Bob Lazar Worked On Alien Spaceship Reverse Engineering: Lockheed Martin's Senior Scientist

Bob Lazar has always been something of an enigma, and I think that's about as much as anybody knows.

He is still an enigma, and he IS currently working for the government, and not talking about Area 51.
The OP has presented a little piece of information, what it means is not so easy to define, but there seems to be some relationship of some kind with Lockheed's SS.(pardon the acronym)

I see no need for the naysayers jumping down throats on a subject that in truth, nobody really what Lazar is/was all about. George Knapp was about the closest, and he did find some things relating to Lazar in the positive.

And if you buy his book, you will see how Bob Lazar was wrong...

For me is more interesting people reaction and need to prove something being hoax, without trying to see if there is any truth in any of it... Somehow world is not black/white. very gray place... and Bob Lazar might be hoax in one part, but he might also tell partial truth, can't he?

Why after learning of all kinds of monitoring from government I am now getting paranoid that this might be government boys discrediting everyone on their black list...

I'm always surprised by how quickly people will disregard Bob and his story, even in the UFO community. I'm not sure why it happens either.

People are quick to point out that he can't verify his background and refer to Stanton Friedman's comments on Bob, in spite of the fact that Bob Lazar was the first one to say he couldn't verify his background or schooling.
They also tend to disregard the fact that Bob was listed in the newspaper as a physicist working at LANL and that his number was in the phonebook there, and that George Knapp went with Bob into LANL and introduced him to his coworkers there and that he clearly knew his way around and what was going on there.
They're often unfamiliar with the fact that he knew of a location called S-4 that was confirmed to exist by Nellis Air Force Base, as well as the existence of the OFI and one of their agents.
And they ignore that he took many people up on Wednesday nights to see flying saucer test flights at Area 51.

I believe he seen the Sport Model flying saucer... but only from the outside of it. I don't believe he was ever inside of it. And I don't accept his description of it's means of propulsion. My guess is the saucer uses a plasma-torus, like that of the TR-3B Astra triangle ships.

Originally posted by ObservingYou

Originally posted by torsion
Here's Stanton Friedman's take on Lazar.

The Bob Lazar Fraud

Aha Friedmans another 'gatekeeper' - oh the plot thickens!

What is a "gatekeeper"?

Originally posted by wemadetheworld
I want to believe Bob Lazar, he seems like a nice guy, however I find it hard to believe he could work on such highly classified projects, and then go around talking about it without being arrested. Maybe he is being used to spread some disinfo.

As for the element 115, it sounds a bit off to me. Clearly all matter distorts spacetime, giving rise to what we call gravity, and there has been no measured loss of mass due to matter emitting gravitons, so it could be a very simple and low energy process. Simulating gravity might actually be quite easy once you know how.

Furthermore, black holes distort spacetime just like any other lump of matter, well beyond the event horizon of the black hole. Assuming that gravitons are no different to photons, and cannot travel faster than light, then they should not escape the black hole, but clearly they do.

Therefore one can reasonably assume that matter distorts spacetime locally, that gravitons only travel a short distance from the matter to the immediate spacetime, and then spacetime itself propagates that change out to the surrounding spacetime.

With that in mind, what is so special about element 115 ? I assume this atom is comprised of protons and neutrons, just like any other atomic nucleus, so there's nothing special there.

Maybe it's the particular arrangement of protons and neutrons in element 115, with some perfect multi-dimensional geometry, that distorts spacetime considerably more than other atomic nuclei, just because of that particular geometry ??? Most questionable.

If a more advanced race were to impart the secret of gravity, I think it would more likely be a Feynman diagram, rather than a lump of metal, something like:

Lithium nucleus -> Gamma rays at frequency 1234 -> Liberated heavy proton -> Decays to normal proton -> Extra energy forms a graviton

Now that would be a useful formula !

"The Segre Chart" and "The Belt of Stability" and the theoretical "Island of Stability" is what you are looking for. It is a graph mapping out the stability of all atomic isotopes. There are 254 stable elements, but hundreds more which will spontaneously undergo fission.

upload.wikimedia.org...

algebralab.com...

newscenter.lbl.gov...

"Element 114 itself was long thought to lie in the Island of Stability. Traditional models predicted that if an isotope of 114 having 184 neutrons (298_114) could be made, it would be doubly magic, with both its proton and neutron shells filled, and would be expected to have an extended lifetime. The isotopes of 114 made so far have many fewer neutrons, and their half-lives are measured in seconds or fractions of a second. Moreover, modern models predict the proton magic number to be 120 or 126 protons. Therefore, where 298_114 would actually fall inside the region of increased stability is now in question.

