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The Zimmerman Trial

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posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 11:24 AM
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reply to post by MrWendal
 





Again- even if Trayvon confronted Zimmerman, it makes no difference


Actually it makes a world of difference which is why that is being brought up in court. This case has gotten very interesting. It is pretty sad that they have to play back what the witness said to them and they still disagree that’s what they said.


Right now I think the star witness for the state has been severely discredited.




posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 11:31 AM
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reply to post by Grimpachi
 


If her testimony is what the prosecution based their case on. Zimmerman is going to walk. Get ready for the riots



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 11:36 AM
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Originally posted by dudeman351
reply to post by Grimpachi
 


If her testimony is what the prosecution based their case on. Zimmerman is going to walk. Get ready for the riots

If the prosecution has placed all its hopes on a person who wasn't even at the scene and had no real understanding of where Trayvon was and what was going on around him, then I hope the Martin's use their HOA money to go after the state prosecution team for malpractice.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 11:48 AM
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Originally posted by IvanAstikov

Originally posted by riffraff

Originally posted by IvanAstikov

Originally posted by riffraff
You have the legal right to shoot an attacker (armed or unarmed) if you believe your life is in danger. It doesn't matter if there is one attacker or one hundred. If you slam my head into the pavement, I will shoot you. And after a long drawn out overhyped trial I will walk free. Why do you think we have guns?


No, you need to have a reasonable belief you were in danger. If, for example, you've been having a standing struggle to restrain someone on wet grass, and you slip and fall on your back with the other guy on top of you, then, as he's trying to get back up, you are holding on to his clothing while you get your gun out to shoot him, that's definitely NOT reasonable behaviour.

Is English your first language? Read my quote again. Read it slow. Read it out loud if you still don't get it.


The belief of a paranoid schizophrenic or a raging alcoholic isn't going to cut it as mitigation for killing someone in self-defence.

Your believing you was in danger only counts if it can be established that you were a reasonable person.
edit on 27-6-2013 by IvanAstikov because: (no reason given)


All these imaginary hypotheticals just for the sake of being contrary! Are we talking about me or Zimmerman, because neither one of us have been established to be an alcoholic or a paranoid schizophrenic. What we were talking about was getting your cranium slammed into the concrete. Is that enough to reasonably believe your life is in danger? Ever heard of blunt force trauma? Increased cranial pressure? Subdural hemorrhage? Bacterial meningitis? Hemorrhagic stroke ? Life is fragile.
edit on 27-6-2013 by riffraff because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 11:52 AM
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reply to post by dudeman351
 


Well as I said I live very close and I guess I am as ready as I will ever be. Just sighted in the scope on my 7mm magnum last week I could castrate a squirrel at 100 yards. When I moved here 2 decades ago it wasn’t uncommon to see signs that said trespassers will be shot. Anyway I am not really worried about riots here but if it happens they better not come down my street.

In court there is talk that the states star witness just perjured herself. Maybe…. IDK.
No one can really understand what she is saying what a horrible dialect.

Anyway they just took a break for lunch.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:04 PM
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reply to post by WonderBoi
 

Epic fail on your part. You said .. why does it matter because a person is dead.
I showed how it does indeed matter how the person died.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:05 PM
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Originally posted by riffraff

All these imaginary hypotheticals just for the sake of being contrary! Are we talking about me or Zimmerman, because neither one of us have been established to be an alcoholic or a paranoid schizophrenic.

The hypotheticals weren't mentioned to be contrary, it was to point out that a person believing something isn't proof their belief is reasonable.

Originally posted by riffraff
What we were talking about was getting your cranium slammed into the concrete. Is that enough to reasonably believe your life is in danger? Ever heard of blunt force trauma? Increased cranial pressure? Subdural hemorrhage? Bacterial meningitis? Hemorrhagic stroke ? Life is fragile.
edit on 27-6-2013 by riffraff because: (no reason given)

I've experienced blunt force trauma on a few occasions, and never once did I fear for my life(I was too busy fighting back) or need a gun to defend myself. The most recent time was at the age of 49, against someone a few years older than Trayvon and possibly a few lbs lighter than myself. He walked away with a bit more respect for the older generation and a swollen eye, and I went on my way with an aching jaw from the only punch he landed.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:08 PM
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reply to post by JuniorDisco
 

Grow up and learn not to insult people who have a different opinion on a subject than you do.
And it wasn't just Martin saying 'nigga' on social media ... he called a complete stranger a cracker.
And there were numerous other postings showing hate.
No amount of pretend psycho-babble on your part changes the facts. Racist is racist. Hate is hate.

reply to post by JuniorDisco
 

Again ... epic fail on your part. Stop trying to play psychologist .. you don't do it well at all.
Just face the fact that Martin spewed a hateful racist remark. There is no excuse for it.




edit on 6/27/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:11 PM
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Originally posted by Grimpachi
Is anyone watching the trial?

Yep .. the judge keeps yelling at the defense attorney to stop repeating what that woman says. But gosh darn it ... I"m glad he is. She is mumbling and playing 'subued' today and not making any sense so he's making sure that we all (and the jury) actually hears what she says and that we all don't fall asleep.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:13 PM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan
reply to post by JuniorDisco
 

Grow up and learn not to insult people who have a different opinion on a subject than you do.
No amount of pretend psycho-babble on your part changes the facts. Racist is racist. Hate is hate.

reply to post by JuniorDisco
 

Again ... epic fail on your part. Stop trying to play psychologist .. you don't do it well at all.
Just face the fact that Martin spewed a hateful racist remark. There is no excuse for it.


If Trayvon referring to a stranger as "a crazy-ass cracker" is hateful, are George's comments referring to a stranger as a "#ing punk" and an "asshole" similarly definitive of Zimmerman's character?



