Priests Urge Nancy Pelosi to Condemn Abortion or Leave the Catholic Church

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posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 02:52 PM
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Mods, I did a search and didn’t see this. If it is mis-categorized or duplicated, please remove.


By Vincent Funaro , Christian Post Reporter

June 20, 2013|3:43 pm

A Catholic pro-life group recently issued an open letter where they urged Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) to condemn abortion or leave the Church.

"Public servants are supposed to be able to tell the difference between serving the public and killing the public. Apparently, you can't," wrote the national director of Priests for Life Father Frank Pavone in the letter.

It was written by the organization in response to an argument she had with a reporter from The Weekly Standard who asked her to clarify her position on abortion while discussing the Kermit Gosnell case at a press conference today.

"What is the moral difference between what Dr. Gosnell did to a baby born alive at 23 weeks and aborting her moments before birth," asked the reporter.

Pelosi responded by dismissing the question and made a statement that caught the attention of the pro-life movement.

"What was done in Philadelphia was reprehensible and everybody condemned it. For them to decide to disrespect a judgment a woman makes about her reproductive health is reprehensible," she said. "Next question."

She also addressed her faith and right to privacy after being further pressed by the media.

"As a practicing and respectful Catholic, this is sacred ground to me when we talk about this. I don't think it should have anything to do with politics. And that's where you're taking it and I'm not going there," said Pelosi.

Pavone responded to her statements expressing his dissatisfaction with her as a Catholic and public servant.

"Abortion is not sacred ground; it is sacrilegious ground. To imagine God giving the slightest approval to an act that dismembers a child he created is offensive to both faith and reason," he wrote. "And to say that a question about the difference between legal and medical procedure and murder should not 'have anything to do with politics' reveals a profound failure to understand your own political responsibilities, which start with the duty to secure the God-given right to life of every citizen."

Read more at global.christianpost.com...


Religion, politics and abortion are sensitive and passionate topics here on ATS. This article brings them all together in a nutshell. I’ve got mixed emotions on the stand of the Catholics. Regardless of Pelosi's popularity, she has a right to freedom of religion, but does that include her going against the moral fiber of her religion and still being a member? What right does the church have to ask her to condemn anything and will they be requiring this of all their members? And once again, abortion in politics. I’d like to see some other opinions on this, so what do other members think about this?

Info can also be read here:

news.yahoo.com...
www.huntingnet.com...




posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 02:58 PM
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Are there any words about abortion in the bible? They didn't invented it yet back then.

There are 10 rules and basicly 1 golden rule which covers all rules ''treat others the way you want to be treated''.

I can't remember; ''you shall not abort a pregnancy''.



edit on 24-6-2013 by Plugin because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 02:58 PM
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When it comes to religion people pick and choose what they want to follow in them. These groups need to learn their religion does not say what is law in this nation.



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 03:10 PM
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reply to post by StoutBroux
 


I always thought there was a huge conflict of interest being ‘Christian’ AND ‘pro-Choice’. The two positions simply don’t jive IMO.

I do support the church’s right to exclude Pelosi because her actions go against the teachings of Christianity. I believe the religious leaders have every right to exclude her and to speak out on important issues of the day. The SCOTUS affirmed the protected speech of the church…..


The First Amendment to the United States Constitution protects a church’s right to speak out on the moral issues affecting society. In addition, while the Internal Revenue Code prohibits churches from assessing the qualifications of specific candidates for public office, it does not infringe upon a church’s inherent right to speak out on the morality of specific political issues.

The Supreme Court has unequivocally found that religious speech is at the apex of protected speech under the First Amendment. Capitol Square Review and Advisory Bd. v. Pinette, 515 U.S. 753 (1995).
aclj.org...

On the flip side, I don’t advocate religions or religious leaders effectively strong-arming politicians. In this case the priests don’t seem to be trying to sway Pelosi to vote a certain way or create legislation. They’re simply putting her in her place.



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 03:39 PM
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reply to post by Plugin
 



Originally posted by Plugin
Are there any words about abortion in the bible? They didn't invented it yet back then.


In the Old Testament, Numbers, Chapter 5 instructs priests on abortion in the case of a jealous husband, believing, without proof, that his wife has cheated on him.

A Good Biblical Reason for Abortion

reply to post by seabag
 





On the flip side, I don’t advocate religions or religious leaders effectively strong-arming politicians. In this case the priests don’t seem to be trying to sway Pelosi to vote a certain way or create legislation. They’re simply putting her in her place.


What place is that?



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 03:43 PM
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This one baffles me. Not because the issues are complex or difficult, but because this action is seen as controversial at all.

Compare the Church to a sports team. Anyone can join and help in any way they can, but the team has long-standing rules. Perhaps one of them is to attend practice with full gear. A player may show up without gear now and then. The result is the coach may have a word with him, get him back on the straight and narrow. If the player forgets frequently, there may be some punishment, maybe a fine or being benched for a game or two.

