit on your fence, and denounce EVERYTHING......

As you have been doing.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
This is what people like you want. What else is there? You're just too cowardly to admit it.

Yeah, That's it.
(sarcasm with EVERY laugh)

You're to Cowardly to admit that Muslims were not,and are not doing enough to fix the problem. And that is the truth.

"This is the start of what will be a nationwide project in which we seek to work with others to eradicate this practice from all communities."

Imams in 500 mosques to denounce grooming and abuse of children Co-ordinated effort to deliver same sermon across the country follows convictions of Muslim men for series of horrific cases

See....They KNOW its a problem too. If you would have read my previous posts you would have seen my desire and the fix for it.

You were too busy being "hurt" at the "truth" of your initial post rebutted.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian

So you post on this board about the horrible muslims and arabs, dance around this idea that there's something wrong with people of this specific ground and you want 'something' to be done to deal with this specific group, but you can't bring yourself to say exactly what.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
What do you recommend be done again?

See my above two links, if you dare.......

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
Because clearly addressing sexual assault in general isn't something you're interested in.

Pot, Meet Kettle.

Clearly you only came to this thread without SOLUTIONS!

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
This is a muslim and immigrant problem in your eyes.

There are immigrants coming everyday. Did they catch last weeks prayer service where it was being denounced?

I don't think so.

Are the Imams who know this is a problem, giving a sermon everyday about it? I doubt it.

Is it STILL a problem?

Ask those two girls........

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
'Look' into the customs of Muslim communities? And do what? What action must be taken? You clearly want sometime to be done to the Muslim community specifically, and you want this done through law, you just can't seem to bring yourself to tell us what that is on this board. What? Do you want to regulate how they practice their belief? What?

Yawn.


You first need dialog. To have any type of dialog, you need to know what is making these people do it.




And your solution to the OBVIOUS problem?



(Play Loud)

I will close off by saying


If you dont live in ENGLAND then shut your pie hole
you clearly have no idea

and if your a parent you will fear for your children on a daily basis

This BRITAIN is a shamble of the world and a joke.

At times i tend to be ashamed but at the end it comes down to 1 minority
GUV

They play us like a game of chess, though i wonder what the devious
plan is to swamp the british with immigrants is....sorry i realize now
CHEAP LABOUR

reply to post by stumason


Why would you assume that the men were Muslim? There was nothing in the report about their religious preferences (if any) or who they really are.

Originally posted by g2v12
reply to post by stumason

 

Why would you assume that the men were Muslim? There was nothing in the report about their religious preferences (if any) or who they really are.

Because England is being overrun by these Muslim groups. You'd have to live in a bubble not to know the problems they're having. These immigrants brag about how they're going to get their way and force everyone under Sharia law. They have absolutely no resect for the people or culture of their host country. It's sickening that anyone tries to make excuses for it or be dismissive about it.

Originally posted by seabag

Originally posted by g2v12
reply to post by stumason

 

Why would you assume that the men were Muslim? There was nothing in the report about their religious preferences (if any) or who they really are.

Because England is being overrun by these Muslim groups. You'd have to live in a bubble not to know the problems they're having. These immigrants brag about how they're going to get their way and force everyone under Sharia law. They have absolutely no resect for the people or culture of their host country. It's sickening that anyone tries to make excuses for it or be dismissive about it.

So, the real issue is your Islamaphobic delusion, which apparently has nothing to do with the topic of this thread as it was posted.

Originally posted by g2v12

Originally posted by seabag

Originally posted by g2v12
reply to post by stumason

 

Why would you assume that the men were Muslim? There was nothing in the report about their religious preferences (if any) or who they really are.

Because England is being overrun by these Muslim groups. You'd have to live in a bubble not to know the problems they're having. These immigrants brag about how they're going to get their way and force everyone under Sharia law. They have absolutely no resect for the people or culture of their host country. It's sickening that anyone tries to make excuses for it or be dismissive about it.

So, the real issue is your Islamaphobic delusion, which apparently has nothing to do with the topic of this thread as it was posted.

Really? You can't throw out your catchy little labels and expect to shut down the conversation. Believe me when I say that I am not scared of Muslims.

If the OP is from that area and has relayed his first-hand knowledge of the situation (as have others) then I take their word for it. I don't live in a bubble. I read the news. You should try it sometime rather than resorting to canned responses and fallacious attacks.

Originally posted by stumason
I hate to admit it, but events like this have affected the way I think - a few weeks ago I was dropping my 9 year old daughter (blonder hair, blue eyes, long legs) off at school and before that, we went in the corner shop to buy some bits - the young Asian guy in there was friendly enough, as always - he's a nice bloke, but he made a comment about how pretty my daughter was and I felt instantly uncomfortable. Am I right to feel like that, or am I being unreasonable?

