Your "Ufology" Is Lacking. Can You Handle the Truth (Evidence)?

reply to post by HairlessApe


I already linked you to that wiki . . . The documentary you linked me to "The Quantum Activist", the guy identifies consciousness as non material . . . and assigns quantum principles to that non material entity. He essentially states that the physical manifestation resulting from an experience or thought is the result of a quantum choice of consciousness.

My whole point was going to get around to the problem that all of that is subjective and the scientific method is severely lacking in quantifying such.

But thanks for linking me a doc' which confirms basically what I was getting at.

Originally posted by FriedBabelBroccoli
reply to post by HairlessApe

 

I already linked you to that wiki . . .

No you didn't! It was an entirely different wiki article! You're delusional!

The documentary you linked me to "The Quantum Activist", the guy identifies consciousness as non material

YOU SAID THOUGHTS ARE CARRIED BY/COMPOSED OF PROTONS AND NEUTRONS. YOU DID NOT SAY THEY ARE NON-PHYSICAL. Unless of course, you're now admitting that you spoke without actually knowing what you were talking about - and what you ACTUALLY meant by protons and electrons was nonphysical waves. That doesn't make sense, but I'd accept it regardless.

You also said thoughts cannot be predicted or measured. COUNTER-ARGUMENT:

Thought identification refers to the empirically verified use of technology to, in some sense, read people's minds. Recent research using neuroimaging has provided some early demonstrations of the technology's potential to recognize high-order patterns in the brain. In some cases, this provides meaningful (and controversial) information to investigators. Professor of neuropsychology, Barbara Sahakian, qualifies "A lot of neuroscientists in the field are very cautious and say we can't talk about reading individuals' minds, and right now that is very true, but we're moving ahead so rapidly, it's not going to be that long before we will be able to tell whether someone's making up a story, or whether someone intended to do a crime with a certain degree of certainty."

Psychologist Marcel Just and his colleague, Tom Mitchell, have used FMRI brain scans to teach a computer to identify the various parts of the brain associated with specific thoughts.

...

To illustrate this, Just and Mitchell used their computer to predict, based on nothing but FMRI data, which of several images a volunteer was thinking about. The computer was 100% accurate, but so far the machine is only distinguishing between 10 images

In 2011, a team led by Shinji Nishimoto used only brain recordings to partially reconstruct what volunteers were seeing.

On January 31, 2012 Brian Pasley and colleagues of University of California Berkeley published their paper in PLoS Biology where in subjects internal neural processing of auditory information was decoded and reconstructed as sound on computer by gathering and analyzing electrical signals directly from subjects brains.[

Emotiv Systems, an Australian electronics company, has demonstrated a headset that can be trained to recognize a user's thought patterns for different commands

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by FriedBabelBroccoli


Uhhhhhhhhh . . . as Guy Malone's panel of high level scholars documented . . .

the FALLEN ANGELS

WHO HAD chosen to take on mortal bodies

IN ORDER TO copulate with human women

--THEIR--

bodies were killed during Noah's flood. . . . and their eternal spirits then became what we call demons.

That was by far NOT ALL the fallen angels.

There are certainly plenty of them running around pretending to be ET's as well as plenty of them gearing up for Armageddon after enforcing 3.5-7 years of satan's rule during the Great Tribulation.

That's part of the evidence many folks are unwilling to even consider, much less face square on.

reply to post by HairlessApe


No need to get so angry you have to type several words in all caps.

( en.wikipedia.org... Thought identification ) This is the link you just provided . . .

( en.wikipedia.org... Thought identification ) This is the link I provided, you can easily confirm this by clicking on posts by member in this thread to confirm it.

I linked you the very problem of trying to identify thoughts as atomic structures composed of protons and neutrons. The documentary you linked to states in no uncertain terms that consciousness is separate from the material world and acts as a quantum wave, not that it is matter acting as a quantum wave.