But when a player fails to bring equipment practice after practice, makes press announcements that she will not follow the team rules, shows up to give speeches to anti-equipment groups, it's time for the Coach to say "You're off the team. When you get your act straightened out on this equipment issue, you can come back."

I don't see any problem or anything objectionable. Does anybody?



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 03:49 PM
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Originally posted by buster2010
When it comes to religion people pick and choose what they want to follow in them. These groups need to learn their religion does not say what is law in this nation.


True, seems people fit religion to their likes and dislikes. Maybe that's why there're so many churches to accommodate all the quirky people. Do you think they have the right to tell her what to believe or denounce an action or else face dis-fellowship? It seems like a double standard unless a) everyone else is bade to comply and b) priests set the bar a little higher on themselves. I have heard members claiming non-practicing, but that's apathetic to the belief. Considering religion isn't forced, members can like it or lump it. I'm not Catholic so I could be misunderstanding where they're coming from but they're not saying it's illegal, at least I didn't get that.



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 03:50 PM
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Originally posted by Plugin
Are there any words about abortion in the bible? They didn't invented it yet back then.

There are 10 rules and basicly 1 golden rule which covers all rules ''treat others the way you want to be treated''.

I can't remember; ''you shall not abort a pregnancy''.
How about "Thou Shalt Not Kill".



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 03:52 PM
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Originally posted by windword
reply to post by Plugin
 



Originally posted by Plugin
Are there any words about abortion in the bible? They didn't invented it yet back then.


In the Old Testament, Numbers, Chapter 5 instructs priests on abortion in the case of a jealous husband, believing, without proof, that his wife has cheated on him.

A Good Biblical Reason for Abortion

reply to post by seabag
 





On the flip side, I don’t advocate religions or religious leaders effectively strong-arming politicians. In this case the priests don’t seem to be trying to sway Pelosi to vote a certain way or create legislation. They’re simply putting her in her place.


What place is that?


Hadn't heard that, off to research some more.



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:00 PM
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reply to post by charles1952
 


Hi Charles,

I know that we disagree on this topic. However, Ms. Pelosi isn't hired by the Catholic Church to represent their doctrine, she's hired by her constituents to represent their interests and to uphold the law as it applies to legislation. Right now the Supreme Court has deemed abortion is legal and is a private decision between a woman and her doctor, and most of her constituents want to keep that way.

Is the Catholic Church prepared to "discipline" all their members who have had abortions or who use birth control? Or are they just after the outspoken Catholics who openly advocate birth control and want to keep abortion affordable, accessible and safe?




edit on 24-6-2013 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:03 PM
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reply to post by charles1952
 


It's baffling me too. From what I read, 27%-28% of women who have abortions are Catholic. But are the Priests thinking if Pelosi denounces it the numbers will decrease? Are they giving forgiveness to actions of some but punishing another who isn't openly denouncing those actions? I won't say it doesn't sound fair because it's not my private club, but if a high up mucky muck came into my local pub and told a partaking supervisor in his company there to denounce drinking alcohol or be fired while giving bonuses to the rest of the employees having drinks, isn't that off?



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:07 PM
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Originally posted by windword
reply to post by charles1952
 


Hi Charles,

I know that we disagree on this topic. However, Ms. Pelosi isn't hired by the Catholic Church to represent their doctrine, she's hired by her constituents to represent their interests and to uphold the law as it applies to legislation. Right now the Supreme Court has deemed abortion is legal and is a private decision between a woman and her doctor, and most of her constituents want to keep that way.

Is the Catholic prepared to "discipline" all their members who have had abortions or who use birth control? Or are they just after the outspoken Catholics who openly advocate birth control and want to keep abortion affordable, accessible and safe?



Thanks Windword, that's what I was trying to say. It 's hypocritical and correctly so, she doesn't work for the Church.



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:19 PM
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When is the Catholic Church going to give the boot to the over half of Catholic women who not only believe in birth control but use it regularly? I'm actually pretty sick of the high-and-mighty attitude of the Catholic Church. And this is ONE PRIEST speaking for a pro-life group... It's none of their business what Pelosi thinks about abortion.

I think the church needs to be put in ITS place...



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:25 PM
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reply to post by windword
 

Dear windword,

I was wondering when I'd get a chance to talk to you again. One of the Administrators said that summer was the silly season here, and I was having a hard time finding a decent conversation. You may be surprised that I agree with you quite a bit here.


I know that we disagree on this topic. However, Ms. Pelosi isn't hired by the Catholic Church to represent their doctrine, she's hired by her constituents to represent their interests and to uphold the law as it applies to legislation. Right now the Supreme Court has deemed abortion is legal and is a private decision between a woman and her doctor, and most of her constituents want to keep that way.
Absolutely agree with you. Except maybe for the impression created that she has to vote the way her constituents want. If that were true, we wouldn't have Obamacare (or other goofy programs). But basically, you're absolutely right.


