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Originally posted by Moshpet
reply to post by MsAphrodite
Frankly, what I said stands. Until the ACLU or another group generates enough public support via the Governed, then nothing will change.
There are reasons things are secret, classified and need to know. There will always be such things, and not just in our Government. You do not have to approve of such things, nor does the Government have to 'fill you in' on such things. It's clear that many of you think that it's just a cover up, but it's not always the case or so childishly simple.
From my own experiences in the Army and Combat:
There were many things going on behind the scenes and various operations, that had I known about and had fallen prisoner, I could have endangered countless lives, by simply knowing that information. For example there were several CIA guided operations that occurred in Panama during Operation: Just Cause, that I only learned about many years after the fact. Some of those operations my unit supported. Same with ops in other countries.
As for the 'Day to Day' current operations of the various alphabet agencies, and the secret or sensitive information or gathering techniques they employ. I clearly do not have a need to know about them, and neither do you. Because the fact remains that any large or small nation will have people working against it. It was true in the days of Rome and it is true now. It also stands to reason that if secrets and operations were not kept quiet and 'need to know, secret, top secret, and the like,' many lives would be at risk or lost.
So no. It's quite likely the ACLU doesn't have a 'right to know' how the NSA is doing what they were mandated to do by the Government. Not to mention, rightly so, because they would have to pass many background checks as an organization, which would likely be every member; in order to gain access to those materials.
So rather than crying foul, about how the government is 'hiding behind "Classified Statutes." ' Maybe you need to look to forcing the Government to create something like the Inspector General's office that is present in the Military, with Auditory powers and legal teeth to review such things. Rather than saying, "The government keeps hiding behind their rules over official secrets, that are there to protect me."
The laws governing official secrets, classified information and the like, exist to protect you. You may not care for them, but that will not change that fact. That there are problems that exist in how easily Snowden got access to classified information, does concern me, and many others.
You don't have to like the facts, but there they are.
Medit on 6-7-2013 by Moshpet because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by MsAphrodite
reply to post by Moshpet
Typical tactic used to deflect away from the issue. The issue here is NOT Snowden.
He is the messenger.
edit on 6-7-2013 by MsAphrodite because: (no reason given)
There is a reason the MAJORITY of Americans view Snowden as a hero and not a traitor. Oh, they must be wrong and don't know what is good for them and that is why they aren't allowed to know state secrets....riiiiigghhhhttttt.
Remember, the first stage of grief is always denial.
The only "safe" commercial flight across the Atlantic -- one that would avoid U.S. extradition treaties -- is to Cuba. Cuba has an extradition treaty from 1904, but the Castro government could chose to ignore it.
From Havana, Snowden could connect to Caracas, Venezuela, or Managua, Nicaragua.
If he could get a valid travel document from either country in time, Snowden could take Saturday's 2:05 p.m. flight to Cuba. There are two connecting flights to Caracas on Sunday.
There is also the private-flight option. Reports last week quoted the cost of a private plane to Ecuador to be more than $200,000 on one of the few private jets that could make the trip without refueling. Similar flights to Venezuela or Nicaragua would presumably be only a bit less.
But even if he does get on either of those flights, there is also the question of air space -- especially after the incident involving the Bolivian president's plane. Would European countries or the United States deny a plane carrying Snowden to fly over their territory or force it down?
Originally posted by MsAphrodite
reply to post by Moshpet
What information did he give out? People keep repeating this, however there is no there, there. It's just a deflection away from the importance of what he has revealed.
Classic tactic to focus on the source instead of the information.