As to reading minds . . . . from your own source, which I originally posted . . .

Professor of neuropsychology, Barbara Sahakian, qualifies "A lot of neuroscientists in the field are very cautious and say we can't talk about reading individuals' minds, and right now that is very true, but we're moving ahead so rapidly, it's not going to be that long before we will be able to tell whether someone's making up a story, or whether someone intended to do a crime with a certain degree of certainty."

Telling whether someone is lying or not is not predict the thought it is predicting whether it will be true or not . . .

Reconstructing visual sight is not the same as thought . . .


I think the main issue here is you fail to grasp the concept of consciousness.

EDIT
Just because they use the term "thought patterns" does not mean it is "reading thoughts" it is translating electrical signals into commands. Those electrical signals are known to occur when an individual is thinking in a certain manner, like a command for a motor function for example. It is not the same as thinking of an apple.

reply to post by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf


I think some boundaries are being drawn that likely have no correlation with reality.

It seems perfectly logical to me that there is a kind of tangible 'nuts and bolts' craft and technology reality to the evil spiritual dimension and the fallen angel critters from there.

One of the things God was most upset with them about in ancient times was their sharing war making TECHNOLOGIES with humans. That's still going on and God is not any more pleased with it now than He was then.

Or, if we hypothesize that there is a SPIRITUAL DIMENSION with both God's angels and satan's angels in various spheres of it . . . Ezekiel's chariot seemed to be quite tangible technology of some sort.

And occasionally, a modern experiencer of a 'trip to Heaven' will comment that they were taken there in a kind of gondola craft. [Search You tube for . . . what's his face . . . the former moderate level Rock Star from Lousiana . . . Jesse DuPlantis (I know--throw rocks if you will--the whole congregation still saw his head and countenance glowing a la Moses' right after his return from that visit with God)]

Anyway--my point merely is that it's not at all far fetched to construe a spiritual dimension that ALSO HAS technologies in use. NOTHING in Scripture nor in logic decrees that said spiritual dimension is 100% only ethereal clouds and ethers inhabited by non-temporal, non-corporeal entities.

As Christ said to Thomas--"touch my hands, touch my sides" after His Resurrection. He cooked and ate fish etc.

reply to post by FriedBabelBroccoli


Last I checked, we now CAN determine with a set of scalp sensors or some such

whether someone is lying, or not

--with a sufficient confidence level to stand up in court--

though there is the self-incriminating Constitutional issue . . . that the Destroyer In Chief et al are trashing right and left. . . . More of the NWO, fallen angel/ET evils folks don't want to face, are incapable of facing.

Time for more questions.

Why are people getting upset here?
I enjoy the posts of every member of this thread so far.
I personally reject Bo's conclusions and he knows that, but I still love hearing his perspective as he brings a LOT of solid info to the table.

I noticed people curious about the EM field; is it possible that that wireless network I mentioned before is contained within the EM field? Could we analyze the EM field and find thoughts floating around within it?

If folks are upset about the idea of God being involved, perhaps they could just substitute God and fallen angels with a group of ET who pretend to be God? Then everyone can get along again.

For those who like to pray and such, have you ever tried writing your prayers out on paper? If so, what was that experience like?

Originally posted by FriedBabelBroccoli
reply to post by HairlessApe

 

No need to get so angry you have to type several words in all caps.

( en.wikipedia.org... Thought identification ) This is the link you just provided . . .

( en.wikipedia.org... Thought identification ) This is the link I provided, you can easily confirm this by clicking on posts by member in this thread to confirm it.

I linked you the very problem of trying to identify thoughts as atomic structures composed of protons and neutrons. The documentary you linked to states in no uncertain terms that consciousness is separate from the material world and acts as a quantum wave, not that it is matter acting as a quantum wave.

As to reading minds . . . . from your own source, which I originally posted . . .

