Science and the Conscious Force that is in all

This goes back to the argument of panpsychism vs. materialism. Basically, I believe the universe is conscious and this is either conscious energy or a fundamental force of consciousness.

Materialism is basically a belief system. It sets an arbitrary line between life and non life. There' isn't any evidence that this line exists. Materialist believe in this imaginary line because they believe consciousness is an emergent property.

Again, this isn't scientific and it isn't based on anything except belief. Materialist belief that blind processes produced life from non life but there isn't any evidence that this non life exist.

Everything is conscious. It's just consciousness is expressed differently based on the form it's expressed through. This consciousness is expressed through more complex forms like humans and simpler forms like a tree.

This consciousness can be seen as will and intent. It allows for things like the recall of specific memories and knowing the difference between which memory your going to recall. Conscious is specific and it activates the brain to do things like move your arm or have a thought.

This conscious force has to be directed to specific regions of the brain to activate those regions before a self conscious experience occurs. The reason this consciousness experiences self consciousness in the human body is because of the complexity of the brain but the brain is still subject to the will and intent of this conscious force.

In a kind of spooky experiment, scientists at the Max Planck Institute for Human Cognitive and Brain Sciences reveal that our decisions are made seconds before we become aware of them.

In the study, participants could freely decide if they wanted to press a button with their right or left hand.

The only condition was that they had to remember when they made the decision to either use their right hand or left hand.

Using fMRI, researchers would scan the brains of the participants while all of this was going on in order to find out if they could in fact predict which hand the participants would use BEFORE they were consciously aware of the decision.

By monitoring the micro patterns of activity in the frontopolar cortex, the researchers could predict which hand the participant would choose 7 SECONDS before the participant was aware of the decision.

“Your decisions are strongly prepared by brain activity. By the time consciousness kicks in, most of the work has already been done,” said study co-author John-Dylan Haynes, a Max Planck Institute neuroscientist.

I don’t even know where to begin here! I know from the hypnosis research that the unconscious pretty much controls everything and that consciousness is extremely limited.

But, I do find it a bit disconcerting that decisions are made by unconscious me 7 seconds before conscious me…

exploringthemind.com...

Again, this conscious force has to activate this brain activity before it becomes a self conscious act or decision. We see this in the tree. The consciousness of the tree is just in simpler form but we can still see will and intent. We see it when the tree grows branches and leaves and those leaves fall off. This is consciousness being expressed through a form that's simpler than the human brain.

All things are conscious and this one consciousness is expressed through different forms. The tree could grow without this will and intent just like the arm couldn't move or the legs couldn't run without this will and intent.

This is what science shows. Certain regions of the brain are activated by will and intent to produce a specific result. I just sat here and went through 5 different memories back to back. They range from going to see Superman when I was younger to being in the Army. The reason I can recall these specific memories at will and I know the difference between these memories is because the conscious force that is in everything and can be seen through specific will and intent.

Nice post. I think it's about time we see that materialism is foolish, and can really only lead to misery. Not to mention there is no proof whatsoever of emergent consciousness, and worlds of proof for an imminent conscious force.

When it comes to the fields of Psychology and Psychiatry, Materialism literally cannot hold water. Case in point the end of the application of Materialist models such as Behaviorism in psychiatric facilities world wide.

Back in the 1950's Behaviorism was the primary model applied and if you research the history it was a disaster.

Facilities such as Willowbrook in Staten Island New York were investigated. With that discovery and subsequent investigations? by the 70's no such facilities, run by any government in the world applied Materialist models to treating psychiatric patients.

The last private facility to employ such models was closed in disgrace due to its practices. A case in point being a child with a mental disorder that was electro-shocked 3 times a day for a week prior to a scheduled weekend home visit.

Any thoughts?

By monitoring the micro patterns of activity in the frontopolar cortex, the researchers could predict which hand the participant would choose 7 SECONDS before the participant was aware of the decision.

reply to post by neoholographic


I watched something of this in a documentary, and my question is: what happens in the brain when we are presented with a sudden need to act within a second or two, instead of seven seconds? A spoon falls off the table and we catch it in less than a second. We couldn't have known the spoon would fall 7 seconds before it happened.

Originally posted by jiggerj
I watched something of this in a documentary, and my question is: what happens in the brain when we are presented with a sudden need to act within a second or two, instead of seven seconds? A spoon falls off the table and we catch it in less than a second. We couldn't have known the spoon would fall 7 seconds before it happened.

