Corporations are a bigger threat to you than the gov...

Originally posted by stormson
reply to post by amfirst1

 

the flat tax is a joke. as an auditor, you should know that.

say the tax is 10%. A makes 10k and B makes 100k. A pays 1000 and B pays 10,000. which of the two can most afford the tax? which of the two makes out like a bandit. this proves the "flat tax" is unfair to the poor.

"I hope that we crush ... in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." -Thomas Jefferson

"Another means of silently lessening the inequality of property is to exempt all from taxation below a certain point, and to tax the higher portions of property in geometrical progression as they rise." -Thomas Jefferson

Nonsense. What makes the time one person took to make 100k any less valuable than the time it took the other guy to make 10K? Why is one person's life (because that is what passes when you work) more valuable than the other? Other than envy, there is no logical reason nor "fairness" about a progressive tax.

If everyone pays some sort of income taxes, then people will be less anxious to increase the power of government to "get the other guy." If everyone has skin in the game, people will be less inclined to vote for fiscally irresponsible politicians and laws. As it stands, to many people vote out of envy and "getting the other guy" they don't realize that ultimately they are hurting themselves.

Originally posted by Kali74
Too many people in this country have 'battered wife syndrome'. It's never the abusers fault, the victim got out of line and asked their needs be met.

Corporations are the government now, have been for quite a while... they just have less and less need to hide it.

24 of 37 Exxon lobbyists have held government posiotions.

16 of 22 Monsanto lobbyists have held government positions.

I can go on if anyone likes...

And yet those same "victims" want to make the abuser bigger and bigger with less restraint upon them. Big government gets bigger and the victims keep asking for more of the same big government to come and save them.

Yes it is like spousal abuse because the battered spouse keeps asking for more and more of the same government to abuse them and everytime believe it when government says "this time it'll be different...I promise."

The people, and by extension, CREATED lobbyists. People demanded that government control those evil corporations, the evil rich, and demanded more government regulation and taxation and control in exchange for the promise that they would be taken care of. Thus the government, empowered by a people who demanded it, created even more and more regulations and authority so that you must get government permission to start a business, follow a myriad of rules and regulations to keep a business, be taxed right and left to appease the "gimme voters," and can be ruined quite easily by this over-empowered government. As a result, big businesses started lobbying to minimize the damage that such an over empowered government would do against them and maximize it against their competition. If government was not so over involved in business, business would not see the need for lobbying.

If you want to see why corporate lobbyists have so much influence in our lives and have ever said to yourself "their aught to be a regulation to stop stuff I don't like" all you need to do is look in the mirror.

Originally posted by MyHappyDogShiner

 

Contracts, contracts

Vote for people who wull fix the problem. It's a Democracy, right?

Originally posted by NavyDoc

 

And yet those same "victims" want to make the abuser bigger and bigger with less restraint upon them. Big government gets bigger
"victim" ... keeps asking for more and more of the same government to abuse them and everytime believe it when government says "this time it'll be different...I promise."
The people, and by extension, CREATED lobbyists.
If you want to see why corporate lobbyists have so much influence in our lives and have ever said to yourself "their aught to be a regulation to stop stuff I don't like" all you need to do is look in the mirror.

I agree with you on the problem and on who needs to fix it. But the mirror shows a person, not a solution. What is the solution?

Originally posted by NavyDoc

Originally posted by stormson
reply to post by amfirst1

 

the flat tax is a joke. as an auditor, you should know that.

say the tax is 10%. A makes 10k and B makes 100k. A pays 1000 and B pays 10,000. which of the two can most afford the tax? which of the two makes out like a bandit. this proves the "flat tax" is unfair to the poor.

"I hope that we crush ... in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." -Thomas Jefferson

"Another means of silently lessening the inequality of property is to exempt all from taxation below a certain point, and to tax the higher portions of property in geometrical progression as they rise." -Thomas Jefferson

Nonsense. What makes the time one person took to make 100k any less valuable than the time it took the other guy to make 10K? Why is one person's life (because that is what passes when you work) more valuable than the other? Other than envy, there is no logical reason nor "fairness" about a progressive tax.

