Tracking Your Every Move - in your own home: invation of privacy? What say you?

So you have the fastest WiFI in block, great! You boast to your friends that you can upload/download at lightning speed, great! You can access it everywhere in your house even at a distance, great!

Great indeed, 'xept that NOW I can tract your EVERY MOVE and EVEN your every gesture without me even getting inside your house. Good thing is, I'm not the PTB. But what about the PTB? Can they do this? Is it a violation of your privacy if they do it?

What say you?

As far as the tech is concern - IT'S ALREADY HERE! In fact unknowingly you've probably been participating in the program for a while now.

A team of electrical engineers has published a paper demonstrating how a passive radar system can see through walls by reading Wi-Fi radio waves. The method is similar to how radio waves are used to detect moving objects. When a radio wave reflects off of a moving object its frequency changes -- this is known as the Doppler effect. By applying this theory to Wi-Fi radio signals, University College London engineers Karl Woodbridge and Kevin Chetty have come up with a handy way of finding out what's going on behind closed doors in urban environments, where nearly all homes and businesses have a Wi-Fi router setup and constantly emitting 2.4GHz or 5GHz radio waves. The pair tested the efficacy of the theory by monitoring people inside a building using a 2.4-GHz passive multistatic receiver and a computer, to process the signals. The receiver has two antennae -- one that tracks the base radio signal in a given area where a router or access point is setup, and one that detects the reflected radio waves emitting a new frequency. By processing the data from both antennae, the system was able to accurately pinpoint where the people were through a 30.5cm-thick wall, what direction they were moving in and their speed. As a rule of thumb, the Wi-Fi radio wave frequency will increase when an individual moves towards a router, and decrease as they move away from it. The radar itself does not emit any signal and thus cannot be detected, making it ideal for spying or military operations...

www.wired.co.uk...

There 's even one now that's going to be marketed for public use - will you be my willing participant?

Wi-Fi signals enable gesture recognition throughout entire home By Michelle Ma News and Information Posted under: Engineering, News Releases, Research, Technology Forget to turn off the lights before leaving the apartment? No problem. Just raise your hand, finger-swipe the air, and your lights will power down. Want to change the song playing on your music system in the other room? Move your hand to the right and flip through the songs. A hand gesture changes the TV channel. U of Washington A hand gesture changes the TV channel using WiSee technology. University of Washington computer scientists have developed gesture-recognition technology that brings this a step closer to reality. Researchers have shown it’s possible to leverage Wi-Fi signals around us to detect specific movements without needing sensors on the human body or cameras. By using an adapted Wi-Fi router and a few wireless devices in the living room, users could control their electronics and household appliances from any room in the home with a simple gesture.

www.washington.edu...

Hey, you can even do it with a game console!!

The Wi-Fi in your home can track your moves like Xbox Kinect Devin Coldewey NBC News Facebook Twitter LinkedIn GooglePlus Email June 4, 2013 at 6:25 PM ET WiSee, a low-cost Wi-Fi-based technology. YouTube / WiSee Gestures made in mid-air are tracked by WiSee, a low-cost Wi-Fi-based technology. Want to switch off the living room lights from bed, change channels while washing dishes, or turn the heat up from the couch? A team at the University of Washington has rigged a standard Wi-Fi home network to detect your movements anywhere in the home and convert them into commands to control connected devices. Gesture recognition is the latest fad in games and tech, but even the newest systems require high-tech depth-sensing cameras or other special hardware. Microsoft's new Kinect, for instance, uses a photon-measuring method called "time of flight" sensing that was, until the Kinect was announced, limited to high-tech laboratories. And Kinect isn't small, either.

www.washington.edu...


So ... you think you have the fastest WiFi connection? Think again.

It's a brave New World...

peace!

Well, I'm doing my part.

I try to be as boring as possible, so as to put the entire staff of the NSA to sleep or perhaps encourage them to kill themselves out of extreme, unremitting boredom.

I want to know how they take into consideration multi path signal bounce.

Is it bad that it comes as no surprise, and at this point have nothing more to say on the spying aspect. Im more interested in the technological aspects.

Errm i mean this
Link

Originally posted by signalfire
Well, I'm doing my part.

I try to be as boring as possible, so as to put the entire staff of the NSA to sleep or perhaps encourage them to kill themselves out of extreme, unremitting boredom.

Big Bro Watching ...watch out!

So what's next?

Originally posted by shaneslaughta
I want to know how they take into consideration multi path signal bounce.


Errm i mean this
Link

edit on 21-6-2013 by shaneslaughta because: (no reason given)

Well, here's how they do it.

According to the team, a number of things can be done to improve the device -- including using a Clean algorithm to rid the readings of interference -- so that it is sensitive enough to read the movements a person's ribcage makes while breathing. In this way, they can also deduce whether a person is standing or sitting.

www.wired.co.uk...

reply to post by edmc^2


Way to simple an explanation for me. I need to see the actual formula used to factor the time latency because of the indirect path and distance. 2.4-5.8 ghz is absorbed easily so it perplexes me.