Professor of neuropsychology, Barbara Sahakian, qualifies "A lot of neuroscientists in the field are very cautious and say we can't talk about reading individuals' minds, and right now that is very true, but we're moving ahead so rapidly, it's not going to be that long before we will be able to tell whether someone's making up a story, or whether someone intended to do a crime with a certain degree of certainty."

Telling whether someone is lying or not is not predict the thought it is predicting whether it will be true or not . . .

Reconstructing visual sight is not the same as thought . . .


I think the main issue here is you fail to grasp the concept of consciousness.

EDIT
Just because they use the term "thought patterns" does not mean it is "reading thoughts" it is translating electrical signals into commands. Those electrical signals are known to occur when an individual is thinking in a certain manner, like a command for a motor function for example. It is not the same as thinking of an apple.

edit on 6-7-2013 by FriedBabelBroccoli because: 101

No, the problem is that despite being given the data some people will say "there is no data" because they can't accept the objective fact that they've been proven wrong. They also can't quote the link that they sent earlier because it doesn't actually exist and it's too late at this point to edit their post.

This conversation is over, I've proven you wrong. But have a nice day and be sure to keep plugging your ears and going "Lalalalala! Lalalalala! I can't hear the data!"

You're really good at replying to posts without actually answering them.

reply to post by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf


Uhhhh a significant percentage of folks damaged by

demonic force that they FELT

also SAW demonic entities in the process of doing the damage to themselves and/or loved ones.

At which point

do you

admit that FEELING and SEEING an entity doing VISIBLE, LASTING bodily tissue, bone damage

is more than a THOUGHT?????????????????

Sigh.

Another thing that has always interested me about the legit nuts and bolts encounters, and this is probably something one of the PhDs here have a great answer for, is that people tend to actually FORGET the encounter ever took place until questioned about it.
Does that seem curious to anyone else?

reply to post by DelMarvel


The phenomenological method has much to offer.

Rigorous data collection of an objective sort with consistent guidelines can reveal a lot that the pretend-scientific method is INCAPABLE of investigating much at all.

For example, how many MILLIONS of cases need to be statistically investigated in a rigorous way wherein

there are

1. clear and significant . . . consistently the same or similar . . . lasting body marks, designs, cuts, 'brands' etc.

2. babies taken at the end of the first trimester

3. hybrid offspring are shown to the victims wherein the hybrids look half like the parent and half 'alien.'

4. tangible objects are involved of a consistent type across many thousands of cases around the world.

And that's leaving out the 4,000+ cases of trace evidences SCIENTIFICALLY investigated and VERIFIED.

reply to post by BO XIAN


If these demons you speak of are indeed spiritual in nature and only assume a humanoid appearance (as God has destroyed their bodies) it would follow that creating hybrid offspring would be a priority of theirs (because as you said, invoking the name of spiritual power (Jesus) tends to send them packing), but the question is, obviously, how is this possible??

It is akin to having sexual relations and being impregnated by a ghost, is it not?

Originally posted by HairlessApe
No, the problem is that despite being given the data some people will say "there is no data" because they can't accept the objective fact that they've been proven wrong. They also can't quote the link that they sent earlier because it doesn't actually exist and it's too late at this point to edit their post.

This conversation is over, I've proven you wrong. But have a nice day and be sure to keep plugging your ears and going "Lalalalala! Lalalalala! I can't hear the data!"

You're really good at replying to posts without actually answering them.

edit on 6-7-2013 by HairlessApe because: (no reason given)

The link I provided earlier doesn't exist? WTF are you talking about?

reply to post by HairlessApe


I am getting it now (the video)

It seems you are confusing the difference between reading the actual thought taking place and scanning the areas of the brain being highlighted and predicting whether a thought would be a lie or truth or apple.

You are not addressing the origin of that thought.

EDIT
Thought Identification
en.wikipedia.org...

That is the same link . . . . .

I don't know where you come up with this nonsense . .

Here is my original post about consciousness as well.