Well we're talking about consciousness here, so maybe time really isn't that important. Something to think about.

Consciousness is energy, and energy is material.

Energy = Matter (Material)

Material (Matter) = Energy


Consciousness = Energy = Matter.

All is materialism and all is spiritual. Why the need to separate and demonize?

Originally posted by jiggerj

A spoon falls off the table and we catch it in less than a second. We couldn't have known the spoon would fall 7 seconds before it happened.

When we respond to an unexpected event such as described above, our actions tend to rely more on unconscious processes rather than deliberate decisions. The time delay is reduced as a result, as we are not using up valuable time in the conscious decision-making deliberation on whether to catch the spoon or not.

Originally posted by jiggerj

By monitoring the micro patterns of activity in the frontopolar cortex, the researchers could predict which hand the participant would choose 7 SECONDS before the participant was aware of the decision.

reply to post by neoholographic

 

I watched something of this in a documentary, and my question is: what happens in the brain when we are presented with a sudden need to act within a second or two, instead of seven seconds? A spoon falls off the table and we catch it in less than a second. We couldn't have known the spoon would fall 7 seconds before it happened.

Are you familiar with the collective unconscious?

So again why would you feel that way?

7 seconds prior to an event occurring means just about anything and that is why it is considered Spooky....

Any thoughts?

Kashai, your avatar is mesmerizing. I could stare at it forever.

I agree with the OP, the idea of a material universe in which everything is made of hard matter is ludicrous given what we have learned about the universe.

"Living" bodies are made of cells, the basic organic units, very complex structures of "non-living" atoms. How can this be? How can you put a bunch of non-living things together in a specific arrangement and make them suddenly become alive? We say it's the result of chemical processes; "non-living" atoms have these sort of programmed interactions with each other. Atoms are moving around on their own, linking up and breaking apart, forming into organic compounds that work together in a cell as a sort of engine that drives itself and sustains itself and even replicates itself from these interactions of atoms. And all these actions of atoms are guided by this amazing organic compound known as DNA. DNA is basically the organizing force in all organic life.

Even outside of living cells, atoms are amazing. Each type of atoms (elements) has wildly different properties just based on the number of protons, neutrons or electrons it contains. The interactions between atoms are mainly electron exchanges, they use electrons to link together by passing them back and forth to each other. Its incredible. You can break down these subatomic particles into elementary particles: quarks, leptons, bosons, and the interactions between those are even more bizarre. Protons and neutrons aren't hard or solid in any sense, they're constantly trading particles with their neighbors, that's what holds them together as an atom.

The strangest thing is we don't even know what these things ARE! Sure we have names for them and we've figured out what they do, but what do they look like, what are they MADE of? We can't even look at these things because they're so small that the wave/particle which is used for visual information (the photon) can't be bounced off of them!

Furthermore, nothing in this universe ever really touches anything else. You can put your hand on the desk, and it looks like you're touching it, feels like you're touching it, but what's really happening? The particles in the desk and your hand are throwing off waves of "force carriers", which interact with other particles to sort of push them around at a distance. When your hand is getting "hit" with so many force carriers that it can't move any closer, the skin and flesh of your hand sort of squashes as innumerable force carrier interactions occur inside your hand.

So what is a particle? They're too small and abstract to even be considered a form of material. At best they're bits of information. We name these particles and pretend that they're tiny hard objects like marbles to make it easier to wrap our heads around them.

In spiritual circles we often refer to things in terms of vibration rather than particles, and in some sense it fits. Everything at the quantum level is in perpetual motion. The question then: what is doing the vibrating? It's the fabric of the universe itself. We're living in an invisible energy grid, a field which carries all these information packets, which are themselves vibrations of the field, like a wave in the ocean.

So how do we get from a vibrating universal energy field to a universal intelligence? I say, retrace our steps.

If this universal field was an unintelligent machine, what would stop it from simply being a wiggly-jiggly mass of nonsensical information? No, this thing knew what it was doing. It somehow knew that combining groups of tiny information packets would form material objects with different properties, that these material objects could be combined to form self-replicating biological machines, and that these biological machines would eventually develop senses to process information.

It just makes way more sense to me that this was intended, rather than a series of accidents...