I just need to learn this tech from the ground up.

I'm not sure what you want done about this or why any of it should be surprising to anyone.
If you want to be the secure from the tracking of the bad IlluminatedNSAHAARPMasons then live off the grid.
If you don't care then enjoy wifi and the internet.

Additionally just because something can happen doesn't mean it is happening. I'll give you a real world example.

The MDM (mobile device management) system we use gives the ability to use the GPS tracking on a phone to locate where that phone is in case it is lost or to remote wipe it. Switching off the GPS disables the phone based policy from that MDM which prevents it from receiving company email or sensitive information. This all makes total and logical sense but various people saw it as "big brother tracking them". The catch is that while GPS tracking is always enabled actually viewing that information or acting on it is disabled\locked down until the proper steps are taken. The few people that were convinced this was still draconian and 1984 refused to allow that policy so they were refused the ability to receive work based email on those devices. In the end that need won out and they accepted it. When one of those people lost their phone and we were able to track it down and then remotely wipe it they saw the value of that tech.

You can't have it both ways. You can't want the convenience, security and fun of wireless communication , be it voice\data, without the tracking and location abilities inherent to that technology. I view game consoles the same way. No one makes anyone buy a system and use their tracking tech but if you want to buy it then you know what you are getting into.

reply to post by edmc^2


Van Eck Phreaking has been around for Years as well as the ability to watch YOU through your television.

Technology just makes this kind of stuff allot easier. Now they can tap into your web cam and turn it on without your knowledge. Just like the ability to turn on your cell phone speaker without detection.

Those barriers were surpassed years ago.

It is just very funny to me that people are just now becoming concerned about these things AFTER someone finally confirms we have been violated.

Come on people. . get with it. .. your thought processes are Outdated.

Originally posted by opethPA
I'm not sure what you want done about this or why any of it should be surprising to anyone.
If you want to be the secure from the tracking of the bad IlluminatedNSAHAARPMasons then live off the grid.
If you don't care then enjoy wifi and the internet.

Additionally just because something can happen doesn't mean it is happening. I'll give you a real world example.

The MDM (mobile device management) system we use gives the ability to use the GPS tracking on a phone to locate where that phone is in case it is lost or to remote wipe it. Switching off the GPS disables the phone based policy from that MDM which prevents it from receiving company email or sensitive information. This all makes total and logical sense but various people saw it as "big brother tracking them". The catch is that while GPS tracking is always enabled actually viewing that information or acting on it is disabled\locked down until the proper steps are taken. The few people that were convinced this was still draconian and 1984 refused to allow that policy so they were refused the ability to receive work based email on those devices. In the end that need won out and they accepted it. When one of those people lost their phone and we were able to track it down and then remotely wipe it they saw the value of that tech.

You can't have it both ways. You can't want the convenience, security and fun of wireless communication , be it voice\data, without the tracking and location abilities inherent to that technology. I view game consoles the same way. No one makes anyone buy a system and use their tracking tech but if you want to buy it then you know what you are getting into.

So I guess what your saying is - it's not a violation of privacy if they tract your every move since by default you agreed to purchase the product.

Originally posted by ShadellacZumbrum
reply to post by edmc^2

 

Van Eck Phreaking has been around for Years as well as the ability to watch YOU through your television.

Technology just makes this kind of stuff allot easier. Now they can tap into your web cam and turn it on without your knowledge. Just like the ability to turn on your cell phone speaker without detection.

Those barriers were surpassed years ago.

It is just very funny to me that people are just now becoming concerned about these things AFTER someone finally confirms we have been violated.

Come on people. . get with it. .. your thought processes are Outdated.

Unfortunately, not many people are aware of this. So I guess, all is well.

Originally posted by edmc^2

Originally posted by opethPA
I'm not sure what you want done about this or why any of it should be surprising to anyone.
If you want to be the secure from the tracking of the bad IlluminatedNSAHAARPMasons then live off the grid.
If you don't care then enjoy wifi and the internet.

Additionally just because something can happen doesn't mean it is happening. I'll give you a real world example.

The MDM (mobile device management) system we use gives the ability to use the GPS tracking on a phone to locate where that phone is in case it is lost or to remote wipe it. Switching off the GPS disables the phone based policy from that MDM which prevents it from receiving company email or sensitive information. This all makes total and logical sense but various people saw it as "big brother tracking them". The catch is that while GPS tracking is always enabled actually viewing that information or acting on it is disabled\locked down until the proper steps are taken. The few people that were convinced this was still draconian and 1984 refused to allow that policy so they were refused the ability to receive work based email on those devices. In the end that need won out and they accepted it. When one of those people lost their phone and we were able to track it down and then remotely wipe it they saw the value of that tech.

You can't have it both ways. You can't want the convenience, security and fun of wireless communication , be it voice\data, without the tracking and location abilities inherent to that technology. I view game consoles the same way. No one makes anyone buy a system and use their tracking tech but if you want to buy it then you know what you are getting into.

