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A Non-Religious Abortion Debate

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posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 07:36 PM
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Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by Bone75
 



My position is that abortion and contraceptives that harm fertilized eggs should be illegal. I think its murder and it should be stopped.


So you believe life begins at fertilization?

What gives you that idea?

~Tenth






So you believe it doesn't begin at fertilization?
What gives you that Idea?

See,
We can play that game all day,
pretending that abortion is not murder because of when the abortion took place.

Prevention of a pregnancy is a personal act.
Terminating a pregnancy is the act of one person killing the other.


If an abortionist walked up and said, "I believe killing my own child is my right." then I could at least accept that they actually were facing the consequences of the decision.

I wouldn't admire them for that fact but at least they would be facing it honestly.

The question of when it is a child is simply a game people play to pretend that they aren't killing someone.



edit on 4-7-2013 by badgerprints because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 07:39 PM
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Originally posted by ShadellacZumbrum
reply to post by Bone75
 


First you say this:



=My position is that abortion and contraceptives that harm fertilized eggs should be illegal. I think its murder and it should be stopped.


And Then You Say this:



If it prevents the sperm from entering the egg, then of course I would support it.


That is called a contradicrion in terms. Your reasoning is Completely Fouled and your argument is losing momentum.

You can not expect to create a double standard in a debate and win do you?


Just how dense can one person (correction, 3 people now) be?

I am against the killing of fertilized eggs because they are humans and have a right to live. Sperm is NOT a human.

There is no contradiction on my part, only a lack of comprehension on yours.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 07:45 PM
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reply to post by Bone75
 


So, you have a petri dish with several eggs. You apply some sperm and "poof" you suddenly and magically have a people in a dish?

Nope.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 07:48 PM
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reply to post by ShadellacZumbrum
 


Same here, I was a teacher for the school system for a few years and I had too attend the opening day for the new high school students at the school were I started working when moving here to the south( my husband was an active duty marine at the time), I was actually surprised when the young people were separated into two groups males and females, then they asked the pregnant teens to leave also, the speech that came after by the school principal and counselors was something I never seen before, they were actually telling they girls to keep their legs closed because teen pregnancy will lead to a life a poverty and more and increased drop outs from schools.

I never seen anything like that before no even when my daughter attended her high school opening in a better part of the county did she was told anything like that.

But is very truth, teen pregnancy starts in junior high were girls are taken to alternative schools until they have their babies.

By the time they are in their twenties they have various children by different fathers, still with all the available help to control pregnancy they still wants to have children, also STDs are a big problem in my neck of the woods.

while pregnancy in teens here in the south will lead to a life a poverty, been on welfare is enough for many of them, because that is the life that most of their mothers are used too.

Sad but truth.
edit on 4-7-2013 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 07:50 PM
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Originally posted by windword
reply to post by Bone75
 


So, you have a petri dish with several eggs. You apply some sperm and "poof" you suddenly and magically have a people in a dish?

Nope.


but if you have them in a womb, one of them at least, will probably become a human person.

Unless you kill it.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 07:50 PM
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reply to post by windword
 


This just makes my day,

That was a good one, I guess is not argument with that type of mentality and "strong believes"



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 07:51 PM
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Originally posted by Bone75

I am against the killing of fertilized eggs because they are humans and have a right to live. Sperm is NOT a human.



You say a fertilized egg is human because it has human DNA. A finger has human DNA, but a finger is not human. Just because something that is part of a human has human DNA, doesn't mean it's human.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 07:52 PM
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Originally posted by sdcigarpig

Make no mistake, in the interest of fairness and equality in the law, if you think that the fertalized egg should be protected, then it would mean that 25% of the women who do miscarry would be punished, adding to the overburdened penal system, and all of our freedoms would quickly go away, that of privacy, as the patient/doctor privledge would no longer be allowed in a court of law and travel out of country would be restricted to only a privledge few, so those day trips to Canada and Mexico would be out of the question.


I am in no way advocating for the punishment of women who miscarry, that's almost as ridiculous as the poster who thinks I want to prosecute those who masturbate.

By the way, I thought the new term for miscarriage was "spontaneous abortion". Do try to keep up please.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:12 PM
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Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by Bone75

I am against the killing of fertilized eggs because they are humans and have a right to live. Sperm is NOT a human.



You say a fertilized egg is human because it has human DNA. A finger has human DNA, but a finger is not human. Just because something that is part of a human has human DNA, doesn't mean it's human.