Stu, you want to know what's even more uncomfortable?

Being 20 years old, going into a local shop that you don't normally go to, only to be asked by the fella behind the counter in a creepy and invasive way how long you've lived in the area..

Irony being i have lived in this area before i was even one. Though im betting he had only been around here a maximum of five.

Being nice to your customers comes with asking them how they are, not eyeing them up like a piece of meat and wondering how long they've lived around here.

Hope your daughter never has to experience something as uncomfortable as that, i was only buying some potatoes for god sake, i now only go to that shop if i absolutely have to.

To the person who said you dont have groups of any other men going round the country in organised gangs abusing children:

Are you aware of organised religion??

Only yesterday the Church of England made an apology : www.bbc.co.uk... and the Wiki info on Catholic sex abuse is its own page; so go figure.

Religion is like a magnet for people with no morality so it's no surprise these men of religion all share similar "beliefs".

reply to post by Southern Guardian


You seem to be missing the core point of this discussion.

Yes, ALL sex crime is evil and anyone found guilty of such crimes should be punished in accordance with the law, (the penalties handed out are a joke but that is a discussion for another time and place).

But there are a disproportionate number of these sex crimes committed by people from a specific background.
In addition, on many occasions any investigation into these crimes are met with a wall of silence from those communities who feel a misguided sense of loyalty to the perpetrators.
This tendency towards grooming young, white girls is a cultural attitude imported from a specific rural area and these cultural attitudes, which are quite at odds with the laws and customs of their foster nation, are sometimes exploited by a minority of religious leaders from within their community in an effort to further their own extremist agenda.

Added to this there is a reluctance from the authorities to recognise that there is a problem within the said section and they put their PC driven agenda of multi-cultural harmony before the well being of the victims of these crimes.

Some within these communities do indeed recognise that there is a problem and that they themselves have a responsibility to help eradicate this problem.
The fact that 500 Imams are to speak out against this practice is a great starting point - but it's just that, a starting point.
It's acts and deeds that count.
The people from these communities must start acting on the words of these Imams and informing the relevant authorities of any such gangs within their community.

And it's worth mentioning here that there are over 1500 Mosques in the UK.
That means that over a thousand Imams, more than 2/3rds, have chosen not to give this speech.
What does that tell us?

Authorities, the government and religious and community leaders need to take their heads out of the sand and start meeting these problems head on instead of worrying about some sort Crystal Night like racially motivated revenge attacks.
They fail to see that it is their failure to do so that may actually cause something like that.
If they start addressing the problem in an open and honest manner then people will see that, respect that and let the appropriate people deal with the problem.

I really can't understand why so many people fail to see that it is this reluctance to deal with the problem that is creating divisions and conflict.

Now none of this is to say that there aren't other problems within our society relating to sex crimes etc and these too need addressing as a matter of urgency.

To label this a racially motivated thread is typical of the ignorant attitude that helps these practices continue and to accuse stu of racism is inaccurate and nothing more than a cheap and vindictive attempt to avoid any sort of reasoned debate on the subject. It displays a complete and total lack of understanding of the subject and an unwillingness to even consider anything that may differ from your own pre-conceived and prejudiced opinions.

It is just a regretable fact that men on the Indian sub continant and that includes the artificially divided lands of Pakistan and Bangladesh , are very lusty and their women have a very hard time from their men if they are not PROTECTED , I will say it again PROTECTED by male members of their families at all times .

I have lived in India at various times and I know exactly the culture and i fear even more the culture of disrepect of western females that the muslim Pakistani would have due to their religion .
Often I think religion is merely an excuse for a certain calibre of persons . LOW CLASS persons.
Unfortunately when you allow mass migration of the lower classes from Asia , not , you are inviting this problem and you will have to deal with it as they do in their own countries .

You will have to PROTECT your women from them .You must not be alone in the streets , especially at night time . As a woman in India I cant be out alone at night after 9 pm . That would only be inviting big trouble .
You have created England in the fashion of these countries by allowing so many of their men in .You now have to change your free and easy ways and live as they do , by covering up the women and always being with them . Its just the sad and hard facts if you want to keep your blonde haired daughters safe .

china aborted an entire generation of females,150,000,000 of them over the course of the one child policy (10+ years). chinese parents, who prefer male children and who were only allowed to have one child, are starting to panic that their sons will not be able to carry on the family name. this is resulting in kidnappings across national boundaries, stealing other people's female children. young females though, like 3 year olds and so forth. this may explain some of the behavior and why it's only coming from countries that border chinese territory. might be a kidnapping ring