"Whoops, I accidentally made atoms from all these little energy pulses...oh no they're pulling together and turning into giant flaming fusion reactors...whoops I just made DNA...oh great I accidentally made a completely stable reality full of sentient beings"

Originally posted by arpgme
Consciousness is energy, and energy is material.

Energy = Matter (Material)

Material (Matter) = Energy


Consciousness = Energy = Matter.

All is materialism and all is spiritual. Why the need to separate and demonize?

I disagree. Consciousness is not energy. What would you think came first: consciousness to create energy, or energy to create consciousness?

reply to post by jiggerj


Consciousness or energy which structures the universe. 'Energy' is just a codeword for that immaterial somethingness. Consciousness is that immaterial somethingness (or nothingness)

reply to post by neoholographic

In the first few paragraphs you make an assumption that materialists draw a line between consciousness and material universe. This is where you argument fumbled, as I see it. See, materialism should draw no clear line. In fact, to say that consciousness discretely emerges from the non-conscious is to say there's a form of substance dualism. This is actually opposite of the idea of materialism. I would think that somebody who thinks it emerges into being are the kinds of peoplee who're more likely to believe in substance dualism. From my perspective, consciousness always existed in one form or another. It's only when it reaches a certain phase that we become aware of it. I believe that in the future we will identify properties of matter that link it to the properties of consciousness and that, while the distinction will still exist between them, it will greatly blur.

I've written several posts about this in the past. I don't feel like combing through them. I'll try to sum it up in as few words as possible by making an analogy. Basically, assume a rock has a very small consciousness field around it. The rock DOES respond to things around it, but since its field of awareness is so small, it usually only responds in the last moments when it's struck by something. A life-form such as an animal, by contrast, has a larger consciousness field. Because its field is larger, it responds sooner to outside acting influences. So rather than waiting until it's struck to respond, the animal might respond before it's struck and may even avoid being struck altogether.

I include this very brief, schematic summary of the history of materialist philosophy for two reasons:

1.it is not possible to understand the objective idealism in Hegel's philosophy without following to some extent the problems with which materialism was wrestling in the period leading up to Hegel, and

2.the understanding of this history is thus also necessary in order to understand how to approach Hegel's Logic as a materialist.

As remarked above, the essence of philosophy is the relation between being and consciousness. In what follows, I have attempted to highlight the contradictions manifested in the development of this essence. Hegel's philosophy thus arises as the synthesis of these contradictions, itself a concrete Notion, expressing the history of its genesis in the history of Western philosophy up to his time.

Such a scientific view of human history and society is only possible on the basis of an exhaustive study of all facets of human life, a consistent search for the roots of social, political and ideological change in the conditions of material life, and a ruthlessly critical, dialectical and consciously historical and creative handling of concepts.

A Very Brief History of Materialism



Any thoughts?

reply to post by jiggerj

Originally posted by jiggerj
I disagree. Consciousness is not energy.

If everything is energy, how can Consciousness not be energy?

Originally posted by jiggerj
What would you think came first: consciousness to create energy, or energy to create consciousness?

Since consciousness IS energy, both and neither (if we are looking at the bigger picture that everything is energy).

Matter is Energy (E=mc2) from a perspective.

Any thoughts?

reply to post by arpgme

If everything is energy, how can Consciousness not be energy?

Energy is used to create everything. A lawnmower is made of energy. Is a lawnmower conscious? Energy is used to create consciousness, as in the brain that produces consciousness.

Originally posted by Kashai
Matter is Energy (E=mc2) from a perspective.

Any thoughts?

Only that consciousness is not in that equation.

Originally posted by jiggerj

Energy is used to create everything. A lawnmower is made of energy. Is a lawnmower conscious?

That question is not relevant because any answer to it would just be an assumption.

Energy is used to create consciousness, as in the brain that produces consciousness.

Says who?

Originally posted by HarryTZ

Energy is used to create consciousness, as in the brain that produces consciousness.

Says who?

Ummmm, me? lol

If energy isn't used to create consciousness, what IS used to create it? And please don't tell me that consciousness always existed.

reply to post by jiggerj


If you don't want to hear one of the possibilities than you cannot possibly accept the truth, whether it is that "consciousness has always existed" or something completely different. You have to be open to any answer that is given to you. At this point, the metaphysics aren't even important. It's the internal process in which you view the metaphysics (and everything else).