“Making 298_114 probably won’t be possible until we build heavy ion accelerators capable of accelerating beams of rare projectile isotopes more intense than any we are likely to achieve in the near future,” says Nitsche. “But in the meantime we can learn much about the nuclear shell model by comparing its theoretical predictions to real observations of the isotopes we can make.”

The team that confirmed element 114 observed nuclei of two isotopes, 286_114 and 287_114, which decayed in a tenth of a second and half a second respectively. In a subsequent collaboration with researchers at the GSI Helmholtz Center for Heavy Ion Research, two more isotopes, 288_114 and 289_114, were made; these decayed in approximately two-thirds of a second and two seconds respectively."

A double-magic atomic nucleus is an atom which has two complete shells of protons and neutrons (the hailstone model). Element 114 would have these and would be resistant to nuclear decay.

reply to post by Damsel

I'm always surprised by how quickly people will disregard Bob and his story, even in the UFO community. I'm not sure why it happens either.

I know exactly why. My family has had lifelong, generational experiences with not only ufo sightings, some tagged by choppers and more exotic surveillance, but "abductions" and contact!

Now, the reason is because:

1. Our science is wrong, bunk, lies, explosive, dirty, scarsity technology, Rockerfeller stuff! Instead, study, Keely's Secret, Walter Russel, Tesla, Electric Universe.

This is what makes short work of it:

And its demonstratable, not just theories, but works in real time. And the humble pistol shrimp, in addition star in a jar, prove the whole thing!


Sonoluminescence - Cavitation - NanoGeometry & The Future of Technology (See Vid Description)

2. There is a massive gateway, doorway, RELIGIONS, and they feed that element, plus the fear based ones, for a reason, we create with our thought and we're here to transmute all negatives in us, and thus around us, to positive, equality, no money, abundance, beauty and raise earth to the next floor and everyone passes the tests here.

Because ET experiences ARE spiritual, but they're NOT religious. Any ET's bearing religions are Evil Doers! They are dark hats.

3. Ufology like religion is a vastly controlled field, and the experiencers speak up, and everyone ignores them and runs with the experts.

I already know who is on the ball, and when I listen to say, Alex Collier, I note, that yes, some of his info, is a bit like it was, seems to connect to some of what I know, however, then he goes on in a video about how white people are inferior and caused by radiation poisoning in the past.

Research Banna and Nazi's to understand how the Brotherhood and Sharia and an attempt to either create WW3, or a massive reset of earth to ancient times is what a very dark fascist group of satanic cartels are attempting here, along with a destroyed earth policy. Ie, the negatives that destroyed Tiamat and Mars are attempting to destroy earth as well.

There are some bad things going on and its up to people to hold equality and love and envision a better world and bring it in. Without fighting.

So Alex Collier switched hats then to being bought off by the Black Op Royal Family agenda for earth.

The problem with the clean tech and Lazar's stuff is it means a different science.

Steven Greer discusses things that mean a different science, and that fly in the face of the religious controls and negative mindset of the controllers here. I couldn't care less about numerous ideas of whether Greer is working for them, doing this or the other thing, HIS INFO IS GOOD, as an experiencer.

I don't judge the way others do, it has to fit into what I know, what is buried in me, and stirs up instantly, and also, what my energy recognition picks up on, for the windows open up and I know the contacts they have watching over. And no can't really explain that, its intuitive recognition.

Whether due to being an experiencer and having energy recognition, the contacts that are around a person, if known to me contact me, ie, I am suddenly in touch with that group. That is how real ETs watching over earth work.

Anyone can have contact! Just ask away, but define positives, and do it with a positive spirit.

The mainstream ufology is a GATEWAY, and like religions they don't want people waking up, getting contact or answers on their own, or free abundant energies.

They especially don't want the majority to realize they've been had, enslaved or lied to, and had so much death of loved ones because of their evil agenda. They're very very afraid that we will rise up and make them pay for what they've done!

edit on 2-7-2013 by Unity_99 because: (no reason given)

Someone involved with UFOs and aliens is selling books about it and making profit?! Stop the presses!

As far as Lazar goes, lots of holes... However I am sure there are holes with every story someone tells. This is most common with liars, but it does happen when people tell the truth from their own accord.

I won't say he's a liar and I won't say he telling the truth. I just can't say either way. If you believe his stories great, if you don't that great too. But don't go bashing on someone because they have differing point of views.

