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NSA admits listening to U.S. phone calls without warrants - Angry yet?

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posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 05:40 PM
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Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by SonOfTheLawOfOne
 


Dear SonOfTheLawOfOne



You have to be one of the thickest people I've seen on here. I don't care what you know about law, you know nothing about technology, that much is apparent. The government can not decrypt strong encryption, so they issue a warrant to get the company that houses the encrypted data to decrypt it for them. I have seen the warrants myself, I have even helped to provide the data for audits when necessary, and like I said before, you are seriously barking up the wrong tree. They MUST have a warrant to ask for decrypted data because they can't force a private company to violate the privacy of its customers by providing their data, and if you had any basis in law, you would not be arguing this. It's almost as if you aren't reading anything I've said. The legal teams that I have worked with in every case, always push back as much as possible on the Federal agencies because of how complex the infringement on privacy is, but nobody will spend the money to take the Feds on in a Federal lawsuit when they have almost unlimited funds.


Wait, I know nothing about technology, how many people even know that ICANN exists?


Anyone with Google can find that out in 30 seconds. I'm supposed to believe that you know technology because of something you found online?



Nothing? You know nothing of the law.


Nothing, eh? Nah, I don't work with legal departments or audits or anything like that which would require me to be versed in Internet laws and regulations, or international treaties dealing with privacy or security, or attend conferences at the UN.... nah, nothing like that.
Love the strawman tactic.


You have also failed to answer any of my questions. What organization other than the United States federal government or their contractors can shut down the whole internet? Answer that one question.


I have answered every single one of your ridiculous claims and questions from the start, yet every time I prove you wrong, you jump ship to the next diversionary tactic.

The US Government CANNOT shut down the Internet without the PRIVATE Internet Service Providers, who would not just shut it off because they are being asked, and would take a monumental amount of effort to ever even pull off, which is why it has never been done here. Not to mention the enormous economic and social impact that it would have.

No single organization has the ability to shut down the Internet, not even the Government, and that's where you're failing to understand things. The Internet is not some singular structure like you keep inferring, and does not have some single power button that turns it off. Once you can understand that, you'll stop asking the ludicrous questions. You do not understand how networks work and how the Internet as a whole is connected, so you have this idea that they can control and shut down everything. You don't understand that PRIVATE companies like ATT spent BILLIONS to lay the fiber trunks all over the country and world, and are not beholden to the Federal Government.

Get your facts straight, and then we can have an honest discussion. Until then, you are wasting my time and I'm finished trying to help you when there are many others that truly want to understand this subject. Not to mention that you have yet to cite any of your legal sources, show any of your legal vernacular or interpretation of Constitutional law, and instead are trying to pick apart semantics and syntax rather than get at the heart of the issue. Show some sources, otherwise, your argument is vacuous at best.

~Namaste
edit on 16-6-2013 by SonOfTheLawOfOne because: (no reason given)

edit on 16-6-2013 by SonOfTheLawOfOne because: (no reason given)




posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 05:45 PM
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Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by elouina
 


Dear elouina,

Cell phones and phones are different, cell phones broadcast over the air and anyone can listen to them. Nothing you put on the internet cannot be hacked. Do hackers need warrants? If they do not then expect the government to data mine everything that is in the air and on the net. If you do not like that then use regular mail and a land line.


Are you saying then, that anything written on the internet, anything posted on the internet is excluded from the protection afforded in the 4th Amendment?


I totally missed this gem!



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 05:51 PM
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reply to post by SonOfTheLawOfOne
 


USA does not have to shut the internet down. Why would they want to anyway? Russia, china or some other nation could drop a huge EMP bomb and decimate all the infrastructure OR we could do the same to them.

The whole idea is to control the flow of information and keep copies of messages on mainframe supercomputers so that the ptb via their proxies in government can use at a later date to extort enemies of their making.

