Originally posted by charles1952
I hope I'm not drifting too far from your topic, but I'd like to offer a thought on war and violence.
I believe that well over 99.9999% of the world thinks war is bad. The question seems to be whether it is ever necessary. Surgery is bad, but it is sometimes necessary to suffer the pain to avoid a worse situation. I understand that delivering a child is really painful, and pain is bad, but it is necessary to achieve a good end, the new life.
Is war and violence ever justified? I won't bore you with the arguments you've heard before, but from what I've seen of your comments in some religious threads, you'd fight like a maniac if anyone tried to invade the US and impose Sharia.
The question seems to be not whether war is justified, but when. Are we together so far?
Originally posted by wildtimes
One thought - we have several members of each gender here -
do you think there's a basic difference between men and women when it comes to aggression/war attitudes?
Just a suggestion - when writing these things, take a look back and see if you can remove most of the "I" statements and see how much better of a response you get. It's all about ego.
I have noticed that I am a human living among humans, therefore as far as is practical;
1) I shall.....
Originally posted by Klassified
reply to post by wildtimes
As usual, a provocative and hard hitting thread. No one can ever accuse you of shying away from the hard questions. S&F
For my two cents. When was the last time You, myself, or Charles declared war on another nation? Let me answer that for you. Never.
War is declared by those who sit in the seats of power. Not by the average citizen.
My point being, support for war is garnered by our own government using propaganda and deception. How many times have we, the American people found out later, we were deceived into supporting a war, or an action, that was unjust, and uncalled for? Making those among us who supported that war or action, complicit.
I have said this before, and I'll say it again. The American people MUST withdraw their support for this government. Every time we vote, pay taxes, allow another piece of legislation to pass unchallenged, or sit back as a people, and allow our servants in Washed up DC to do as they damn well please, without regard for the American public, we give them our support. They are unchallenged, and therefore have explicit permission and support from us, as a people, to continue in the path they have taken this country.
War is profitable and expedient for those in the ruling class. Never for the common man/woman.
edit on 7/8/2013 by Klassified because: (no reason given)
"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free."
“War is not ‘the best way of settling differences; it is the only way of preventing their being settled for you.” – G.K. Chesterton ILN, 7/24/15
The Batenburgers under Jan van Batenburg preserved the violent millennialist stream of Anabaptism seen at Münster. They were polygamous and believed force was justified against anyone not in their sect. Their movement went underground after the suppression of the Münster Rebellion, with members posing as Catholics or Lutherans as necessary. Some nonresistant Anabaptists found leaders in Menno Simons and the brothers Obbe and Dirk Philips, Dutch Anabaptist leaders who repudiated the distinctive doctrines of the Münster Anabaptists. This group eventually became known as the Mennonites after Simons. They rejected any use of violence, preached a faith based on love of enemy and compassion.
Col. Quaritch: [addressing marines]
Everyone on this base, every one of you, is fighting for survival, and that's a fact. There's an aboriginal horde out there massing for an attack. These orbital images tell me that the hostile numbers have gone from a few hundred, to well over two thousand in one day. And more are pourin' in. In a week's time there could be 20,000 of 'em. At that point they will overrun our perimeter. That's not gonna happen. Our only security lies in preemptive attack. We will fight terror with terror. The hostiles believe that this mountain territory is protected by their... deity. And when we destroy it, we will blast a crater in their racial memory so deep, that they won't come within 1,000 klicks of this place ever again. And that, too, is a fact.
For the US this should be a no brainer, especially when it pertains to who we are diplomatically and economically close to. We should not be doing business on any level with those nations that demonstrate they do not value the things we are supposed to value. We have turned ourselves into the very things we are supposed to despise so we can have cheap gas and cheap manufactured goods. You are who you hang with.
Originally posted by wildtimes
Mourn on the Fourth of July: Inside the Christian anti-patriot movement
By David R. Wheeler, special to CNN
(CNN) - Like many congregations, The Mennonite Worker Community of Minneapolis held a worship service and picnic this Fourth of July - but instead of extolling the virtues of America, they called attention to its faults.
The annual service is “a sort of anti-patriotic holiday,” says Mark Van Steenwyk, whose community focuses on simplicity, prayer and peacemaking. Singing “The Star-Spangled Banner” is out. Reflecting on the contradictions between the gospel and the American Dream are in.
“We thank you, O God, for the good things we enjoy in our lives," reads a prayer the Mennonite community recites each year, "but lament that our abundance has brought destitution to sisters and brothers throughout the Earth.”
Nowadays there are Zionist Christian Evangelicals screeching for WAR - HOPING for the Apocalypse and destruction of OTHER PEOPLE and their countries. This is APPALLING.