If everyone pays some sort of income taxes, then people will be less anxious to increase the power of government to "get the other guy." If everyone has skin in the game, people will be less inclined to vote for fiscally irresponsible politicians and laws. As it stands, to many people vote out of envy and "getting the other guy" they don't realize that ultimately they are hurting themselves.

There is nothing wrong with a progressive taxation system. Its not penalising the rich out of envy, it is simply a case of "you can afford to pay more than someone else, so pay more". We all agree that a public sector is necessary and government needs money to run stuff.

Before you accuse me of liking this big and out-of-control federal government, no I hate what democrats and republicans stand for. I hate the tax code because the scale is too progressive too fast at low incomes. The 39% bracket should be much higher. I also hate the war campaigns, I hate the lopsided justice being delivered, I hate the corporate bailouts by the federal reserve that should never happen within a capitalist country like usa, I hate the bull# that comes out of obama, kerry, mccain.

Originally posted by ThinkingHuman

If 99% of all campaign contributions for Democrats and Republicans are coming from those evil corporations - then why are we still voting for those Democrats and Republicans?

Funny. Last time I checked green, libertarian, constitution, socialist, justice, communist party were excluded from the ballots to various degree. The parties need to go door to door and get signatures to be included in the state ballots so why don't they do it then? I mean if the party is not even on the ballot, then what chance does that party have of winning anything?

Yes campaign money is also very important. But in this case we can't even get the basics straight yet....

To put it bluntly: We Americans are voting for those evil corporations, their lobbies and their stooges - and we have nobody to blame but ourselves. The evil is ourselves!

No. I put more blame on the media because they have selective amnesia. They prop up stuff that is unimportant, and downplay or ignore important things. If I were to start a revolution I would start by burning down all msm and then washington.

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

 

Last time I checked green, libertarian, constitution, socialist, justice, communist party were excluded from the ballots to various degree.

Ron Paul was on every ballot. That is exactly why he ran within the Republican Party. Besides, the Tea Party and Occupy Wall Street gained a lot of popularity as grassroots movements. If people wake up we can overcome the two party system, simply by not voting for the two parties.

Unfortunately, that does not seem likely. The Bible calls us sheep. Lets face it, that's what we are, mindless, spineless sheep. Unable to take our country back peacefully. Even though we have the means - it's a Democracy, right?

I put more blame on the media because they have selective amnesia. I would start by burning...

You remember it is a market system. If we stop watching them, they go bankrupt. If you burn, you go to jail.

reply to post by ThinkingHuman


How are people going to wake up by listening to the corporate media? How will people know that the corporate media is causing them all the confusion in the first place, so that they switch to alternative media?

In other words the media is brainwashing people and they do not know it.

Ron Paul did a clever thing. Running on a mainstream party with an alternative agenda. Romney and company, like a clever snake struck him down when the time was appropriate. He and company pulled every dirty trick they could muster, many times even inventing new laws along the way.

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

 

How are people going to wake up by listening to the corporate media?

By people like you and me, who are already awake, telling them.

Why is one person's life (because that is what passes when you work) more valuable than the other? Other than envy, there is no logical reason nor "fairness" about a progressive tax.

yes, why does one person make $1000 an hour, and another working just as hard paid $10?

the reason for a progressive tax plan is a) to reduce the income gap, and b) those that have more can spare more.

people on foodstamps cant afford food, yet you want them to pay taxes and starve? ceos making tens of millions a year can afford a million in taxes. what, will it cut into their buggati or g5 budget?

if you make 222x the average american wage, you can afford 222x the tax.

reply to post by NavyDoc

And yet those same "victims" want to make the abuser bigger and bigger with less restraint upon them. Big government gets bigger and the victims keep asking for more of the same big government to come and save them.

It's not the victims calling for bigger and bigger government, but the perps, as in the International Corporate Bankers (ICBs) and the insurance companies, eager to regulate our lives into dictating everything that the individual does, with a bigger military and more police and more jails.

Those can't see how ICBs have taken over this county by continuing to parrot the right wing propaganda after what was done to the U.S. under GW, have turned their back on the U.S., and eagerly pursue the future enslavement of everyone but the elites.