The Zimmerman Trial

reply to post by FlyersFan

Originally posted by FlyersFan
It's been established that Martin was on top and hammered Zimmerman.

I wouldn't say that's been established. One witness said that. The jury is free to believe or not believe the witnesses. And Good said he didn't actually see any blows land (as I recall).

What were the people in charge of letting Trayvon's family hear the 911 call thinking? It's almost as if they wanted to invalidate any affirmative recognition that it was Trayvon.

i was just thinking, some where in theses seventy pages, one of the TM supporters said that a parent couldn't id their childs voice screaming. i want name names, but it is one of the more vocal of them.

now on the stand nakasone just said the best people to id some one voice is, the people who have heard them all their life.

i just guess that some just don't know everything that they are talking about.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

I think it was established ... but not that it was established for the entire fight.
John Good said he saw part of it with Martin on top and blows coming down.
He didn't see if they connected. (considering Zimmermans face, it looks like they did)
But that doesn't mean it started that way or ended that way .... IMHO.

Originally posted by hounddoghowlie
i was just thinking, some where in theses seventy pages, one of the TM supporters said that a parent couldn't id their childs voice screaming. i want name names, but it is one of the more vocal of them.

now on the stand nakasone just said the best people to id some one ids the people who have heard them all their life.

i just guess that some just don't know everything that they are talking about.

Did you miss the bit where he said they'd have to be familiar with hearing similar sounds from the person making them? When do you imagine the last time Zimmerman's parents heard their adult son screaming or yelling was? When he was being accused of the molestation of his cousin, perhaps? Or, after daddy had turned him down on another request for some money to tide him through?

Whose parents are more likely to have heard their son's high stressed yells - the ones with a problematic teenager, or the one's who didn't even live with their son?

reply to post by roadgravel


I stand corrected.... you are right according to this article:

abcnews.go.com... S/george-zimmermans-friend-trayvon-martins-father-cursed-courthouse/story?id=19475915#.UdGRuKxdx5E

Martin's parents were allowed to stay because Florida law allows the immediate family of victims to remain in court.

Originally posted by hounddoghowlie
now on the stand nakasone just said the best people to id some one voice is, the people who have heard them all their life.

Yes, but there is only 2.5 seconds of viable tape and it has distance problems.
'Far field of voice' problems.
Maybe that's why Martins father said he couldn't ID the voice on 911.
Either that .. or it wasn't Martin screaming and it was Zimmerman.


It's all so convoluted. I'm glad I'm not on the jury.

FBI Voice guy .... lets move along. This is really getting tiresome. It should have been done 1/2 an hour ago. We get it ... you can't ID the voice. You are qualified to say that voice analysis isn't possible. Okay .... NEXT!

reply to post by IvanAstikov



after 28 years(gm), and 17 years( tm), i would think both sides have had enough time through the years, to hear both of them screaming.
no matter what they were screaming about.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Sorry I have so many questions... But I read this on the blog and I wanted to know if you heard this in pre-trial press or in the trial (I have not heard this anywhere):

GZ did say "AFTER" the shot he did get up and TM body moved and he did get on top of him while TM on his stomach and thought he was restraining him.

Regarding the analysis of screams, couldn't they experiment by getting a voice actor to make certain yells, and then see if they can pick it out from yells provided by other voice actors? If they could, couldn't they then ask the first voice actor to try and disguise the same yell, and see if that could be detected?

This is getting annoying...

it seems like the voice question is being asked 50 different ways. I can understand why, but this is getting ridiculous now.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

I haven't seen that anywhere. I've never seen anything stating that.
(But of course I could have missed that)
That's why I'm waiting to see what the forensics are at the trail.
We are finally getting the facts.

Side note .. I still think that if the prosecution had gone with Manslaughter it would have been a slam dunk. Opening statement from the prosecution said something like .. 'we wouldn't be here if George Zimmerman would have stayed in his car'. And one of the jury nodded (according to reports). So the jury was probably already nearly at a manslaughter thought process ... IMHO.

Originally posted by hounddoghowlie
after 28 years(gm), and 17 years( tm), i would think both sides have had enough time through the years, to hear both of them screaming.
no matter what they were screaming about.

edit on 1-7-2013 by hounddoghowlie because: (no reason given)

Yes, but one or the other of Trayvon's parents would have heard him upset recently, especially considering his recent discipline problems, whereas George wasn't even living with his parents.

reply to post by IvanAstikov


that's what I was kinda saying before. Family who listen to the tape and are asked .. 'is that george' or 'is that martin' will naturally be biased with the answer. I'd be taking the 'clean' 2.5 second chunk of the scream and mixing it in with screams from random people and ask them IF their family member was in amongst the screams. if they still picked out the 2.5 seconds of the scream in question, it would raise their credibility IMHO.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Sorry I have so many questions... But I read this on the blog and I wanted to know if you heard this in pre-trial press or in the trial (I have not heard this anywhere):

GZ did say "AFTER" the shot he did get up and TM body moved and he did get on top of him while TM on his stomach and thought he was restraining him.

i don't think he said moved, i think he said he thought he had something in his hand.
some pages back the reenactment video is posted and he said it in there.

Score again for the defense... Everything lines up with zimmermans story!! The *expert* voice analysis can not determine who's voice it was. It is the prosecutions job to prove zimmerman is lying.. He is not. He was the one screaming!! Let's look at the fact and evidence, not our own speculation.. Shame on some of you for condemning this man!

reply to post by FlyersFan


Thanks. I agree with you on the manslaughter thing. Do you know?... Is there any way Zimmerman can be found guilty of manslaughter in this trial? Or is it a clean guilty or not guilty of murder II?

reply to post by IvanAstikov

Martins mother hadn't been involved with him for years. Martins step mother was estranged from his father and had been for a while. Martins fathers fiance didn't know him. Martins father was the only constant and he said it wasn't Martin on the 911 call tape. (and didn't even realize Martin was missing until the next morning).

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

I THINK (not sure) that the prosecution can add 'manslaughter' to the list of possible outcomes by the jury if he does it before the end of the trail. I THINK. I've read that. I don't know if it's true or not.

There is too much reasonable doubt floating around right now for Murder 2. If I were that prosecutor, I'd be seriously considering adding it to the choices for the jury. (if he can). It's what he should have done to begin with IMHO.