A fertilized egg is a human because it contains it's own DNA. A fertilized egg is no longer part of the mother, but it's own being.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:12 PM
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reply to post by Bone75
 


Would you punish the woman who took an abortion pill? If so, in what way? How would you decide what was a legitimate miscarriage vs a chemical abortion?



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:15 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043

I was a teacher for the school system for a few years


Please tell me you're not serious. If so, then that explains a lot.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:17 PM
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reply to post by Bone75
 


It is Actually the lack of comprehension is on your part.

Because by definition Any contraception is intended to purposely harm the likely hood of fertilization.

Now go answer the questions about the nurse and the pregnant girl.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:18 PM
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reply to post by Bone75
 





A fertilized egg is a human because it contains it's own DNA. A fertilized egg is no longer part of the mother, but it's own being.


Then, it should be able to take up residence somewhere else, besides the woman's womb. But, it can't. No one can carry that egg to term but the mother. As long as it is attached and drawing nourishment hijacked from it's host's blood, if it can't live outside it's own mother's womb, it's not it's own person.

Unless of course we're talking about petri dish "people", who can be implanted into another woman. But barring a womb, an egg isn't going to survive, and is not a person.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:23 PM
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Originally posted by Bone75

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by Bone75

I am against the killing of fertilized eggs because they are humans and have a right to live. Sperm is NOT a human.



You say a fertilized egg is human because it has human DNA. A finger has human DNA, but a finger is not human. Just because something that is part of a human has human DNA, doesn't mean it's human.


A fertilized egg is a human because it contains it's own DNA. A fertilized egg is no longer part of the mother, but it's own being.


There is a new strand of DNA, but that doesn't necessarily mean its a separate human. It is just that the egg has the Mom's DNA and the sperm has the Dad's DNA. That doesn't mean the fertilized egg is its own being. Not yet, anyway.
edit on 4-7-2013 by kaylaluv because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:36 PM
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Originally posted by ShadellacZumbrum
reply to post by Bone75
 


It is Actually the lack of comprehension is on your part.

Because by definition Any contraception is intended to purposely harm the likely hood of fertilization.


That statement is completely inaccurate, at least the ignorance level on your avatar isn't.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:45 PM
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Originally posted by badgerprints

Prevention of a pregnancy is a personal act.
Terminating a pregnancy is the act of one person killing the other.


Do you mind if I put that in my signature? It pretty much sums up my stance.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 08:46 PM
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I don't think abortion is murder at all, if it is than i must be an accomplice to genocide at this point.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 09:03 PM
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reply to post by Bone75
 


con·tra·cep·tion/ˌkɒntrəˈsɛpʃən/ Show Spelled [kon-truh-sep-shuhn] Show IPA
noun
the deliberate prevention of conception or impregnation by any of various drugs, techniques, or devices; birth control.

That is the definition of Contraception.

Apparently your ignorance level is at maximum level.

Because that could easily be construed as a device known to HARM the potential possibility of pregnancy.

Now, while you are at it answer the other 2 questions. OR, did those valid questions tick you off as well?



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 09:05 PM
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Do you mind if I put that in my signature? It pretty much sums up my stance.
reply to post by Bone75
 


But you don't mind Murdering a Retarded Girls Baby. .. Hum, ., . .. . go figure.



posted on Jul, 4 2013 @ 09:37 PM
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Originally posted by ShadellacZumbrum
reply to post by Bone75
 


con·tra·cep·tion/ˌkɒntrəˈsɛpʃən/ Show Spelled [kon-truh-sep-shuhn] Show IPA
noun
the deliberate prevention of conception or impregnation by any of various drugs, techniques, or devices; birth control.

That is the definition of Contraception.

Apparently your ignorance level is at maximum level.

Because that could easily be construed as a device known to HARM the potential possibility of pregnancy.

Now, while you are at it answer the other 2 questions. OR, did those valid questions tick you off as well?


I didn't use the word contraception in any of my posts, so I don't understand why you felt a need to define it (I do actually, I'm just trying to be respectful).

I used the word contraceptives, and I have specifically singled out those that harm fertilized eggs. There are many different types of contraceptives, some of them harm fertilized eggs, others don't. For instance, condoms are a contraceptive that doesn't harm a fertilized egg because they prevent the egg from being fertilized. The morning after pill is a contraceptive that harms fertilized eggs by preventing them from implanting in the womb. If the egg (which has already been fertilized) doesn't attach, then it dies.

Now when I'm confident that you at least understand my argument, I'll be happy to address any more shock and awe examples you've provided.



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