House votes to curb DHS ammunition purchases

I swear the House and Senate aren't even reading from the same book, forget being on the same page or not. The Senate passes a virtual amnesty-come ye government dependent hordes to further bankrupt the country bill, while the House thumbs their nose at the Senate immigration bill and says they will go their own way on another immigration bill. The House also passes something like this! Thank Goodness we have a separation of powers.

Originally posted by Hawksage
no one here seems to have mentioned this but those bullets they were buying were hollow point they arnt used in target practice, They cost more and due to lighter wight of the bullet it is less accurate

You practice how you fight. Military does this all the time.

Note: Not stating that the military uses hollow point, but stating the military uses the same bullet for practice and war.

Seen a few DHS agents...they need all the practice they can get. Regular folk - really, they are just like you and you. Think I can out run them when I'm using crutches.

Originally posted by boncho
When the threads were posted before covering how much the agencies were buying (ammo) some people eluded to death camps, rounding up citizens, martial law, etc, etc, etc.

I saw $$ immediately.

I can't remember the agreed upon number but let's say even 100 Million rounds at a time, times let's say 50 cents a round. That's 50 million.

DHS has 70,000 agents. If each fires 10-15 shots at the range on a weekend, that's easily a million rounds or more every weekend.

Simply regular target practice could eat through a huge amount of ammo.



But let's say the people at the top are friends with contractors providing the ammo. Hmm... That's a lot of money being thrown around.

You don't need some deep dark nefarious conspiracy here... There's just a ____ load of money involved. And that's clear as day.

Link to info.

Do you target practice with hollow points?

Originally posted by ChuckNasty

Originally posted by Hawksage
no one here seems to have mentioned this but those bullets they were buying were hollow point they arnt used in target practice, They cost more and due to lighter wight of the bullet it is less accurate

You practice how you fight. Military does this all the time.

Note: Not stating that the military uses hollow point, but stating the military uses the same bullet for practice and war.

Seen a few DHS agents...they need all the practice they can get. Regular folk - really, they are just like you and you. Think I can out run them when I'm using crutches.

Guess that's why I used rimfire in bootcamp....Come on...if the outcome of a firefight is dependent on the people being trained to use a certain type of bullet.....they are fail. It makes NO difference.

reply to post by fenson76

Do you target practice with hollow points?

Do you give your friend the cheapest ammunition when they give you a gov contract paid by tax dollars?

Democracy at work.

Originally posted by fenson76

Guess that's why I used rimfire in bootcamp....Come on...if the outcome of a firefight is dependent on the people being trained to use a certain type of bullet.....they are fail. It makes NO difference.

That is why the USA has the best trained military. Rimfire for weapon qualifications...sad, very sad. Only know of 22s used in 1911 training back in my grandfather's era. There are special occasions when a flunky would use a cheaper round just to learn the basics of a gun and its operation.

Using a standard pressure, standard weight 115g, ball ammo round is night and day different from using a +P or +P+ 124g hollow point round. (9mm)

I'm pretty sure that the DHS practices with their regular duty round.

Originally posted by ChuckNasty

Originally posted by fenson76

Guess that's why I used rimfire in bootcamp....Come on...if the outcome of a firefight is dependent on the people being trained to use a certain type of bullet.....they are fail. It makes NO difference.

That is why the USA has the best trained military. Rimfire for weapon qualifications...sad, very sad. Only know of 22s used in 1911 training back in my grandfather's era. There are special occasions when a flunky would use a cheaper round just to learn the basics of a gun and its operation.

Using a standard pressure, standard weight 115g, ball ammo round is night and day different from using a +P or +P+ 124g hollow point round. (9mm)

I'm pretty sure that the DHS practices with their regular duty round.

Not sure how you feel about the training has anything to do with the reality of them using rimfire or what I was getting at but, have fun.

Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by fenson76

Do you target practice with hollow points?

 

Do you give your friend the cheapest ammunition when they give you a gov contract paid by tax dollars?