Is the Catholic prepared to "discipline" all their members who have had abortions or who use birth control?
Or are they just after the outspoken Catholics who openly advocate birth control and want to keep abortion affordable, accessible and safe?

We've got two different issues here, as I tried to point out in my sports analogy. How does a priest know for certain if a member is using contraceptives or has had an abortion? He doesn't, unless the woman tells him. At that point it becomes a private matter between the priest and the woman involved. We don't know, and I don't want to know, what "discipline" or guidance is used.

Pelosi has that problem and a couple of others. Remember, she can vote however she wants, the Church doesn't object to that by itself (Well, it does, but I'm trying to keep this simple). It does object to some one taking Pelosi's position AND claiming to be a perfectly good Catholic. Any group has the right to decide who it's members are. Without going into technicalities, Pelosi's efforts to make abortion easier, and more acceptable, PLUS her nationally broadcast statements that one can support abortion and still be a good and loyal Catholic, may get her kicked off the team.

She could fix it by saying "I see that my views aren't held by the Catholic Church, therefore I am announcing my conversion to XYZ religion." Problem solved.

With respect,
Charles1952



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:25 PM
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The problem here is this group isn't Her own Parrish's priests who are asking this, and it isn't The Dope.. er.. typo sorry.. The Pope himself so she can safely ignore these requests unless the media majorly bombards her with it enough to make her life uncomfortable.

Haven't Americans had enough of this "woman" over the years? I'm glad someone.. anyone is putting pressure on her.



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:30 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by Plugin
Are there any words about abortion in the bible? They didn't invented it yet back then.

There are 10 rules and basicly 1 golden rule which covers all rules ''treat others the way you want to be treated''.

I can't remember; ''you shall not abort a pregnancy''.
How about "Thou Shalt Not Kill".


With all the miscarriages that happen every day maybe someone should remind God of that.



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:41 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 

Dear Benevolent Heretic,

I'm not sure that I can see your position as one which can be consistently held.

It's none of their business what Pelosi thinks about abortion.

Translate this into some other group. Perhaps the Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation (GLAAD). What should we say when one of the most famous members in the group starts saying that the Nazis had the right idea when they imprisoned homosexuals? Or perhaps that homosexuals should find some open space in Africa and all move there? Or called for genetic research into curing homosexuals of their condition?

Do you still say that it's none of GLAAD's business what this prominent GLAAD member publicly broadcasts about homosexuals? If you are honest, you will say that that person should be fired as non-representative of the group and the remarks would be strongly condemned.

Isn't that what's going on with Pelosi?

With respect,
Charles1952



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:46 PM
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reply to post by charles1952
 



Originally posted by charles1952
If you are honest, you will say that that person should be fired as non-representative of the group


If this pro-life group had hired her, then yes, she should be fired. But her religion is between her and her God. And this group is being hypocritical by calling on her to leave the church when they have nothing to say about the thousands of Catholic women who use birth control and have abortions.

You have a U2U from me.
edit on 6/24/2013 by Benevolent Heretic because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 04:52 PM
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reply to post by StoutBroux
 


I hate to nitpick, but the subject of abortion is inherently political, and since it's politicized, it is also a religious issue (it takes proponents and opponents to make something political). So it was a bit hackneyed to say the article brought all these issues together, as if we discussion of abortion didn't always include political and religious arguments.

I find it incredibly difficult to like Nancy Pelosi. There are certain politicians that annoy me, but Nancy Pelosi rankles me like no other. From her ugly plasticized face to her haughty demeanor and holier than thou pronouncements; but worse is when she treats her audience as stupid.

She knows what politics means. Any intelligent person knows what politics means: it's the intellectual place where we debate issues. I mean, of course this is a political issue. Her attempt to brush it aside with asinine rhetoric like "this is a medical issue, it should have nothing to do with politics". First, only in rare cases can we categorize abortion as being a bonefide medical question. In all other cases, it's down out of convenience. The (political) issue is: should it be done.

I'm not gonna interject my opinion here, but only hope that Catholics continue to harass this two faced doll and take away her cake. She cannot both eat it and keep it. She cannot pretty much ignore official views of the Church she pays (purportedly) allegiance to, and retain her status as a Catholic.

I'm not a Catholic. I just hate hypocrites. You can be a Christian Nancy: become a Unitarian, or Presbyterian - there are plenty of denominations which align with your personal views.



posted on Jun, 24 2013 @ 05:14 PM
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reply to post by windword
 




What place is that?


Hypocrite-ville!!


....Where all old politicians go eventually (Dems typically spend their entire career there)!





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