It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.


Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.


Putin Highlights Dark Side of America’s History in TV Interview

page: 2
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in


posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 01:18 PM
reply to post by FlyersFan

Japan wasn't going to end the war.

Quite a profound statement. Are you absolutely sure about that?

According to the archived American documents ( and I choose the American archives just to keep it simple in explaining my question. Hmm.. are there additional archives? Is there more to read?)


"While no reason is apparent why the Allies-- in contrast to their treatment of Germany-- are softening their attitude toward Japan, our position is different from Germany in that [ as you say] we have no objection to the restoration of world peace on the basis of the Charter (Atlantic Charter)."

"5. In your 12 July message [DS 13 Jul 45] you merely informed me of Japan's desire to send a Special Envoy [to Moscow]; then, in a message dated 21 July, you instructed me to seek the good offices of the Russian Government [DS 22 Jul 45]; now in your 25 July message, I am to make clear that the purpose of sending a Special Envoy is to induce Stalin to become a peace advocate."


.. although with the urgency of the war situation our time to proceed with arrangements for ending the war before the enemy lands on the Japanese mainland is limited ( If they only knew, I suppose.), on the other hand it is difficult to decide on concrete peace conditions here at home all at once. At present, in accordance with the Imperial Will, there is a unanimous determination to seek the food offices of the Russians in ending the war, to make concrete terms a matter between Japan and Russia, and to send Prince Konoye, who has the deep trust of the Emperor, to carry on discussions with the Russians... It has been decided at any rate to send a Special Envoy in accordance with the views of the highest leaders of [this] Government,"


I implore you to read additionally, if you become so inclined to learn more about the subject details, seek the additional archived documentation. There is always more to read.



In ending, it does appear the Japanese not only intended to surrender prior to the atomic bombings, but also the the American government was well aware of the Japanese intentions of surrendering.

Document 29: "Magic" (Worth the read.)– Diplomatic Summary, War Department, Office of Assistant Chief of Staff, G-2, No. 1204 – July 12, 1945, Top Secret Ultra
Source: Record Group 457, Records of the National Security Agency/Central Security Service, "Magic" Diplomatic Summaries 1942-1945, box 18

Since September 1940, under the cover name "Magic," U.S. military intelligence had been routinely decrypting the intercepted cable traffic of the Japanese Foreign Ministry. The National Security Agency kept the 'Magic" diplomatic and military summaries classified for many years and did not release the series for 1942 through August 1945 in its entirety until the early 1990s. This summary includes a report on a cable from Japanese Foreign Minister Shigenori Togo to Ambassador Naotake Sato in Moscow concerning the emperor's decision to seek Soviet help in ending the war. Not knowing that the Soviets had already made a commitment to its Allies to declare war on Japan, Tokyo fruitlessly pursued this option for several weeks. The "Magic" intercepts from mid-July have figured in Gar Alperovitz's argument that Truman and his advisers recognized that the emperor was ready to capitulate if the Allies showed more flexibility on the demand for unconditional surrender. This point is central to Alperovitz's thesis that top U.S. officials recognized a "two-step logic" that moderating unconditional surrender and a Soviet declaration of war would have been enough to induce Japan's surrender without the use of the bomb.


edit on 12-6-2013 by emberscott because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 02:07 PM
reply to post by emberscott

Awesome job. They bring up all that information in Oliver Stone's Untold History of the U.S. that I watched a couple of months ago. Really interesting series for anyone who loves history.

ETA: If I remember correctly one of the main points the Japanese were holding out for was to be able to keep their Emperor, which was a large part of their cultural identity. If they could have been assured that he wouldn't be removed and or deposed they would have surrendered more quickly.
edit on 6/12/13 by Malynn because: To add more...

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 02:08 PM
He's technically correct. Stalin wouldn't be able to get that plane into the US enough to bomb it because the US wasnt trodden upon by Stalins forces. Unfortunately Putin is using old Soviet lie techniques that would be used on schoolchildren in Russia to hypnotize them based on events that never happened. Small tricks. Stalin never had a weapon and Putin is talking old propaganda, but the message is clear the subject of world war is there.

By this story it appears that Putin has shifted into a Cold War butcher. Maybe he will wake up and find that his mistress was a spy and his ex was the secret ingredient to his rule.

All propaganda.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 02:18 PM
The man is nothing but a self appointed dictator.
Nothing but a thug and terrorist to his own people.
This is akin to Stalin saying Hitler was a bad man.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 02:18 PM

Originally posted by Malynn

Originally posted by coolcatt

Its seem like the world has turned on it head russia trying to be the good guy and the U.S.A trying to lock everybody down with power.