Your explanation leaves out the problem of consciousness and comes across in an extremely condescending manner.

The UFO as 'gods' or 'demons' is still a valid line of investigation as all those things occurred withing the consciousness.

Once you can materially define and locate consciousness and predict future thought with accuracy based upon the movements of protons and electrons within the brain you can confidently pursue your claims, however until then you merely playing the fool.

I said you have a hard time proving consciousness through material means and you link me to a documentary which confirms this . . .

Should I be concerned about your mental health?

reply to post by The GUT
Through observations and certain trend patterns our societal influence is merely in conjunction with the masses.. For instance, with in the context of the cultures reality. If it is not explained then it must be an evil or dark power. We still find ourselves doing this. Scientific views are ever changing, so it is completely plausible that ancient as well as religious groups today would pin Aliens as Demonic influence. If the technology is far more advanced than it is dubbed evil.. Just think if we showed up in the 1600's with some of our knowledge we have today.. We would be burned as witches by the masses.. It's the classic shepherd, sheep, wolf, case. Sometimes the Sheep don't like where the Shepherds push their attention to keep them safe in a complacent society from the wolves.

Originally posted by BO XIAN

For example, how many MILLIONS of cases need to be statistically investigated in a rigorous way wherein

there are

1. clear and significant . . . consistently the same or similar . . . lasting body marks, designs, cuts, 'brands' etc.

2. babies taken at the end of the first trimester

3. hybrid offspring are shown to the victims wherein the hybrids look half like the parent and half 'alien.'

4. tangible objects are involved of a consistent type across many thousands of cases around the world.

I apologize if you've done this earlier in the thread but could you post some sources on this?

I'm not saying this in a rhetorical, confrontational way. I'd really like to take a look at the research you're talking about. I have to state up front I'm highly skeptical that there is actually evidence of hybrid offspring or babies disappearing from wombs but I'll try to keep an open mind.

Originally posted by JayinAR
reply to post by BO XIAN

 

If these demons you speak of are indeed spiritual in nature and only assume a humanoid appearance (as God has destroyed their bodies) it would follow that creating hybrid offspring would be a priority of theirs (because as you said, invoking the name of spiritual power (Jesus) tends to send them packing), but the question is, obviously, how is this possible??

It is akin to having sexual relations and being impregnated by a ghost, is it not?

I don't think we have anything near an exhaustive . . . what . . . taxonomy? . . .

comprehensive set of details about such phenomena.

It is clear from history and from the Bible that evil entities have successfully copulated with humans.

The fallen angels in the Bible targeted human women and evidently were keenly interested in polluting the DNA bloodlines of man--perhaps to try vainly to prevent Christ being born if there was no pure bloodline left. When it describes Noah being perfect in all his generations--the root word meanings evidently have to do with his DNA being pure and not polluted by fallen angel DNA.

Certainly the critters are diligently busy polluting millions of DNA lines in our era. Their hybridization program seems to be one of their HIGHEST priorities. To what end seems to be mostly a mystery. Some speculate they are breeding robotized hybrids to help them win Armageddon's war with God though their boss, Lucifer knows that's not possible.

In any case . . . in ancient times, evidently the fallen angels CHOSE to take on mortal bodies and somehow that was possible. But God would not let them go back and forth. Once they chose sexual pleasures over eternal supernatural bodies . . . the die was cast. The flood destroyed THOSE bodies.

The fallen angels NOT in such a state at the time of the flood continued in portions and some unknown numbers to choose to copulate with human women . . . and God was forever angry with such. The Children of Israel's orders to utterly wipe out all the tribes in Cannan on their arrival had to do with that.

IT HAS BEEN DOCUMENTED

that EVERY ONE OF THOSE TRIBES was thoroughly polluted with fallen angel DNA, nephilim etc.

And that was the reason God said wipe them all out--totally.