The warrant issue is primarily academic in nature and not pragmatic after 9-11. The controllers find all kinds of loopholes to overcome statue limitations. As I said before they can employ british commonwealth countries to eavesdrop for them, and then hand the information to the american government. The american government can do the same for the british government. One rogue nation helping another rogue nation. Our democracy is fake and always has been. The two party dictatorship should be the first clue, along with the controlled corporate media that pushes disinfo around the clock.



Menwith Hill in the UK where supposedly data is collected.



Then we have pine gap in australia.



NSA fort meade facility in maryland, usa.
edit on 16/6/13 by EarthCitizen07 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 06:41 PM
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Originally posted by Sankari

Originally posted by elouina
NSA admits listening to U.S. phone calls without warrants - Angry yet?


Nope. I live in Australia. They can't tap my phone.

Sucks to be you.




You think it's just contained to the US? That's a knee slapper! Just wait until it all comes out about the shadow government brah, folks are literally going to shat their britches!



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 06:45 PM
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Can someone explain what those giant white spheres are or is it classified?

I am curious as hell



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 06:45 PM
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"NSA admits listening to U.S. phone calls without warrants - Angry yet?"

And if the answer is yes,then what?

Seriously,why get mad?
Its just another thing,on top of so many other things,that should have pissed people off by now.

Whats gonna be the difference this time?
Maybe,more typing on more sites??

Truth be told,this society and this generation does NOTHING!
Oh but people are spreading info online,blah blah blah blah blah...

When people were truly fed up in this country and believed in what they were doing,you saw this.

The Million Man March


Women Vote - "Night of Terror" (Women`s Suffrage/Woman`s Rights)


Protesting The War - Thousands Oppose Vietnam War


Vietnam War protest in Washington


All these efforts continued till they got a result.
And they were brutal and hard struggles.
Not like the Occupy movement,or any other spur of the moment protest,like the GMO rally.

If people get mad,they fight to right the wrongs,not hold a sign 1 day a week and go home satisfied.

This rant is no offense to the OP,info is appreciated.
But to ask,Are you mad yet,how rhetorical.
~Just my 2 cents~
Cheers



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 06:48 PM
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And they're not even keeping us safe. It's easy to say. "well we thwarted dozens of terror attacks..." but, if you really look at the evidence, it wouldn't have stopped 911 and it didn't stop the Boston bombings. In both cases they already knew about these guys and had intel, warnings and files on all of the suspects. Just saying. what are they doing with this info if they aren't going to protect us? This leads me to believe, that they are using it on us.. normal citizens, so that they can take freedoms away and keep the status quo.. I mean ...crap. Now I sound like Alex Jones! LOL Help!



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 06:50 PM
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Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
Can someone explain what those giant white spheres are or is it classified?

I am curious as hell


Radio antennae and satellite dishes mostly. The big white balls are to hide the orientation of them so that others can't see where they are pointed. Imagine if you're China and you see a picture of a US satellite dish pointing directly at one of your communication satellites... it's mostly to hide that.


~Namaste



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 06:53 PM
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reply to post by Black_Fox
 


I agree with your post 1000%.


The only thing I will say is that there were far fewer distractions during those times than there are today. It's very easy to divert attention away from the things that matter, which is where we're losing the battle.

~Namaste



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 06:54 PM
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Originally posted by SonOfTheLawOfOne

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
Can someone explain what those giant white spheres are or is it classified?

I am curious as hell


Radio antennae and satellite dishes mostly. The big white balls are to hide the orientation of them so that others can't see where they are pointed. Imagine if you're China and you see a picture of a US satellite dish pointing directly at one of your communication satellites... it's mostly to hide that.


~Namaste


You mean they try to covertly download data from foreign satellites or otherwise interfere with them? Sounds interesting. Or maybe they send signals to the moon were aliens reside. I heard pine gap has lots of ufo activity there.



Looks a bit intimidating, almost like area 51 with the cammo dudes. Down on the ground now mother(beep-beep)

edit on 16/6/13 by EarthCitizen07 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by SonOfTheLawOfOne
reply to post by Black_Fox
 


I agree with your post 1000%.