I've been thinking about this for a long time actually. I'm not saying Putin is a "good guy" because our planet is very much like Game of Thrones. There are no good guys, and if there are they get neutralized or whatever. But....for the last decade or so it's seemed like the US and Russia are switching sides. Since the fall of the Soviet Union the Russians have spent a lot of time hunkered down trying to deal with problems within their own borders. Every once in awhile they pull their heads out of what they're doing and pipe up when the US is doing something particularly Imperial Federation-ish.

I don't think Stalin would have used a nuke either. There wasn't any kind of good reason to do so. The only reason the US used it was to show Russia how big our wang was. The war was all but over and the US knew it and so did the Japanese. The US government of that time were the retards that came up with "brinkmanship" and mutually assured destruction. Truman was a racist, and a monster.

Hear hear! Well said!

In regards to Russia operating within it's own borders - that would be the internal battle between the Bolsheviks, and supposedly Orthodox Christians!

Sure explains some of Russia's behaviour.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 02:20 PM
reply to post by sealing

Maybe. A lot like our own leaders too.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 03:00 PM
Suprised how open and unrehearsed this looked.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 03:30 PM
reply to post by FlyersFan

Japan had already surrendered but not to the the terms that we wanted so we nuked them and probably would've done it anyway

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 04:02 PM
RT is merely a psyop by russia to spread their propoganda to the united states of england

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 04:11 PM
reply to post by LastStarfighter

Kind of like all our news networks.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 04:26 PM

Originally posted by emberscott
In ending, it does appear the Japanese not only intended to surrender prior to the atomic bombings

Typical "blame the USA for everything whilst I rewrite history nonsense"

If Japan wanted to surrender they would have surrendered.
They refused to surrender after the first bomb was dropped.
They were refusing to surrender after the 2nd bomb was dropped,
and it took the personal intervention of the emperor for Japan to surrender - there was even the start of a military coup to try and stop Japan surrendering.

Simply put, if Japan had wanted to surrender they would have surrendered.

edit on 12-6-2013 by hellobruce because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 04:34 PM
The Soviets under Stalin would have used the bomb for the same reasons the U.S. did, one of which was to show the Soviets exactly what it could do to a large population center.

Remember, a lot of the worlds boundaries were redrawn while the war was still being fought to its conclusion. The Soviets and the West were often in contention as to where the lines would be and the graphic examples made of Hiroshima and Nagasaki certainly would have figured prominently in Soviet decision making regarding how far to push their sphere of influence in both Europe and Asia.

Stalin used every other tool at his disposal to force his will, to say he would have spared Germany the bomb is a suspicious statement at best.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 05:04 PM
Wow what a hypocrite when talking about how hard it is for black people in the us. Russia is one of the worst states to be in if youre not white. Youtube is full of russian neo nazi and skinhead gang randomly beating up black people and race murders are very high there. Its disgusting.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 05:13 PM
reply to post by whatsup86

During the Cold war the USSR frequently scolded the USA on the fact that Black people were 2nd class citizens, obviously in the USSR all people were equal due to it being communist.(obviously that was their view not mine).

The U.S.S.R. made a petition to the United Nations called "We Charge Genocide," documenting a series of human rights abuses against African Americans by the USA...they used this as a "Land of the Free? you must be joking" thing.
edit on 12-6-2013 by boymonkey74 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 05:33 PM

Originally posted by hellobruce

Typical "blame the USA for everything whilst I rewrite history nonsense"

Typical swallowing the official story without actually doing some research nonsense. What emberscott posted was absolutely correct, and verifiable. And history is written by the winner, in this case the US.
edit on 6/12/13 by Malynn because: (no reason given)

edit on 6/12/13 by Malynn because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 05:50 PM
Should we highlight the dark side of Russia's history?

Seriously, he shouldn't be trying to get in a pissing contest on this issue.
And I like Russia too....

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 05:51 PM
reply to post by Ghost375

Hey Iam just glad it isn't the Dark Side of the Brits under the spotlight for once lol

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 05:53 PM
reply to post by Ghost375

As far as pissing contests go in this subject I'm not sure any country has a leg to stand on.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 06:00 PM

Originally posted by coolcatt
reply to post by Pervius

i didn't start this post so people could start bashing the U.S

America really needs a serious bashing in all forms right about now,
and that's including the American people who have been sitting on the sidelines for YEARS in complete apathy.

Seriously, the US is nothing to me but an Evil Empire now and nothing short of a pure Patriotic uprising to re-instate the Republic will remove that enmity that has legitimately built up over the past decade.

Why do you think it is America get's bashed in the first place?
If they actually held themselves accountable or didn't set such insane expectations to begin with none of these concerns would manifest into people's posts.

posted on Jun, 12 2013 @ 06:01 PM

Originally posted by LastStarfighter
RT is merely a psyop by russia to spread their propoganda to the united states of england

This is just the same age-old battle between networks of rich people.

top topics

<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in