-SAP-

First of all, I believe Bob Lazar. Here is a question to the Ney-Sayers,,,
If Bob was lying about the government, why does his company (United Nuclear) United Nuclear sell to the government? If he was not working at S4, the Government would not buy from him on principle. If he did work there, perhaps he has some nice contracts, and that is why he has been so quiet that last decade. Her is a quote from the FAQ page at UN...

1. Although we sell retail scientific supplies, we are primarily a research & development company that does confidential prototype & Government contract work. Buying from United Nuclear is not like shopping at Walmart or other online companies. Sometimes our Government/contract work must take priority over our retail sales. This means that if we get in a priority Military order, we may have to delay your order and take items from it to fill the Military order. Fortunately, this does not happen often.

Seams like a conspiracy to me...LOL

Do you guys think it might be possible that Lazar was a low level employee at S-4 (perhaps a photo processor), saw a few things he shouldn't have, and decided to embellish his credentials (and probably what exactly he saw at S-4) to make his story more believable/marketable?

This is how I rank theories about Lazar in descending order of believably:

1. He made it up. Well, he wouldn't be the first guy that tried to sell the alternative community a load of BS. I am not aware of any claims that he made that have panned out. A poster said something about him taking people to view UFOs, but it is my understanding that there was a time when it was odd if you visited the Groom Lake vicinity and didn't see a UFO. Obviously, correct my ignorance if I am wrong. (seriously, it is been a long time since I looked at Lazar's story). I wanna say that he got called out on the Art Bell program by another Groom Lake employee regarding mundane details about the base (I clearly remember that it had to do with the cafeteria, which is the last thing you'd invent details for a BS story about aliens and flying saurces, but something you'd obviously know if you'd actually been there) but don't take my word on that. I mean that.

2. He worked there, but not in the capacity he claims. The credentials of someone making a claim mean a lot to most people when deciding if they are telling the truth. I think Lazar is smart enough to know that people would be less skeptical if he invented some credentials for himself. Sounds really stupid in our internet age, but I think it took awhile for him (years?) to be exposed. Under this theory, we can have a situation where he has spilled the beans on some secrets, but since he has already laid the groundwork for his eventually discrediting, TPTB would not find it necessary to suicide him.

3. He is dis-info agent. I am generally very skeptical of claims about shills and dis-info agents. I honestly think that the alternative community generates enough B.S. that TPTB would not need to undertake such actions on a large scale. This is not to say that it doesn't happen, but I don't think it takes place anywhere near as some claim.
(Go to a certain unnamed forum that also traffics in similar content, let's call it DeityLikeEndeavors, make reasonable posts backed by fact and logic, see how long it is before someone says you are a paid NSA/CIA/ZIONIST/whatever shill. You won't have to make many posts, which is great, because that unnamed forum is a good candidate for worst thing on the internet that isn't snuff or child porn.)

Like the last theory, it explains how he got a hold of verifiable information and why he wasn't killed for releasing it.

Given the holes in his story, I'd buy that before I'd buy that...

4. He is telling the straight truth. Other posters have laid out the case for why this is highly unlikely. I simply don't buy that anyone gets to work at S-4 just because they had a random encounter with Edward Teller. If someone can get some evidence that his background is legit (Classmates or professors that remember him, some records proving that he was there, at-least something solid.), this theory obviously gets more believable.

If you are reading this and see flaws in my evidence and thinking point them out. I take the motto of this place seriously, and I'd rather know that I was fool than to be one and not know it.

reply to post by 5pooky


I think you might be engaging in a simple but widespread fallacy: The government is not this unified hive-mind thing that people often imply. That is, it is very possible that the specific government departments he sells to have no idea about his claims regarding S-4, or, even if they did, don't care.

That said, isn't this evidence that Lazar isn't telling the whole truth? You seem to be saying that he was paid off in the form of sweetheart contracts, that doesn't boast his credibility. Also, why would the government do business with a man that screwed them by exposing a terrible secret? Why would he be trusted ever again?

There is something so utterly fascinating about Bob, that I find his stories irresistible.
He's the most believable of them all.... to me, even though I vacillate on whether alien life even visits Earth.

To accept his stories means it follows that you must believe we are visited.

It puts me in quite the tailspin, so I just don't think about it. However, I love reading anything about the man. Apparently I thrive on confusion and ambivalence.

reply to post by UserNameIsREDACTED

Your theories seem fairly well thought out, and by the way....
BAM... popped that star cherry for you!