Pistol quals for aircrew were done with the CHEAPEST AMMO AVAILABLE. Why would dhs need anything better? Sorry for stating facts that I witnessed first hand.

reply to post by fenson76

Pistol quals for aircrew were done with the CHEAPEST AMMO AVAILABLE. Why would dhs need anything better? Sorry for stating facts that I witnessed first hand.

And are the same purchasing agents used for the Air Force that are used for DHS? No. My point here is its very possible there is a conspiracy here for ammo purchases. DHS already had one of its leaders outed for their degree obtained by a diploma mill.

Simply because you think every situation is the same when related to government contracts/purchasing, doesn't mean it is.

Originally posted by Hawksage
no one here seems to have mentioned this but those bullets they were buying were hollow point they arnt used in target practice, They cost more and due to lighter wight of the bullet it is less accurate

WOW, I really wish those who do not know what they are talking about would, at least, use an internet search to inform themselves. If you do not know what you are talking about, please quit giving uneducated information.

Hollow points are "grain matched" by practice rounds. A 165 grn. hollow point weighs the same as a 165 grn. flat nose or ball round. The flat nose was in fact developed to simulate hollow points drag coeficient and feeding properties without the expense of an engineered hollow point. Hollow points are the PREMIUM round. They are the most well made using the best propellants and the more acurate od the rounds for handguns. They are by far the most leathal of the rounds giving 90% or more of their kinetic energy to the intended target.

Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by fenson76

Pistol quals for aircrew were done with the CHEAPEST AMMO AVAILABLE. Why would dhs need anything better? Sorry for stating facts that I witnessed first hand.

 

And are the same purchasing agents used for the Air Force that are used for DHS? No. My point here is its very possible there is a conspiracy here for ammo purchases. DHS already had one of its leaders outed for their degree obtained by a diploma mill.

Simply because you think every situation is the same when related to government contracts/purchasing, doesn't mean it is.

Why do you argue against fact? I is now a proven fact that they were indeed purchasing an abnormal amout of leathal ammo not target rounds. there is now a bill past the house to stop them.... How is this even an argument?

reply to post by fenson76


Same reason LEOs do...they aren't bound by NATO Standards. Come to think about it,

We understand your point none-the-less.

Originally posted by ChuckNasty

Originally posted by fenson76

Guess that's why I used rimfire in bootcamp....Come on...if the outcome of a firefight is dependent on the people being trained to use a certain type of bullet.....they are fail. It makes NO difference.

That is why the USA has the best trained military. Rimfire for weapon qualifications...sad, very sad. Only know of 22s used in 1911 training back in my grandfather's era. There are special occasions when a flunky would use a cheaper round just to learn the basics of a gun and its operation.

Using a standard pressure, standard weight 115g, ball ammo round is night and day different from using a +P or +P+ 124g hollow point round. (9mm)

I'm pretty sure that the DHS practices with their regular duty round.

No that is not true. there is a minimal amount of difference to the performance of the round but quite a bit of difference int the wear and tear of the firearm. No responsible firearm user tends to practice with premium rounds. No fiscally sound agency would use premium rounds to practice with. The military does not practice with hollow points.. BECAUSE THEY ARE ILLEGAL FOR THEM TO USE... So a domestic agency is practicing at the expense of the tax payers with premium ammunition using rounds that are banned in the geneva convention... I know of no agency practicing with hollow points. Please give one that does.. Even a PD or Sheriffs department will work.

Originally posted by ChuckNasty

Originally posted by Hawksage
no one here seems to have mentioned this but those bullets they were buying were hollow point they arnt used in target practice, They cost more and due to lighter wight of the bullet it is less accurate

You practice how you fight. Military does this all the time.

Note: Not stating that the military uses hollow point, but stating the military uses the same bullet for practice and war.

Seen a few DHS agents...they need all the practice they can get. Regular folk - really, they are just like you and you. Think I can out run them when I'm using crutches.

Please inform me on the grouping variations between cheaper flatnose target rounds and hollow poimts at 30 yards.. If you cannot then you have no statement.