The only thing I will say is that there were far fewer distractions during those times than there are today. It's very easy to divert attention away from the things that matter, which is where we're losing the battle.

~Namaste


Distractions?
That would have to mean that this generation is aware of the the issues,but keep seeing something shinny thats takes their attention away.

Which would make sense,with all the facebooks,I-Pods,Xbox,Ps3,cell phones,twitter,etc.

But I believe its more than that.
This is The Generation ME.
So theres no distraction.

Me me me me me me,look at me,im important.......


People could careless about the people who are ending up homeless,soldiers dying in wars for no reason,people being spied on.

As long as it dosent effect their tiny little bubble of the world,they dont care.
This society dosent need to be a collective of humans anymore,as humanity has exited already.

"In a Democracy, the people get the government they deserve - Alexis de Tocqueville"

Which is true,this generation derserves this government.
edit on 16-6-2013 by Black_Fox because: SpELLiNg



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 07:33 PM
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Ok everyone, we have an update here. The person that reported this was Rep. Jerrold Nadler. And today, I noticed that the original article that I got this information from changed! It appears that Nadler has changed his mind. Or was it changed for him? Oh my....

After Nadler had an exchange with FBI director Robert Meuller, Nadler's spokesperson made this crazy arse statement. And this is all we have now...


"I am pleased that the administration has reiterated that, as I have always believed, the NSA cannot listen to the content of Americans' phone calls without a specific warrant."




edit on 16-6-2013 by elouina because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 07:58 PM
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Office of the Director of National Intelligence

Washington, DC 20511


June 16, 2013

ODNI Statement on the Limits of Surveillance Activities


The statement that a single analyst can eavesdrop on domestic communications without proper legal authorization is incorrect and was not briefed to Congress. Members have been briefed on the implementation of Section 702, that it targets foreigners located overseas for a valid foreign intelligence purpose, and that it cannot be used to target Americans anywhere in the world.

Office of the Director of National Intelligence Public Affairs Office


www.dni.gov...









posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 09:15 PM
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Just for a bit of light relief...



Featuring Glenn Greenwald as a knight in shining armour, Mark Zuckerberg, General Alexander and, of course, Edward Snowden.
edit on 16-6-2013 by Archie because: .



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 09:25 PM
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Originally posted by benrl
My biggest problem with this whole thing is people are Focusing their anger on Obama, the anger should be on the NSA.

Yes Obama being impeached over this is good and should happen, but thats the start, the NSA needs to be held to accountability as well.

It was there before Obama, it will be there after, an organization staffed by Americans who thought "hey its okay to grossly violate civil rights" Needs to be held accountable as well at every level of command.

"Following orders" Is a piss poor excuse for anyone.

edit on 16-6-2013 by benrl because: (no reason given)


The reason "We the People" vote a president in is because they are suppose to hold up the constitution and protect the people that put them into office. Hypothetically.

We don't vote the NSA in.

So when the SHTF, now the presidents interest should be to handle the issues for the people, but it's just the opposite.


edit on 16-6-2013 by Realtruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 09:37 PM
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Remember a little while back when IBM's "Watson" computer played Jeopardy? "Watson" is a spin-off machine, I am almost certain, born from the development of the NSA's super analytical machines. All digital data in all forms, in all things connected to any network on earth, is drag-netted, sorted, analyzed.

www-03.ibm.com...

It's a matter of economy. They simply are having too much fun with toys, and are letting it go to far. It's too difficult and costly to do old fashioned investigative work. Plus, they used to have to wait for a crime to occur before they could investigate. This is an attempt to prevent crime before it happens, or at least make it much easier to solve it once the crime does happens. It makes perfect sense in a physical way. However, in a human way, moral, ethical, constitutional...etc, way, it's way off base. It's part of the "robot-i-fication" of the human race. It's much easier to herd humanity, when you have it by the short hairs. Is it good? No, of course. Are we being slowly brainwashed, to think it's OK? Yes, of course.