Originally posted by smurfy
Bob Lazar has always been something of an enigma, and I think that's about as much as anybody knows...

I tend to agree with this.

Surely he has been exposed as being less than credible with regards to certain information, but there is something there, something just below the surface that has me unwilling to totally discount him out of hand all together. Call it intuition if you will, but I believe there is traces of smoke there, and with smoke you get... Well, you know the rest.

Originally posted by gortex
reply to post by awakehuman

 

What is your relationship with ufo-blogger.com ? ...every thread you post in this forum uses that as your source and to be honest most of the stuff there is BS .
Conspiracy or what

Well, I went to this website, "ufo-blogger" and it did not seem that much "BS" as you mentioned earlier. I need to mention that this blog does not contain solely information concerning UFO's. That does not mean by any mean the OP is right ... nor wrong, nor does it prove anything concerning the current debate. But it proves one thing, this website is having many interesting articles and I come to the conclusion that not, and I quote: "most of the stuff there is BS ."

According to " The free dictionary by Ferlex, BS can mean the following:

BS
abbr.
1. Bachelor of Science
2. balance sheet
3. Bible Bar Sirach (Wisdom of Jesus, the Son of Sirach)
4. or B/S bill of sale
5. Vulgar bull#

The free dictonary by Ferlex


I think the fifth definiton is the best to fit in this case and I do not think the website contain mostly vulgar bull# honestly.


Here is an interview found on the website:

www.ufo-blogger.com...

This does not look like bull # to me considering what I saw and heard. It proves this website is far away from being "most of the stuff there is BS ."

I just wanted to make clear that ufo-blogger.com is not mostly made up of bull#, without taking any postion on the Bob Lazar case, in any case that was not already clear.



Thruthseek3r

Originally posted by gortex
reply to post by awakehuman

 

Anyways what you think about Bob Lazar ?

I think Lazar spins a good yarn but the stories he tells are full of holes and he ranks low on the credibility scale .
There is a possibility that he is/was an asset for certain agencies but that's just speculation on my part .

What you just wrote seems to be an "Appeal to authority" which is a fallacy in argumentation

Fallacies in argumentation

Appeal to Authority (or, Appeal to False Authority, or Appeal to Questionable Authority, Argumentum Ad Verecundiam)

Let's face it. Not one person will ever become qualified as an expert in every field of research relevant to Apologetics. A person can spend decades studying only one field alone. Most laypeople will have to rely on experts from time to time to establish a point; even experts in one field of study will appeal to experts in another field. Appealing to an authority to make a point can be an acceptable way to make a point. One must be cautious, however, as no authority is perfect. Authorities have been known to contradict each other, and being an authority doesn't make one infallible. So, it is recommended that one only uses an authority when, for whatever reason, it would be impractical or unnecessary to present the evidence or argument the authority represents. However, if one is responding to another's personal opinion, a professional opinion carries more weight in debate. There are a few different ways to commit an Appeal to

Authority fallacy:

1. When one uses a claim from an person not qualified to comment on the area one is making the argument in. For example: Albert Einstein stated that, "God does not play dice." Therefore, random probability (luck) is in contradiction to God's sovereign plan. The conclusion may be correct (I'm not entirely sure), but the argument is fallacious because Einstein was an expert in science, not theology.

2. Since authority is one of the weakest forms of evidence, one must not over-depend on the strength of an authority. The example above does, using the opinion of an authority as though it were absolute proof ).

3. Another kind of appealing to false authority is to state that something is validated by "many" or "most" of a class of authorities. For instance, one can say, "the majority of scholars think that the historical Jesus was just a really good teacher." However, unless actual authorities are cited, this is a fallacious appeal to unspecified authorities. Most philosophers agree with this (take tongue and plant firmly in cheek).

Thruthseek3r

reply to post by awakehuman


So let me get his straight...

The aliens gave us 500 pounds of element 115, but made us reverse engineer a spaceship? What's wrong with that picture?

reply to post by Bone75


It doesn't sound that crazy,.. it would be like Columbus giving some island natives a bag of gunpowder knowing they just dug up some old cannon,.. and then just leaving...

I've always believed that Lazar's past was erased to discredit everything he said... They took away his degrees, his accomplishments, etc. so the world would believe he was a fraud. I do find it interesting that he (Bob) would tell his good friend John Lear about flight schedules of UFO's at the base and they would go out there to watch them...

Say Bob IS telling the truth, I would believe our Govt. would do EVERYTHING in their power to destroy his word and story...but thats just me

Definitely one of my favorite UFO topics today...