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:14 PM
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reply to post by IvanAstikov
 


Well then, it seems we are at an impass. I believe getting your head slammed into the concrete is life threatening. You seem to believe no one has ever died from head trauma. Since we cannot agree on what is reasonable, that must mean one of us is unreasonable.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:15 PM
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Originally posted by dudeman351
They need a translator in the court room. I don't know what language she is speaking. But it sure ain't English.


Yesterday she was all 'in your face angry' and today she's either drugged up or she's playing submissive. She is barely able to be heard today and what she says contradicts herself over and over. She's a pathetic 'witness'.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by MrWendal
Had Zimmerman not been following Trayvon, then he never would have been confronted by Trayvon and he would still be alive. Zimmerman's actions on this night created the chain of events which lead to the death of Trayvon


Which is why the prosecution should have gone for manslaughter. They could have gotten that verdict. They over reached with the murder charge. If the prosecution doesn't win, it will be their own fault for over reaching.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:20 PM
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Originally posted by riffraff
reply to post by IvanAstikov
 


Well then, it seems we are at an impass. I believe getting your head slammed into the concrete is life threatening. You seem to believe no one has ever died from head trauma. Since we cannot agree on what is reasonable, that must mean one of us is unreasonable.


Let me correct that for you. You believe Zimmerman is truthful in his account of how they came into contact, based on nothing but his word, and I believe that if his head had really been slammed against concrete by a determined attacker, George would never have got his hand on his gun.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:21 PM
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reply to post by IvanAstikov
 

Yes. They aren't racial hate. But they are still hate. Hate is hate.
And assuming someone is something to hate based on how they look ... that's ignorant.
(* you said towards a stranger, right?)
I've said it before ... a case of bad blood meeting bad blood. That's my guess at this point.


edit on 6/27/2013 by FlyersFan because: add sentence checking intent



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:27 PM
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Originally posted by Grimpachi
reply to post by dudeman351
 


Well as I said I live very close and I guess I am as ready as I will ever be. Just sighted in the scope on my 7mm magnum last week I could castrate a squirrel at 100 yards. When I moved here 2 decades ago it wasn’t uncommon to see signs that said trespassers will be shot. Anyway I am not really worried about riots here but if it happens they better not come down my street.

In court there is talk that the states star witness just perjured herself. Maybe…. IDK.
No one can really understand what she is saying what a horrible dialect.

Anyway they just took a break for lunch.


You must be pretty close to me then. I live about 10 miles from the court house near Wekiwa Springs. My street is ready too. We had a neighborhood meeting not too long ago. We are locked and loaded.

ETA: The 7mm Rem Mag is one of the sweetest shooting rifles ever

edit on 27-6-2013 by dudeman351 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by IvanAstikov

Originally posted by riffraff
reply to post by IvanAstikov
 


Well then, it seems we are at an impass. I believe getting your head slammed into the concrete is life threatening. You seem to believe no one has ever died from head trauma. Since we cannot agree on what is reasonable, that must mean one of us is unreasonable.


Let me correct that for you. You believe Zimmerman is truthful in his account of how they came into contact, based on nothing but his word, and I believe that if his head had really been slammed against concrete by a determined attacker, George would never have got his hand on his gun.


Wrong again. I don't believe Zimmerman. I think Martin and Zimmerman are/were both shady characters.
My input was only as a proud gun owner who will kill an attacker if my life is in danger. If you don't feel the need to carry, good for you. I, however, choose to enjoy the full American experience and proudly carry. Call me weak, call me a coward, but after my life is threatened you can still call me alive.
edit on 27-6-2013 by riffraff because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by MrWendal
Had Zimmerman not been following Trayvon, then he never would have been confronted by Trayvon and he would still be alive. Zimmerman's actions on this night created the chain of events which lead to the death of Trayvon


Which is why the prosecution should have gone for manslaughter. They could have gotten that verdict. They over reached with the murder charge. If the prosecution doesn't win, it will be their own fault for over reaching.

Do you think it is fair and just that a victim's family and loved ones can be denied closure because of the vagaries of a state law or the incompetence of a prosecution team?



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:37 PM
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Originally posted by IvanAstikov
Do you think it is fair and just that a victim's family and loved ones can be denied closure because of the vagaries of a state law or the incompetence of a prosecution team?

Manslaughter would have been fair. Murder ... not looking like that would be fair at all. The family went along and pushed for the murder charge. If the prosecution can't get the murder charge to stick, then the family can't blame just the prosecution but also has to look at themselves pushing for a murder rap when a manslaughter conviction would have been just and (probably) a slam dunk.

If you think that the trial should be redone with a lesser charge of manslaughter. No.
That is double jeopardy and the laws are in place against that for a good reason.
The state can't keep putting people on trial after trial until they get something to stick.
They have to do their job right the first time. If they fail ... they fail.
OJ walked free. Casey Anthony walked free. It happens.
Double Jeopardy protects the innocent from over zealous prosecutors. It's necessary.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 12:54 PM
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My take is the whole thing hinges on whether Zim can be proved as the aggressor in the actual fight. If that can be proved then the self-defense using deadly force does not work. That in itself may not fit 2nd murder. Anything else cannot convict.

Just following someone around for a bit on one day isn't breaking the law. Attacking someone is.



The crime of Second Degree Murder occurs when a person commits either:

Murder with a Depraved Mind or
Accomplice Felony Murder

Murder with a Depraved Mind

Murder with a Depraved Mind occurs when a person is killed, without any premeditated design, by an act imminently dangerous to another and evincing a depraved mind showing no regard for human life.

The primary distinction between Premeditated First Degree Murder and Second Degree Murder with a Depraved Mind is that First Degree Murder requires a specific and premeditated intent to kill.

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