Less freedom, slowly narrowing freewill choices, more surveillance, iced with carefully crafted propaganda that is based upon naturally occurring crimes and disasters, designed to make us WANT more control for our own safety...with the real ultimate goal, or great side-benefit of being able to control the willing sheep of earth.

There are two ways that humanity can go. Mass chaos, or mass control. Ultimately both will fail our existence, and we will either overpopulate ourselves into extinction, or nature will put a period on our sentence. Will we go down fighting, or will we go down under a planned, controlled demolition.
edit on 16-6-2013 by zayonara because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 10:10 PM
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My dad insists that the NSA has been listening to him because he reads ATS and some other forums. Today, he jokingly picked up the land line and said "hear that Obama!" and used a bunch of choice words. We were rolling with laughter, but really it's just incredibly sad.



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 10:16 PM
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Originally posted by Black_Fox
"In a Democracy, the people get the government they deserve - Alexis de Tocqueville"

Which is true,this generation derserves this government.
edit on 16-6-2013 by Black_Fox because: SpELLiNg


You might be suprised how many people were railing against alex jones a few days ago, on this particular conspiracy site. There were many more that railed against him then showed support for what he did at the bilderberger meetings held in england this year.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Mass media is disinforming everyone constantly. Those that can see past the lies are far and few between. That means the imbeciles dumb down everyone by default. If you hang with the wrong people then you become wrong too.

Yes many, many, many distractions especially with the mobile telephones and wannabe celebrities who worship satan and smoke pot.

A few have jobs and the economy is good. At least that is the picture one gets. If I can have a job, then you can too. You might have to work minimum wage for a long time though and compete with the illegal immigrants but thats ok. If I can do it, then you can too. I am special, you become special too. Everyone who does not work is a lazy welfare scumbag draining the system(this is very popular with the military types).
edit on 16/6/13 by EarthCitizen07 because: add links to AJ bashing threads.



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 10:20 PM
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reply to post by elouina
 


what are you going to do other than typing a couple of forum messages on your keyboard?

none! the government and nsa can bank on that..



posted on Jun, 16 2013 @ 10:32 PM
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I knew they were listening, and yeah, I was steamed, frustrated, gobsmacked at how intrusive it has become. The biggest outrage is that they have no authority to prosecute for the offenses they observe. Their data goes to their "clients", which are other national groups. Apparently there's a price affixed to the exchange.

So I could type all day about who did what bad, and the NSA can match that with their research, but at the end it's a room of younger people with fancy colored clearances sitting around a table at a meeting about what to do about the angle of keeping their clients happy while keeping the crowds in blindness, and maybe one of them with a conscience would take a minute to hope the person they watched knows where to go to get the justice they need. But all of them in the room would be genuinely ashamed if ever the walls became transparent and they realized that they had a hand in partitioning the truth, and I gather that some of them are concerned about facing the truth, that they're all liable for conspiracy for invading the privacy of everybody. That is, if they are awake and capable of seeing their own actions. It doesn't matter if there's signatures on triplicates and embroidery for everybody, it's the duplicate of the nasty budding oppressive watcher forces that we removed from other nations in times past. The fences might be digital this time but they are still there.

Sadly it's old news. I have a book about the NSA that's dated over a decade ago that says the same thing, that they spy on all the phone calls. Why the shock and awe this year, with an even bigger data center about to open? To hustle out workers at NSA to send them, with experience, over to the newer data center? The nation fed that predator company, and it grew, and it wants mooore data. And here is the icing on the cake: you know all those critics of digital spying? How they are spreading their opinions all over the spied on internet? Well, should they get desperate for work and go back on their opinions, now their background checks say they're critical of a government agency and they're more likely to be discriminated against by the government in the future. Too bad, so sad, welcome to totalitarianist data agents. The cure is to invite an invasion from a foreign nation, and who wants to do that?



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