Originally posted by Wick308
reply to post by The GUT

 

Through observations and certain trend patterns our societal influence is merely in conjunction with the masses.. For instance, with in the context of the cultures reality. If it is not explained then it must be an evil or dark power.

Nah, that answer is too simplistic and fits me, personally, in no way. Sure, that happens, but I came into the realm of ufology with an agnostic attitude with a hope to find proof of ET. After my own sighting and delving into the literature, I leaned more towards the ETH explanation.

Before I ever moved into the IDH corner, it became apparent that, if they exist at all, they are sneaky buggers and as such I certainly wouldn't rush to worship them as our makers nor our saviors.

Many folk come to the conclusion that whatever they are, they fall into that "demonological" phenomenon that Keel references. It ain't fear of the unknown, it's their reported characteristics that make many conclude they aren't to be trusted.

That's not some primitive fear at all. Quite the opposite. It's drawing personal conclusions from the "evidence" presented.

Originally posted by BO XIAN
Their hybridization program seems to be one of their HIGHEST priorities.

Just to throw this out there: just looking at 1947 onward, the abduction/breeding meme hasn't been consistently reported by experiencers. There was a period of time where people were seeing a lot of Nordic aliens who supposedly claimed to be from planets in our solar system. We didn't start getting a lot of reports of smaller aliens until around the time of Betty and Barney Hill. What has been reported has changed over the years and there is unquestionably a psychological aspect to it (such as correlation with science fiction.)

And just to get back to the article GUT posted about High Strangeness. There is now and probably always has been a very diverse set of strange experiences perceived by certain people. What happens is that researchers often pick and choose those reports that support their personal theories; in fact, the people having the experience often engage in self selection. For example, if you perceive you have been abducted by little aliens you are more likely to find someone who has popularized that theory to report to. If you perceive you have seen a giant kangaroo with glowing eyes you're not going to report to the community that believes in the Greys.

Originally posted by DelMarvel

Originally posted by BO XIAN
Their hybridization program seems to be one of their HIGHEST priorities.

Just to throw this out there: just looking at 1947 onward, the abduction/breeding meme hasn't been consistently reported by experiencers. There was a period of time where people were seeing a lot of Nordic aliens who supposedly claimed to be from planets in our solar system. We didn't start getting a lot of reports of smaller aliens until around the time of Betty and Barney Hill. What has been reported has changed over the years and there is unquestionably a psychological aspect to it (such as correlation with science fiction.)

And just to get back to the article GUT posted about High Strangeness. There is now and probably always has been a very diverse set of strange experiences perceived by certain people. What happens is that researchers often pick and choose those reports that support their personal theories; in fact, the people having the experience often engage in self selection. For example, if you perceive you have been abducted by little aliens you are more likely to find someone who has popularized that theory to report to. If you perceive you have seen a giant kangaroo with glowing eyes you're not going to report to the community that believes in the Greys.

edit on 6-7-2013 by DelMarvel because: (no reason given)

The closest thing to a scientific study of the paranormal being made public would be the NIDS report on 'skinwalker' ranch.

www.skinwalkerranch.org...

Hunt for the Skinwalker: Science Confronts the Unexplained at a Remote Ranch in Utah
by Ph.D. Colm A. Kelleher (Author) , George Knapp (Author)
www.amazon.com...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252367692&sr=8-1

Leading a first-class team of research scientists on a disturbing odyssey into the unknown, Colm Kelleher spent hundreds of days and nights on the Skinwalker property and experienced firsthand many of its haunting mysteries. With investigative reporter George Knapp -- the only journalist allowed to witness and document the team's work -- Kelleher chronicles in superb detail the spectacular happenings the team observed personally, and the theories of modern physics behind the phenomena. Far from the coldly detached findings one might expect, their conclusions are utterly hair-raising in their implications. Opening a door to the unseen world around us, Hunt for the Skinwalker is a clarion call to expand our vision far beyond what we know.

It is a fascinating read as it involves many of the paranorma/UFO memes which have been popularized in this age.