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Originally posted by Cancerwarrior
Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by johncarter
And, there is no draft. What was going on in this guys head? ’Joining up’ for military service yet not being prepared to kill?
edit on 25-6-2013 by silo13 because: remove bold
Believe it or not most people join the military because they come from nothing. Most people stay in the military even though they may hate it because they feel they have nothing to go back to if they leave the service. I can say this truthfully after having observed it in my 8 years as a Tanker. There is a whole generation of youngsters craving discipline and direction. Every person who signs up to be a solider is told of their purpose, but every recruiter also downplays the reality of what their lives will become. You can't buy a cup of coffee at McDonald's without seeing 10 disclosures of how hot the thing is, but a 17 year old can sign up to be a living weapon for the war machine. And they're easy pickings because they're so often poor, uneducated, young, and easily exploitable. They're not warriors, they're just the next in a long line of weaker humans
Contrary to many opinions spewed on this forum the vast majority of people that enter Army service are not brain washed COD sociopaths that want to play with your blood. I know that my reasons for joining up were the same as I heard from almost all my buddies. I came from an impoverished family. I had only went to high school. The area I lived in had no kind of jobs or schools. I wanted to get married and be able to provide for my wife and I and then go to school after or during service.
Then I put my head down and counted the weeks while enduring two deployments, constant field training, constant stress and worry that comes with being a slave to the flag sucking Army officers. And when it came time to get out I remember being scared as hell. The retention NCO kept offering to get the McDonalds applications ready for me if I left and I remember really doubting myself because I suddenly remembered something that I forgot the whole time I was busy hating the Army. I had nothing to go back to. I ended up closing out that chapter of my life and moving on but I have personally known so many soldiers who did nothing but bitch and moan about the Army and then when their enlistment contract is over they re-up. I never understood why until my time came.
Of course you are gonna have your gung ho types that are born to be soldiers and don't care about what the actual cause of a conflict is for. That's not how a majority of people think though. Its rare that you hear soldiers remark on things like this themselves. See we as civilians have this thing called free speech. Its being dwindled down but for the moment it is still there. If you are in the service and you speak out against certain things you can be prosecuted legally by the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Its much easier to take the path of least resistance and just "suck it up and drive on." Do as you're told mentality.
And until the day comes when you understand the frame of mind of a person who wants to end their life, you will never understand their reasons. I hope that day never comes for you because its a sucky experience. Is it really a wonder for any American that 22 veterans off themselves each day? I guess its easy for an outsider to condemn.
R.I.P. Daniel. I hope you find the peace in death that eluded you in life brother.edit on 25-6-2013 by Cancerwarrior because: (no reason given)
They say - those who commit suicide blaming a single reason - are liars. There are many reasons for suicide - not just one. Someone who commits suicide has many problems other than where they ultimately place the blame.
That being said? Wake up. There’s no draft. What was going on in this guys head? ’Joining up’ for military service yet not being prepared to kill?
"...a regime built upon the idea that suffering is noble and relief is just for the weak."
How dare you presume to pass judgment on that boy.
The problem is, little man, that people only THINK they know what goes on during war.
Unless you have super powers of empathy, most people don't get it at all.
Or, even if they kind of "get it," they don't believe they'll actually end up being sent to kill women and children.
After all, killing women and children is not something the U.S. does (that's been the indoctrination which every child in America has undergone for at least a century. The Americans pass out chocolate and cigarettes and protect women and children). They are the perpetual good guys. Revisionist history tells you that and gawd knows the North Americans know their revisionist history inside out..
So, in actual fact, you and your supporters ain't so smart.
Besides, if passing judgment on the weak is your bent, do by all means, fly at 'er.
But if you have any gumption whatever, then venture forth and unleash your judgment on those who would cajole others into doing their dirty work. Hmmm,last time I heard, they reside at the top of the food chain--ya know, dems with the money, influence and power who would slit your throat as good as look at cha. But they prefer not to get their hands dirtied--only their souls.
Or, something else you could do is get yourself and your supporters out to the recruitment offices so you can paint your pictures of war for the would-be recruiters. Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean, that would, indeed, take courage......and that's not really what you're all about. You're all about calling out others on what you perceive is THEIR cowardice.
Now, the type of response I get or do not get from my post will tell me a good many things that I've wanted to have cleared up since first arriving here. I think just one day will provide me with answers. Thanks for the opportunity.
Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by johncarter
They say - those who commit suicide blaming a single reason - are liars. There are many reasons for suicide - not just one. Someone who commits suicide has many problems other than where they ultimately place the blame.
That being said? Wake up. There’s no draft. What was going on in this guys head? ’Joining up’ for military service yet not being prepared to kill?
I applaud your sentiments OP - and peace to those who lost a friend/family member.
My opinion? If you can’t take the heat - don’t become a cook. Or something like that.
This statement is by far one of the most ludicrous statements I have read in a long time.
Maybe he just wanted money for school, and didn't understand the gravity of what he was getting himself into.
And what do you think.... he could have just walked away if he chose to do so?
He has regained his lost honor.
Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by johncarter
They say - those who commit suicide blaming a single reason - are liars. There are many reasons for suicide - not just one. Someone who commits suicide has many problems other than where they ultimately place the blame.
That being said? Wake up. There’s no draft. What was going on in this guys head? ’Joining up’ for military service yet not being prepared to kill?
I applaud your sentiments OP - and peace to those who lost a friend/family member.
My opinion? If you can’t take the heat - don’t become a cook. Or something like that.
Edit to add:
Here's the point so many of you are failing to get.
How many wars do American's have to experience before they wake the hell up and STOP SIGNING UP!
The government is NOT going to take care of you when you’re through with your service. Not medically - Not psychologically!
You WILL (in many cases) be ordered to kill innocents. WAR is NOT a freaking video game!
No? Tell me a war when these atrocities have not been committed by military? Duh. Can you say Vietnam? Desert Storm? Etc?
Killing civilians. That’s the reality of war. And it’s no secret anymore - Period.
So - what happens? Do these people who sign up just get selective amnesia? ‘Oh, I’ll never be asked to shoot civilians!’ Idiots.
Do I respect the ‘little man’ in the military? Yes, I do. But not when he/she ruins the lives of their loved ones by killing themselves - like they didn’t know war was going to be hell. No no no no. There’s NO WAY people can pretend to be ignorant over the atrocities of war these days. Just no way.
Am I sorry for the guy? Guess what? No, I'm not. I'm sorry the family and friends he left behind.
peace
edit on 25-6-2013 by silo13 because: see above
Originally posted by Dukesy
reply to post by fenson76
What has happened to us all as a country? We attack people that have not attacked us - we ruin their country and culture and bring death and destruction thru it with our new and improved weapons. I am 67 years old and have seen a lot. I served during the Vietnam war (1965 - 1971) - it was another unwanted war - and I believe that is why Kennedy was killed - period.
The country has always had some rogue troops and that will never change. My father served in World War 11 and believe me he would not talk about it. I ask him one time what he did. He told me he was in charge of a tank - it had a flame thrower - and he said do you get the picture -Yep I did and never asked anymore questions. He did also mention that some of the troops there went crazy and did some horrible things and didn't want to think about it.
The point is our country has lost it's moral compass - the serving in this countries military has gotten to be a job for a lot young people that need money and a little recognition by also wearing a uniform. They step into it being proud and having the feeling of accomplishment. Then they get deployed and find out what our government really wants them to do for the industrial greedy bastards that really run this country - reality sets in - suicide rate in the present military climbs to new highs never seen before in this country. And you end up with this poor soldiers note times hundreds.
quote: "If I am elected president I will bring the troops home in 6 months". What a joke on us. I am just over whelmed by the number of you that have forgotten this statement.
He was part of Task Force Lightning, an intelligence unit
where he ran more than 400 combat missions as a machine gunner in the turret of a Humvee, interviewed countless Iraqis ranging from concerned citizens to community leaders and and government officials, and interrogated dozens of insurgents and terrorist suspects
During my first deployment, I was made to participate in things, the enormity of which is hard to describe.
They offer no help, and actively block the pursuit of gaining outside help via their corrupt agents at the DEA. Any blame rests with them.
Is it any wonder then that the latest figures show 22 veterans killing themselves each day?
So you see, not only am I better off dead, but the world is better without me in it
His wife and family have given permission to publish it.
Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by johncarter
Am I sorry for the guy? Guess what? No, I'm not. I'm sorry the family and friends he left behind.
peace
edit on 25-6-2013 by silo13 because: see above