So I guess what your saying is - it's not a violation of privacy if they tract your every move since by default you agreed to purchase the product.

In the scenario I gave the company phone is paid 100%. I can choose not to have a company phone which eliminates the ability for them to have 24/7 tracking enabled but I also lose the ability to receive work related email. Given my current job this is not an option so I accept the phone. In my opinion the fact that the ability to track is there should not bother people but rather the inappropriate use of that tracking is what should bother people.

this method is only good if your wifi is on.I never use mine so who cares.I keep it off and never turn it on.And if your not doing anything against the law,what does it matter.Do not expect it to get better,it wont.

Originally posted by opethPA

Originally posted by edmc^2

Originally posted by opethPA
I'm not sure what you want done about this or why any of it should be surprising to anyone.
If you want to be the secure from the tracking of the bad IlluminatedNSAHAARPMasons then live off the grid.
If you don't care then enjoy wifi and the internet.

Additionally just because something can happen doesn't mean it is happening. I'll give you a real world example.

The MDM (mobile device management) system we use gives the ability to use the GPS tracking on a phone to locate where that phone is in case it is lost or to remote wipe it. Switching off the GPS disables the phone based policy from that MDM which prevents it from receiving company email or sensitive information. This all makes total and logical sense but various people saw it as "big brother tracking them". The catch is that while GPS tracking is always enabled actually viewing that information or acting on it is disabled\locked down until the proper steps are taken. The few people that were convinced this was still draconian and 1984 refused to allow that policy so they were refused the ability to receive work based email on those devices. In the end that need won out and they accepted it. When one of those people lost their phone and we were able to track it down and then remotely wipe it they saw the value of that tech.

You can't have it both ways. You can't want the convenience, security and fun of wireless communication , be it voice\data, without the tracking and location abilities inherent to that technology. I view game consoles the same way. No one makes anyone buy a system and use their tracking tech but if you want to buy it then you know what you are getting into.

So I guess what your saying is - it's not a violation of privacy if they tract your every move since by default you agreed to purchase the product.

In the scenario I gave the company phone is paid 100%. I can choose not to have a company phone which eliminates the ability for them to have 24/7 tracking enabled but I also lose the ability to receive work related email. Given my current job this is not an option so I accept the phone. In my opinion the fact that the ability to track is there should not bother people but rather the inappropriate use of that tracking is what should bother people.

And whose to say the "tracking" on the part of the PTB is inappropriate? This is where it gets dicey because majority want's security in exchange for privacy.

In light of the NSA revelations, it's becoming apparent now that many are not bothered by the massive collection of data. Now we can add to this the tracking of movements via WiFi. Put this all together - the power at the hands of those who posses the data is enormousness.

Originally posted by dellmonty
this method is only good if your wifi is on.I never use mine so who cares.I keep it off and never turn it on.And if your not doing anything against the law,what does it matter.Do not expect it to get better,it wont.

Well I sure hope that the case, but if you can see (detect) your neighbor's wifi signal - then by default, will also be inside inside that signal zone?

I wonder.

reply to post by signalfire


Not me,I'll give these eavesdroppers something to remember,have nightmares
over,lose their lunch and possibly blinding a few while I'm at it! I even shudder
from the horror of what I could do with a captive audience.

I see an amazing technology I hadn't thought of! We've already seen this in the movies... does anyone remember Iron Man? Stark was swiping through holistic data displays using gestures. I watched that and thought "if only there was a way to do this!" Now there is!

Any technology can be used inappropriately. I can use a car to drive back and forth to work, or I can use a car to kill people. I can buy products from a convenience store to quench my thirst or have a snack, or I can use them to leave a small crater where the store once stood. I can use my phone to call friends or set up meetings, or I can use my phone as a detonator for a bomb.

The only difference is in the use of the technology, not in the technology itself. If something is physically possible, it will be discovered at some point.

If anyone is really getting paranoid about this, there is a new anti-WiFi wallpaper out to stop anyone from watching you play X-Box.

And no, I'm not a mad bomber. Those are just examples.

TheRedneck

I always figured...like it or not...its free-game. If we use cables, radio waves, satellites, underground, above ground, micro-ham radio means...what ever the hell...then they can and have been tapping it.

Like at work when I sign on to the company computer...that by using it...I have no reasonable assumption that anything will remain private.

Of course its invasion...but the only ways of transmission and reception...are theirs. No such real thing as a "private-internet, isp or satellite"...some part of everything we need to communicate....either belongs to, or is monitored by...THEM.

Forget the right or wrong part...that doesnt matter to them...nor can we do anything about it.

So they can't look at your data, only track your movements via the strength of your wifi signal??

Why is this a big deal? Most cell phones have built in GPS. Most cell phones have some type of lojack technology. This will not effect laptop and game console users much as they dont move around like cell phones and possibly tablets do.

I'd say this IS invasion of privacy if you don't consent to it when you sign the cell phone contract. Read the fine print carefully.

You know they have long had thermal imaging that can see you through walls. They use it all the time to find bad guys.