Originally posted by jammybunn
Ok by way of background, I was brought up in a religious household, my family remain church going folk whilst I do not, I live my life my way, believe
im a good person etc and that the dos and donts in the bible dont really fit in with how i like to enjoy my life.
Anywho, I was at my dads on a recent trip home and he stuck a DVD on of a guy who claims to have had an outer body experience in hell (23 minutes in
hell) and part of it he was saying how he "discussed" his religion with a talk show host (who he won over in terms of his questioning). However,
this lead me to ask a theoretical question of my dad (which id not thought of previously) who couldnt answer and is merely one of interest to me. I
can understand the theory of intelligent design given the complexity of our universe and also acknowledge evolution ( I do not accept that these are 2
mutually exclusive theories as why could one not create a species which went on to evolve in its changing habitat but thats another topic.)
My question to the Christian believers on this site (yes I know atheistic views so I dont wish to draw on the same old "invisible man in the sky
yadda yadda" response) If, as is preached, the only way to God is through his son Jesus, who died on the cross, at circa 33AD........ how did the
likes of Moses, Noah, Abraham etc who lived hundreds/thousands of years before Christ arrived, make it to heaven?? seriously this means either there
was a second way (and so what was it/why n/a now?) or did they linger in pergatory which i dont recall ever hearing about in the non Catholic churches
i attended as a child.
Excellent questions placed in the proper manner to reply. But the truth of these things is far more in depth than a 5000 character limit.
The Earth is billions of years old, scripture supports this truth, several thousands of years ago a great spiritual war took place in the spirit realm
(non-physical), the result of which spilled over into the physical realm and left Earth in total destruction, with no life on it (ELE).
About 6000 years ago, God began to re-create the Earth so that it would be suitable for life once again, so that God could create physical mankind
upon it. In 7 literal days, God re-created the Earth with life forms and processes required for the creation of mankind, on the 6th of 7 days mankind
was created (Adam).
For 6000 years mankind has been given an age in which they are designed and meant to determine for themselves what is "right" and what is "wrong";
what is "true" and what is "false"; what is "good" and what is "evil". As such we created our own governments, religions, cultures, customs,
diets, and skills around that self determined image. This 6000 year age of mankind's self rule is NOT the primary age set aside for the salvation of
mankind by God plan. There is far more to God perfect plan then this present age. In this age it was God's purpose to call out of the world a very
small number of individual minds for a great purpose. 144,000 individual human beings born of mankind were "called out" (ecclsia/church = greek for
"called out ones") of the ways of this present age to build a relationship with God Almighty.
The 144,000 are called from all the eras of the age of mankind's self rule, they are separated into 2 groups through a metaphor found in the Feast of
Pentecost by 2 loafs baked WITH LEVEN. Leven (which puffs up/pride) represents sin, these 2 loafs would be offered up and accepted by God even though
they sinned (were born of man, and not perfect). 1 loaf represents those called before the church era (pre-Pentecost 31AD) those include Moses,
Abraham, Joshua, Issac, Jacob, Joseph, Elijah etc.; they were called out of this age to be worked with directly from God and learn how to think in
unity and oneness with His ways. The other loaf represents those called out of the age during the church era (after Pentecost 31AD) they include the
Apostles and all those in the Church of God over 2000 years.
Just as the metaphor represents, on Pentecost, the day of Jesus Christ's return the 144,000 will be resurrected to immortal spiritual life and join
the family (Elohim) of God, as brothers and sisters with Christ and full children of God forever. That is the purpose for all that have ever been
In this 6000 years; only 144,000 qualified to be ressurected in the future, none have been thus far; none are "in heaven" now. They will join Jesus
Christ as he returns on Pentecost.
Then will begin 1000 years of the reign of the Kingdom of God on Earth, only one government wil exist and one religion, mankind will rebuild this
planet in ways we cannot dream of in this selfish age of man.
After the 1000 years have finished, all 12+ billion human beings that have lived and died in this age not knowing God's truth or learning God's
ways, will be given a second physical life to live when all is revealed in perfection!